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- Signed, someone who wishes they didn't dismiss Bitcoin the first time they heard about it. Blockchain is a brilliant and revolutionary technology. Is cryptoc

- Signed, someone who wishes they didn't dismiss Bitcoin the first time they heard about it. Blockchain is a brilliant and revolutionary technology. Is cryptocurrency the killer app? Maybe, but in any case it's financing the development of decentralized projects which may solve difficult problems in the realm of self organizing machines, artificial intelligence, mesh networks, trustless systems, transparency, etc. It gets old seeing educated people on HN trying to frame anything-cryptocurrency in the most negative light possible without productive discussion, most often out of jealousy and bitterness about not partaking in the profits enjoyed by those who saw potential earlier and bought some.

hudon 8y ago
> - Signed, someone who wishes they didn't dismiss Bitcoin the first time they heard about it. Ugh, that is so presumptuous. I've been in Bitcoin since the "Bitcoin 0.3" announcement on Slashdot. I was an engineer at Coinbase. I'm on 2 Bitcoin-related patents. I was reading about Ethereum when people were still learning about Bitcoin. I've tried really hard to see what can be done with cryptocurrencies and I've arrived at different conclusions than you have. I think you may need to ask yourself harder questions.
- lend000 8y ago
  I then find it difficult to believe that you cannot think of productive applications of cryptocurrencies. As someone who researches self organizing systems, especially in the network space, I have seen numerous applications of mesh network organization based on a blockchain-like decentralized ledger that adds a new dimension after well over a decade long plateau in development. Semi-centralized blockchains utilizing proof-of-stake and other methods seem to be valuable ways to add transparency to certain government functions (such as voting), publishing trade records, and clearing transactions over an ACH-like network (which is currently monitored manually by the Fed and is a growing vulnerability in the global financial network). To dismiss the whole space is to lack vision, or perhaps to be dejected about not being in the financial position you could have been in given the early opportunity.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - hudon 8y ago
    - Can you show me one of these blockchain-based mesh networks in production? How many users do they have? - As for voting and trade records, how do you deal with the fact that developers can fork the chain and invalidate past transactions like they did with Bitcoin in 2010 and 2013, or like they did with Ethereum in 2016? Why do you trust the developers more than your own government? And if you live in an oppressive regime, what makes you think your government will allow your blockchain to be used for voting? - If your government wants transparency, why don't they simply expose a read-only API to their database?
    - woah 8y ago
      I'm working on a blockchain-based mesh project. We currently have around 6 users on a test network in Oregon, but the product isn't completely done yet and no real payments work yet. Our goal is to create a system where individuals and businesses can participate in a decentralized ISP with the routers "peering" automatically and routing along the cheapest, best paths in the network. What blockchain gives us is a very low overhead payment system (payment channels), along with decentralized management of IP addresses and networks. This could all in principle be managed by a centralized server but blockchain gives our systems a more-or-less neutral venue in which people can interact with predetermined rules, whereas a centralized server would put us in the position of arbiter of all interactions on the system.
      - hudon 8y ago
        Do you have a website with more information? On your blockchain, if a new consensus rule is being disputed or if a bug in the consensus rules causes a fork, who has the final say, the developers or the miners?
        woah 8y ago
        http://altheamesh.com http://altheamesh.com We will likely use Cosmos which uses proof of stake validators instead of miners although we are prototyping on Ethereum. In any case, the miners/validators would decide, as they always have and always will. If there was a big divide between users and validators, the users could choose to leave and use a different fork (although they would have to modify their router firmware). The only power that the developers have is thought leadership, and the ability to claim that something is an "official" binary. This is also how the Ethereum DAO hardfork went down.

hudon 8y ago

> - Signed, someone who wishes they didn't dismiss Bitcoin the first time they heard about it. Ugh, that is so presumptuous. I've been in Bitcoin since the "Bitcoin 0.3" announcement on Slashdot. I was an engineer at Coinbase. I'm on 2 Bitcoin-related patents. I was reading about Ethereum when people were still learning about Bitcoin. I've tried really hard to see what can be done with cryptocurrencies and I've arrived at different conclusions than you have. I think you may need to ask yourself harder questions.

lend000 8y ago
I then find it difficult to believe that you cannot think of productive applications of cryptocurrencies. As someone who researches self organizing systems, especially in the network space, I have seen numerous applications of mesh network organization based on a blockchain-like decentralized ledger that adds a new dimension after well over a decade long plateau in development. Semi-centralized blockchains utilizing proof-of-stake and other methods seem to be valuable ways to add transparency to certain government functions (such as voting), publishing trade records, and clearing transactions over an ACH-like network (which is currently monitored manually by the Fed and is a growing vulnerability in the global financial network). To dismiss the whole space is to lack vision, or perhaps to be dejected about not being in the financial position you could have been in given the early opportunity.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- hudon 8y ago
  - Can you show me one of these blockchain-based mesh networks in production? How many users do they have? - As for voting and trade records, how do you deal with the fact that developers can fork the chain and invalidate past transactions like they did with Bitcoin in 2010 and 2013, or like they did with Ethereum in 2016? Why do you trust the developers more than your own government? And if you live in an oppressive regime, what makes you think your government will allow your blockchain to be used for voting? - If your government wants transparency, why don't they simply expose a read-only API to their database?
  - woah 8y ago
    I'm working on a blockchain-based mesh project. We currently have around 6 users on a test network in Oregon, but the product isn't completely done yet and no real payments work yet. Our goal is to create a system where individuals and businesses can participate in a decentralized ISP with the routers "peering" automatically and routing along the cheapest, best paths in the network. What blockchain gives us is a very low overhead payment system (payment channels), along with decentralized management of IP addresses and networks. This could all in principle be managed by a centralized server but blockchain gives our systems a more-or-less neutral venue in which people can interact with predetermined rules, whereas a centralized server would put us in the position of arbiter of all interactions on the system.
    - hudon 8y ago
      Do you have a website with more information? On your blockchain, if a new consensus rule is being disputed or if a bug in the consensus rules causes a fork, who has the final say, the developers or the miners?
      - woah 8y ago
        http://altheamesh.com http://altheamesh.com We will likely use Cosmos which uses proof of stake validators instead of miners although we are prototyping on Ethereum. In any case, the miners/validators would decide, as they always have and always will. If there was a big divide between users and validators, the users could choose to leave and use a different fork (although they would have to modify their router firmware). The only power that the developers have is thought leadership, and the ability to claim that something is an "official" binary. This is also how the Ethereum DAO hardfork went down.