6 ms·

It's not currently cool to like Richard Stallman because he has opinions that run contrary to Silicon Valley.

by jcoffland 8y ago

ronsor 8y ago
Stallman is generally not a very... tactful person.
- seba_dos1 8y ago
  That's right, it might even hurt his mission, but it doesn't make him less right.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - astrodust 8y ago
    Was he right about abortion jokes? David Bowie made predictions far more profound than Stallman, and they came from a place of genuine concern, not tin-foil hattery of the GNU variety: https://www.theverge.com/2016/1/11/10753158/david-bowie-internet-future-interview https://www.theverge.com/2016/1/11/10753158/david-bowie-inte... I'd rather have people that cared and were on the right path, picking the right battles, than assholes who are technically correct but their observations are ultimately irrelevant to the larger fight.
    - M_Bakhtiari 8y ago
      I don't get the abortion joke debacle. It was blatantly pro-abortion, yet it seems like it's only the pro-abortion people that are upset about it.
      - JdeBP 8y ago
        That's because you erroneously think that the conflict was about abortion. It was actually about whether user reference manuals should properly contain jokes about such highly politically charged topics.
kiriakasis 8y ago
As an outside observer it looks like GNU is conducting an ideological battle that is decreasing in public relevance in the years and so, now, it looks like they are the one not being good neighbours.
- computerfriend 8y ago
  I'm not sure how anyone can honestly think that the ideological battle is decreasing in public relevance. It is massively more relevant now.
- Digital-Citizen 8y ago
  It wouldn't have taken much more time for you to back your point with examples so we'd have some idea of what you're talking about. Please also explain the ideology of how proprietary software is not worth fighting with a practical implementation and ethical discussion. Most of the time when people object to GNU or rms they fail to convey that they understand what software freedom is or how continually relevant software freedom is today. I'd bet that the majority of threads on these (overwhelmingly corporate) repeater sites are easily handled by stressing how important a user's software freedom is. Every DRM, proprietary software (Windows ignores user settings, this new device from $VENDOR spies on its users, etc.) is easily dismissed by getting into the same discussion about how software freedom would allow the user to alter the software, protect their privacy, treat their friends and neighbors better by sharing improved versions of the software, inspect and modify the software (or have someone they trust do it for them), and run the programs when they want (instead of losing access when a proprietor feels like ending "support"). Snowden readily credits free software for his success in leaking sensitive NSA documents to us all (docs which still make media stories years later). Three cheers for software freedom, rms, and Snowden! Posts like the parent post tell me sites like these are the thing losing relevance by showing how ineffective public moderation is and how unacceptable it is to dare to say something not echoed in corporate tech media.
astrodust 8y ago
It's because he's a dick, and not in the good way. It's not about his opinions, it's about his ineffective and misguided leadership. Why is GNU still fighting the same battles from thirty years ago when new ones have emerged that they're not even paying attention to? GNU is becoming the PETA of software, and it's not a good look.
- t0nt0n 8y ago
  What new battles have emerged that GNU and FSF are not paying attention to? Also, GNU is not RMS, and RMS is not GNU.
  - ChristianBundy 8y ago
    The FSF is (or seems to be) an extension of RMS, and the same argument could be made for GNU[0]. [0]: https://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/753646/a6ebb50040c5862c/ https://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/753646/a6ebb50040c5862c/
  - astrodust 8y ago
    While they were harassing Linksys about GPL the whole IoT thing happened and now we're living in a world full of trashy Linux-based devices that are a hazard to society. Sure, you can get the source code to your internet-based webcam, but because it can't be easily patched, it can also be hijacked by a couple of high-school kids in Alaska so they can sabotage their Minecraft server hosting competitors. So good job. As long as RMS is such a prominent figure the GNU/FSF organization there's no separation.
    - elago 8y ago
      "the whole IoT thing" was ever Stallman's responsibility to stop in the first place? he wants to champion free software, not every just cause under the sun. IoT devices shipping with insecure configurations is a "failure" of an infosec champion/thought-leader to step up and save us. On the free software front, RMS contribution are mind blowing to me. I'd be proud if I can ever contribute a fraction of what he did.

