4 ms·

This makes me almost want to write web code again - compared to things like React and Angular 1-2-3-4-5-6.

by coldcode 8y ago

gramstrong 8y ago
Just curious what intrigues you about this framework in ways that React does not?
- lukejacksonn 8y ago
  Also curious.. Wwat would you miss from React if you only used hyperapp?
- starbuzz 8y ago
  Hyperapp is Elm for the rest of us. I wouldn't compare it to React as they are solving slightly different problems. Hyperapp's state management is built-into the framework. In this way, Hyperapp is a tad more "high-level" (abstract) than React.
  - agentultra 8y ago
    > Hyperapp is Elm for the rest of us. Curious who you think Elm is for?
    - starbuzz 8y ago
      Elm is for anyone. I love Elm. "for the rest of us" is a common English language idiom/phrase. https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/41687/meaning-of-the-phrase-for-the-rest-of-us https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/41687/meaning-of... I know the idiom mostly from For Dummies' books. I'm implying that Elm, while great, is not as user-friendly, intuitive or easy to use as Hyperapp. I'm saying that Hyperapp is deeply inspired by Elm, but also designed with extreme devotion to details, minimalism, and simplicity.
      - agentultra 8y ago
        > I'm implying that Elm, while great, is not as user-friendly, intuitive or easy to use as Hyperapp First, Elm is designed to be user friendly. The designers of the language have put effort into ensuring the error messages are understandable. The messages even include information on how to potentially resolve them! Elm's error messages are much more friendly than most Javascript error messages I've seen. Second, there is nothing intuitive about programming. If there were we wouldn't need years of training to gain proficiency: you could simply give a human being a computer and they would be able to do it in the absence of conscious reasoning. Despite our best efforts and research there has yet to emerge a language that is intuitive. > designed with extreme devotion to details, minimalism, and simplicity I believe Elm is also designed with these concepts in mind. It sounds like it's not the kind of simplicity you're used to and that may be why Hyperapp is _for you_. I interpreted the phrase, for the rest of us, to be a false equivalence between all programmers that do not use Elm and programmers with the same opinions and needs as you. I think I understand your point better now but it would have been clearer if you had left out that phrase and enumerated why it's better for people who need X instead.
matte_black 8y ago
Not sure what your problem with React is, is it the configuration?
- ergo14 8y ago
  React is a ghetto, basicly + vdom has its own size. IMO thing like hyperhtml or lit-html are the way forward - especially with new templating proposals. Not to mention react is not interoperable really with other solutions - I'd expect webcomponents win long term, since they are built into clients.
  - newfoundglory 8y ago
    What does "a ghetto" mean here? None of the definitions I know seem to fit.
    - TooBrokeToBeg 8y ago
      > http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/ruby/rails/is-a-ghetto http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/ruby/rails/is-a-ghetto > https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/02/will-the-push-for-coding-lead-to-technical-ghettos/471300/ https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/02/will-t... > https://jelastic.com/blog/functional-programming-is-a-ghetto/ https://jelastic.com/blog/functional-programming-is-a-ghetto... The concept is that placing a focus on a specific technology is a path to decay (poverty, obsolescence, self-destruction, etc).
  - starbuzz 8y ago
    Hyperapp and Web Components are a great pair.
dereke 8y ago
I agree. The more alternatives to react and angular the better. React has a massive API for what is something essentially quite simple. Personally my favourite "alternative" rendering library is hyperdom. Fast, simple and just gets the job done. https://github.com/featurist/hyperdom/ https://github.com/featurist/hyperdom/

This makes me almost want to write web code again - compared to things like React and Angular 1-2-3-4-5-6.

gramstrong 8y ago

Just curious what intrigues you about this framework in ways that React does not?

lukejacksonn 8y ago
Also curious.. Wwat would you miss from React if you only used hyperapp?
starbuzz 8y ago
Hyperapp is Elm for the rest of us. I wouldn't compare it to React as they are solving slightly different problems. Hyperapp's state management is built-into the framework. In this way, Hyperapp is a tad more "high-level" (abstract) than React.
- agentultra 8y ago
  > Hyperapp is Elm for the rest of us. Curious who you think Elm is for?
  - starbuzz 8y ago
    Elm is for anyone. I love Elm. "for the rest of us" is a common English language idiom/phrase. https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/41687/meaning-of-the-phrase-for-the-rest-of-us https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/41687/meaning-of... I know the idiom mostly from For Dummies' books. I'm implying that Elm, while great, is not as user-friendly, intuitive or easy to use as Hyperapp. I'm saying that Hyperapp is deeply inspired by Elm, but also designed with extreme devotion to details, minimalism, and simplicity.
    - agentultra 8y ago
      > I'm implying that Elm, while great, is not as user-friendly, intuitive or easy to use as Hyperapp First, Elm is designed to be user friendly. The designers of the language have put effort into ensuring the error messages are understandable. The messages even include information on how to potentially resolve them! Elm's error messages are much more friendly than most Javascript error messages I've seen. Second, there is nothing intuitive about programming. If there were we wouldn't need years of training to gain proficiency: you could simply give a human being a computer and they would be able to do it in the absence of conscious reasoning. Despite our best efforts and research there has yet to emerge a language that is intuitive. > designed with extreme devotion to details, minimalism, and simplicity I believe Elm is also designed with these concepts in mind. It sounds like it's not the kind of simplicity you're used to and that may be why Hyperapp is _for you_. I interpreted the phrase, for the rest of us, to be a false equivalence between all programmers that do not use Elm and programmers with the same opinions and needs as you. I think I understand your point better now but it would have been clearer if you had left out that phrase and enumerated why it's better for people who need X instead.

matte_black 8y ago

Not sure what your problem with React is, is it the configuration?

ergo14 8y ago
React is a ghetto, basicly + vdom has its own size. IMO thing like hyperhtml or lit-html are the way forward - especially with new templating proposals. Not to mention react is not interoperable really with other solutions - I'd expect webcomponents win long term, since they are built into clients.
- newfoundglory 8y ago
  What does "a ghetto" mean here? None of the definitions I know seem to fit.
  - TooBrokeToBeg 8y ago
    > http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/ruby/rails/is-a-ghetto http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/ruby/rails/is-a-ghetto > https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/02/will-the-push-for-coding-lead-to-technical-ghettos/471300/ https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/02/will-t... > https://jelastic.com/blog/functional-programming-is-a-ghetto/ https://jelastic.com/blog/functional-programming-is-a-ghetto... The concept is that placing a focus on a specific technology is a path to decay (poverty, obsolescence, self-destruction, etc).
- starbuzz 8y ago
  Hyperapp and Web Components are a great pair.

dereke 8y ago

I agree. The more alternatives to react and angular the better. React has a massive API for what is something essentially quite simple. Personally my favourite "alternative" rendering library is hyperdom. Fast, simple and just gets the job done. https://github.com/featurist/hyperdom/ https://github.com/featurist/hyperdom/