4 ms·

Just a personal risk I'm willing to take. I don't think they'll come for the small fish first.

kodablah 8y ago
Even though that's a personal risk you're willing to take, it might not be one everyone else is willing to. One might question a law that asks everyone to take risks (or pay/pray for peace of mind).
- Tomte 8y ago
  There are many other laws where you‘re taking risks. Maybe you‘re violating some US securities statute? Maybe you‘re violating some German accounting rule? Why haven‘t all those doomsayers closed down their businesses long before the GDPR?
  - kodablah 8y ago
    I mean, technically I'm taking a risk when I step out of my house every day. So why ever walk? There are varying degrees to which people see laws as affecting them. Small business tech owners, when a law says they have work to do, are going to feel affected. If there was a securities or accounting law that felt similarly overreaching one could expect a similar reaction. This is especially true if there is an alternative (locking out markets) that is easier. It's not helpful to try and compare the situations. It's also not fair to consider people weighing the costs of these laws as doomsayers. They aren't closing down their business, they're just restricting it to more business-friendly environments in their view.
    - Tomte 8y ago
      There is hardly anything more overreaching than US tax, securities and accounting law. People in other parts of the world have gotten used to that. As a current example, see US threats re: European business with Iran. Even if the GDPR were overreaching (and I vigorously dispute that notion), it would simply be a taste of America‘s own medicine.
greglindahl 8y ago
You've made many concrete, general statements in this discussion which turn out to be relevant to your personal situation and your personal appetite for risk. Maybe that's not an effective way of holding a conversation about the general issues around the GDPR?
- mnkypete 8y ago
  I'm not sure what else I should reply to something like your comment before tbh. Neither can I predict the future, nor am I a lawyer. I'm just posting about my opinion, which I got by gathering information online and from consulting with a lawyer. I've stated the conclusion I've come to, based on this information and yes, I believe that to be correct (or as correct as one can be about a law with no reference cases in court yet). I was just pointing out, that when a lawyer says "probably", he usually has a good reason to do so. And it's my strong belief that the reference cases in court will not be fought by small companies, because they rarely are.. There is just not enough money to make fit the effort you need to put in winning the first case. Before there is not one single case, I don't think it's necessary to panic and shut everyone out. You don't need to believe me or agree with me, but reducing this to "my personal appetite for risk" is really weird.
  - greglindahl 8y ago
    You stated your extremely general conclusions, and only later mentioned that they were relevant to your personal business. And in this particular sub-thread, you made a very general statement about risk, again without qualifying it at all. And you only mentioned the lawyer after you were challenged about a general statement. Maybe you have huge assumptions that people reading what you say will add all kinds of limitations to what you say? I don't. It leads to terrible discussions, like this one.
    - mnkypete 8y ago
      I'm sorry for making too generic statements, I'm not trying to have a bad discussion, really. Regarding the personal risk comment, I could've been more clear: From what I got, no lawyer can give you a guarantee at the moment, that what he says is actually what will happen. So in the end you'll have to take action based on recommendations, and take a risk - or, as the op, shut out all European users completely. My personal risk is continuing to do business in the EU, even with this uncertainty. You couldn't have guessed all that from my earlier comment, so I agree it was bad.. I'll try to do better.
zerostar07 8y ago
Regarding that, i wonder how DPAs will handle cases. I can totally think of small businesses or professionals like doctors reporting each other to the DPA. Can DPAs easily dismiss complaints?

Even though that's a personal risk you're willing to take, it might not be one everyone else is willing to. One might question a law that asks everyone to take risks (or pay/pray for peace of mind).

Tomte 8y ago
There are many other laws where you‘re taking risks. Maybe you‘re violating some US securities statute? Maybe you‘re violating some German accounting rule? Why haven‘t all those doomsayers closed down their businesses long before the GDPR?
- kodablah 8y ago
  I mean, technically I'm taking a risk when I step out of my house every day. So why ever walk? There are varying degrees to which people see laws as affecting them. Small business tech owners, when a law says they have work to do, are going to feel affected. If there was a securities or accounting law that felt similarly overreaching one could expect a similar reaction. This is especially true if there is an alternative (locking out markets) that is easier. It's not helpful to try and compare the situations. It's also not fair to consider people weighing the costs of these laws as doomsayers. They aren't closing down their business, they're just restricting it to more business-friendly environments in their view.
  - Tomte 8y ago
    There is hardly anything more overreaching than US tax, securities and accounting law. People in other parts of the world have gotten used to that. As a current example, see US threats re: European business with Iran. Even if the GDPR were overreaching (and I vigorously dispute that notion), it would simply be a taste of America‘s own medicine.

greglindahl 8y ago

You've made many concrete, general statements in this discussion which turn out to be relevant to your personal situation and your personal appetite for risk. Maybe that's not an effective way of holding a conversation about the general issues around the GDPR?

mnkypete 8y ago
I'm not sure what else I should reply to something like your comment before tbh. Neither can I predict the future, nor am I a lawyer. I'm just posting about my opinion, which I got by gathering information online and from consulting with a lawyer. I've stated the conclusion I've come to, based on this information and yes, I believe that to be correct (or as correct as one can be about a law with no reference cases in court yet). I was just pointing out, that when a lawyer says "probably", he usually has a good reason to do so. And it's my strong belief that the reference cases in court will not be fought by small companies, because they rarely are.. There is just not enough money to make fit the effort you need to put in winning the first case. Before there is not one single case, I don't think it's necessary to panic and shut everyone out. You don't need to believe me or agree with me, but reducing this to "my personal appetite for risk" is really weird.
- greglindahl 8y ago
  You stated your extremely general conclusions, and only later mentioned that they were relevant to your personal business. And in this particular sub-thread, you made a very general statement about risk, again without qualifying it at all. And you only mentioned the lawyer after you were challenged about a general statement. Maybe you have huge assumptions that people reading what you say will add all kinds of limitations to what you say? I don't. It leads to terrible discussions, like this one.
  - mnkypete 8y ago
    I'm sorry for making too generic statements, I'm not trying to have a bad discussion, really. Regarding the personal risk comment, I could've been more clear: From what I got, no lawyer can give you a guarantee at the moment, that what he says is actually what will happen. So in the end you'll have to take action based on recommendations, and take a risk - or, as the op, shut out all European users completely. My personal risk is continuing to do business in the EU, even with this uncertainty. You couldn't have guessed all that from my earlier comment, so I agree it was bad.. I'll try to do better.

zerostar07 8y ago

Regarding that, i wonder how DPAs will handle cases. I can totally think of small businesses or professionals like doctors reporting each other to the DPA. Can DPAs easily dismiss complaints?