It's not currently cool to like Richard Stallman because he has opinions that run contrary to Silicon Valley.

ronsor 8y ago

Stallman is generally not a very... tactful person.

seba_dos1 8y ago
That's right, it might even hurt his mission, but it doesn't make him less right.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- astrodust 8y ago
  Was he right about abortion jokes? David Bowie made predictions far more profound than Stallman, and they came from a place of genuine concern, not tin-foil hattery of the GNU variety: https://www.theverge.com/2016/1/11/10753158/david-bowie-internet-future-interview https://www.theverge.com/2016/1/11/10753158/david-bowie-inte... I'd rather have people that cared and were on the right path, picking the right battles, than assholes who are technically correct but their observations are ultimately irrelevant to the larger fight.
  - M_Bakhtiari 8y ago
    I don't get the abortion joke debacle. It was blatantly pro-abortion, yet it seems like it's only the pro-abortion people that are upset about it.
    - JdeBP 8y ago
      That's because you erroneously think that the conflict was about abortion. It was actually about whether user reference manuals should properly contain jokes about such highly politically charged topics.

kiriakasis 8y ago

As an outside observer it looks like GNU is conducting an ideological battle that is decreasing in public relevance in the years and so, now, it looks like they are the one not being good neighbours.

computerfriend 8y ago
I'm not sure how anyone can honestly think that the ideological battle is decreasing in public relevance. It is massively more relevant now.
Digital-Citizen 8y ago
It wouldn't have taken much more time for you to back your point with examples so we'd have some idea of what you're talking about. Please also explain the ideology of how proprietary software is not worth fighting with a practical implementation and ethical discussion. Most of the time when people object to GNU or rms they fail to convey that they understand what software freedom is or how continually relevant software freedom is today. I'd bet that the majority of threads on these (overwhelmingly corporate) repeater sites are easily handled by stressing how important a user's software freedom is. Every DRM, proprietary software (Windows ignores user settings, this new device from $VENDOR spies on its users, etc.) is easily dismissed by getting into the same discussion about how software freedom would allow the user to alter the software, protect their privacy, treat their friends and neighbors better by sharing improved versions of the software, inspect and modify the software (or have someone they trust do it for them), and run the programs when they want (instead of losing access when a proprietor feels like ending "support"). Snowden readily credits free software for his success in leaking sensitive NSA documents to us all (docs which still make media stories years later). Three cheers for software freedom, rms, and Snowden! Posts like the parent post tell me sites like these are the thing losing relevance by showing how ineffective public moderation is and how unacceptable it is to dare to say something not echoed in corporate tech media.

astrodust 8y ago

It's because he's a dick, and not in the good way. It's not about his opinions, it's about his ineffective and misguided leadership. Why is GNU still fighting the same battles from thirty years ago when new ones have emerged that they're not even paying attention to? GNU is becoming the PETA of software, and it's not a good look.

t0nt0n 8y ago
What new battles have emerged that GNU and FSF are not paying attention to? Also, GNU is not RMS, and RMS is not GNU.
- ChristianBundy 8y ago
  The FSF is (or seems to be) an extension of RMS, and the same argument could be made for GNU[0]. [0]: https://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/753646/a6ebb50040c5862c/ https://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/753646/a6ebb50040c5862c/
- astrodust 8y ago
  While they were harassing Linksys about GPL the whole IoT thing happened and now we're living in a world full of trashy Linux-based devices that are a hazard to society. Sure, you can get the source code to your internet-based webcam, but because it can't be easily patched, it can also be hijacked by a couple of high-school kids in Alaska so they can sabotage their Minecraft server hosting competitors. So good job. As long as RMS is such a prominent figure the GNU/FSF organization there's no separation.
  - elago 8y ago
    "the whole IoT thing" was ever Stallman's responsibility to stop in the first place? he wants to champion free software, not every just cause under the sun. IoT devices shipping with insecure configurations is a "failure" of an infosec champion/thought-leader to step up and save us. On the free software front, RMS contribution are mind blowing to me. I'd be proud if I can ever contribute a fraction of what he did.