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Interesting way to put the blame on someone exposing the crimes, instead of those actually doing the crimes.

revscat 8y ago
Your rush to judgement here is unwarranted. OP said nothing about whether what Snowden did was good or bad, just that it was a factor in the ISO's decision.
- SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
  Still off. The NSA’s behaviours made this decision happen. Snowden exposing those behaviours isn’t really relavent.
  - baby 8y ago
    True. Snowden made it happen :)
  - acct1771 8y ago
    Unless you're trying to thank him.
  - unit91 8y ago
    You're arguing over proximate vs. ultimate causes, when both are causes. This was proximately caused by Snowden disclosing what the NSA was doing. It was ultimately caused by NSA monitoring major swaths of the population. ETA: decent summary: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proximate_and_ultimate_causation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proximate_and_ultimate_causati...
    - trisimix 8y ago
      Thanks for thatuseful distinction
    - SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
      I agree with other guy, that is a useful distinction and I didn’t know that’s what it was called. I’ll still argue for ultimate cause because if it wasn’t Snowden it seems likely would have been someone else. I’m a firm believer in don’t shoot the messenger, even if they are flawed.
  - jdironman 8y ago
    Snowden helped bring those behaviors to light by being someone people could 'relate' to. Thus, calling attention to past, present, and future actions by certain agencies.
OscarCunningham 8y ago
The parent comment can only be read as assigning blame if you think that ISO rejecting the NSA's proposal is a bad thing. I'd say it's a good thing since we know that the NSA's proposals are sometimes backdoored.
- saagarjha 8y ago
  Irrespective of the proposal being backdoored, it was clear that the NSA refused to follow standard procedure by providing the necessary supporting materials for their proposal, so it's not difficult to see why the ISO rejected the proposal.
trumped 8y ago
"Snowden causing this" is not a bad thing, it's a good thing. Personally, I like to be blamed for good things...

Your rush to judgement here is unwarranted. OP said nothing about whether what Snowden did was good or bad, just that it was a factor in the ISO's decision.

SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
Still off. The NSA’s behaviours made this decision happen. Snowden exposing those behaviours isn’t really relavent.
- baby 8y ago
  True. Snowden made it happen :)
- acct1771 8y ago
  Unless you're trying to thank him.
- unit91 8y ago
  You're arguing over proximate vs. ultimate causes, when both are causes. This was proximately caused by Snowden disclosing what the NSA was doing. It was ultimately caused by NSA monitoring major swaths of the population. ETA: decent summary: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proximate_and_ultimate_causation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proximate_and_ultimate_causati...
  - trisimix 8y ago
    Thanks for thatuseful distinction
  - SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
    I agree with other guy, that is a useful distinction and I didn’t know that’s what it was called. I’ll still argue for ultimate cause because if it wasn’t Snowden it seems likely would have been someone else. I’m a firm believer in don’t shoot the messenger, even if they are flawed.
- jdironman 8y ago
  Snowden helped bring those behaviors to light by being someone people could 'relate' to. Thus, calling attention to past, present, and future actions by certain agencies.

OscarCunningham 8y ago

The parent comment can only be read as assigning blame if you think that ISO rejecting the NSA's proposal is a bad thing. I'd say it's a good thing since we know that the NSA's proposals are sometimes backdoored.

saagarjha 8y ago
Irrespective of the proposal being backdoored, it was clear that the NSA refused to follow standard procedure by providing the necessary supporting materials for their proposal, so it's not difficult to see why the ISO rejected the proposal.

trumped 8y ago

"Snowden causing this" is not a bad thing, it's a good thing. Personally, I like to be blamed for good things...