8 ms·

DSLs for Ethereum Contracts

76 points by MichaelBurge 8y ago

deleted 8y ago
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- deleted 8y ago
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Zelphyr 8y ago
I'm looking forward to the Red[1] C3 project[2]. Red is a powerful language. I think they stand a chance to do some interesting things in the blockchain space. 1: https://www.red-lang.org https://www.red-lang.org 2: https://ico.red-lang.org/RED-whitepaper.pdf https://ico.red-lang.org/RED-whitepaper.pdf
Drdrdrq 8y ago
Just having an actually sane language (as opposed to Solidity) would do wonders. Does anyone here use Viper or similar in production?
- pavel_lishin 8y ago
  I've only recently gotten into the cryptocurrency scene - what about Solidity feels less sane?
  - jarins 8y ago
    They may have changed it in recent versions, but for a long while, functions were public by default (i.e. anyone can call them). Defaulting to open is a huge security flaw and the reason behind the Parity bug https://blog.comae.io/the-280m-ethereums-bug-f28e5de43513 https://blog.comae.io/the-280m-ethereums-bug-f28e5de43513
- CryptoPunk 8y ago
  Embark now supports both Vyper and Bamboo: https://embark.status.im/news/2018/05/03/embark-3-0-released/ https://embark.status.im/news/2018/05/03/embark-3-0-released...
- d357r0y3r 8y ago
  Solidity as a language is not that bad. It wouldn't be my first choice but it wouldn't be my last. Most of the challenges are not at the language level, they're at the EVM level. Any languages on top of the EVM are hamstrung by the EVMs limitations. If it were as easy as "just throw Rust/Go/Java on top of it", that would have already been done.
  - AlexCoventry 8y ago
    What do you see as the biggest flaws in the EVM as such? I think a lot of the difficulty is that it's such a novel runtime environment, and it's going to take a few design/failure iterations to come up with a programming model which fits it.
    - sanxiyn 8y ago
      The biggest flaw: EVM allows integer overflow. This has been responsible for many hacks. (aka somehow withdraw 1 token from 0 token account, now you have LOTS token!) I can't even imagine what they were thinking...
      - AlexCoventry 8y ago
        You're right, that's a big one.
viach 8y ago
Not related to Ethereum, but I've done some small prototyping of how smart contracts without side effects could be implemented in JavaScript and all compiling to it languages, even the pure functional ones https://github.com/slavasn/bloqly https://github.com/slavasn/bloqly
buildbuildbuild 8y ago
Laughed out loud at the language Pyramid being a Scheme. Perhaps not the best choice for layman marketing, but you got me. https://www.michaelburge.us/2017/11/28/write-your-next-ethereum-contract-in-pyramid-scheme.html https://www.michaelburge.us/2017/11/28/write-your-next-ether...
- mrguyorama 8y ago
  I assumed that it was intentional
CrunchyJams 8y ago
There's also AxLang. It's a core DSL based on Scala. Enables formal verification. Live demo on the public ETH mainnet: https://medium.com/axoni/axlang-formally-verifiable-smart-contracts-for-the-ethereum-ecosystem-6201203be4e8 https://medium.com/axoni/axlang-formally-verifiable-smart-co...
- unboxed_type 8y ago
  Despite being based on semi-functional programming language Scala, I found no evidence that the language AxLang has anything to do with formal verification. I may be wrong, but what I see now is lots of promises without any details.
  - CrunchyJams 8y ago
    How do you mean? There are examples of formal verification working in the video. The resulting compiled smart contracts are on the live Ethereum blockchain.

76 points by MichaelBurge 8y ago

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

Zelphyr 8y ago

I'm looking forward to the Red[1] C3 project[2]. Red is a powerful language. I think they stand a chance to do some interesting things in the blockchain space. 1: https://www.red-lang.org https://www.red-lang.org 2: https://ico.red-lang.org/RED-whitepaper.pdf https://ico.red-lang.org/RED-whitepaper.pdf

Drdrdrq 8y ago

Just having an actually sane language (as opposed to Solidity) would do wonders. Does anyone here use Viper or similar in production?

pavel_lishin 8y ago
I've only recently gotten into the cryptocurrency scene - what about Solidity feels less sane?
- jarins 8y ago
  They may have changed it in recent versions, but for a long while, functions were public by default (i.e. anyone can call them). Defaulting to open is a huge security flaw and the reason behind the Parity bug https://blog.comae.io/the-280m-ethereums-bug-f28e5de43513 https://blog.comae.io/the-280m-ethereums-bug-f28e5de43513
CryptoPunk 8y ago
Embark now supports both Vyper and Bamboo: https://embark.status.im/news/2018/05/03/embark-3-0-released/ https://embark.status.im/news/2018/05/03/embark-3-0-released...
d357r0y3r 8y ago
Solidity as a language is not that bad. It wouldn't be my first choice but it wouldn't be my last. Most of the challenges are not at the language level, they're at the EVM level. Any languages on top of the EVM are hamstrung by the EVMs limitations. If it were as easy as "just throw Rust/Go/Java on top of it", that would have already been done.
- AlexCoventry 8y ago
  What do you see as the biggest flaws in the EVM as such? I think a lot of the difficulty is that it's such a novel runtime environment, and it's going to take a few design/failure iterations to come up with a programming model which fits it.
  - sanxiyn 8y ago
    The biggest flaw: EVM allows integer overflow. This has been responsible for many hacks. (aka somehow withdraw 1 token from 0 token account, now you have LOTS token!) I can't even imagine what they were thinking...
    - AlexCoventry 8y ago
      You're right, that's a big one.

viach 8y ago

Not related to Ethereum, but I've done some small prototyping of how smart contracts without side effects could be implemented in JavaScript and all compiling to it languages, even the pure functional ones https://github.com/slavasn/bloqly https://github.com/slavasn/bloqly

buildbuildbuild 8y ago

Laughed out loud at the language Pyramid being a Scheme. Perhaps not the best choice for layman marketing, but you got me. https://www.michaelburge.us/2017/11/28/write-your-next-ethereum-contract-in-pyramid-scheme.html https://www.michaelburge.us/2017/11/28/write-your-next-ether...

mrguyorama 8y ago
I assumed that it was intentional

CrunchyJams 8y ago

There's also AxLang. It's a core DSL based on Scala. Enables formal verification. Live demo on the public ETH mainnet: https://medium.com/axoni/axlang-formally-verifiable-smart-contracts-for-the-ethereum-ecosystem-6201203be4e8 https://medium.com/axoni/axlang-formally-verifiable-smart-co...

unboxed_type 8y ago
Despite being based on semi-functional programming language Scala, I found no evidence that the language AxLang has anything to do with formal verification. I may be wrong, but what I see now is lots of promises without any details.
- CrunchyJams 8y ago
  How do you mean? There are examples of formal verification working in the video. The resulting compiled smart contracts are on the live Ethereum blockchain.