4 ms·

(Freelance) Math guy (likes Cryptography) needs work

6 points by devnonymous 8y ago

jwilbs 8y ago
May wanna drop the following: “But also one of my favorite activities is to spend some wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love. ” Not only is it completely unrelated to a job hunt, but doesn’t come off very tastefully. Good luck!
- Jugurtha 8y ago
  Why? Has love become a bad thing?
  - borplk 8y ago
    It's not professional and written badly. Really? you need someone to write an elaborate explanation about it?
    - Jugurtha 8y ago
      Yes, let's elaborate. Would it be more "professional" to replace "women" in the sentence by "guitars" to make it: >But also one of my favorite activities is to spend some wonderful hours with wonderful guitars to give them all my love. Does that make it more "professional", and if so why? I see people talking about their favorite activities looking for a job all the time, and the prose written to describe their love for backpacking, rock climbing, chess, and puppies surely is unprofessional, right?
      - borplk 8y ago
        > one of my favorite activities is to spend some wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love. "spend wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love" would be interpreted by many as some variation of "I'm a horny creep who loves tits". "hey what is this guy's favorite activity?" "he likes to give all his love to wonderful women during some wonderful hours, not some of it, ALL his love." "spend wonderful hours" is vague and doesn't refer to a specific activity (as opposed to "rock climbing" or "tennis"). "wonderful women" is also broad and implies "many" (as opposed to "my wife", "my two amazing sisters", "my best friend Lisa"). also mentioning "women" specifically is not a great idea (as opposed to just saying "people" or "friends") it makes it sound like them being women is of some special importance and preference. "to give them all my love" ... do I have to explain this too? it sounds unnecessarily "dirty". So an unforgiving interpretation of it leans towards "yum I love women and I love lots of em". So speaking of professional, it's best to leave something like this out. It's written in a way that is screaming "SKIP ME SKIP ME SKIP ME". A better version would be something along the lines of, "one of my favorite activities is playing tennis with my friends." There are already enough random arbitrary things that employers may pick on to skip on a candidate as it is. Especially in this climate where saying "hi" to the wrong person at the wrong time can easily score you a "sexual harassment complaint". If someone is looking for a job they should work to minimise those not to add on to it by saying "I like to spend wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love".
        Jugurtha 8y ago
        >would be interpreted by many as some variation of "I'm a horny creep who loves tits". Which mental sinuosities must one cross to get from OP's statement to "horny creep who loves tits". Do you think loving tits makes one a horny creep? Is it the creepiness that is not okay, or the horniness? Are non horny creeps okay? What do you have against tits? Is that not sexist? Is that not called projection or some other similar word? These are all valid questions given that to get from OP's statement to your thought would be quite a feat, even for a Tolkien's character. >"wonderful women" is also broad and implies "many" (as opposed to "my wife", "my two amazing sisters", "my best friend Lisa"). >So an unforgiving interpretation of it leans towards "yum I love women and I love lots of em". And whether it's his sisters or his friend Lisa our business how exactly? Would it be okay if it were his sisters? Why would it be okay for these women to be his sisters/wife? Do you have something against poly people? Would you go as to discriminate against them? If so, who else would you discriminate against because they do not conform to your view on who it is okay to spend hours and give love to and who is not good enough for love? >Especially in this climate where saying "hi" to the wrong person at the wrong time can easily score you a "sexual harassment complaint". Do you not think that the kind of interpretations and projections above exacerbate that climate? And if that "climate" were a company, why would anyone want to spend the tiniest amount of time in that kind of environment, except to avoid starvation. >If someone is looking for a job they should work to minimise those not to add on to it by saying "I like to spend wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love". If someone is about to starve, maybe. If not, it's a waste of life to spend most of one's waking hours with people who are like that.
        borplk 8y ago
        You are over-analysing and over-complicating something quite simple. None of what I described is necessarily my belief or opinion I just described how that sentence can work against a job candidate. There will be tens of resumes piled up in front of someone who is tired and overworked and they don't have the time or interest to dig into your deep philosophy about the meaning of the sentence. When there are lots of other options in front of them that don't have the same "problems" they are going to pick those out of caution. It's asking for a misunderstanding and asking to be skipped/rejected. You may lose great opportunities because the HR person filtered you out on step 0 because you were so insistent to announce your interest in giving all your love to wonderful women.
      - chrisbennet 8y ago
        You can “go with your gut” and include that in your information to potential employers and wonder why you can’t find work OR you can alter your approach given the HN advice and increase your chances. Here are a couple of reasons to remove that “hobby” from you job pitch: - It makes you seem like you like to give “all your love” to multiple women - at the same time. Now this may be acceptable to some but, generally speaking, this comes off as duplicitous since it might be assumed that the women don’t know this since most women would not agree to such a relationship. While this may not be your intent, it is a reasonable interpretation. - If I was an employer, the fact that your wrote this would make you seem like someone who might “hit” on my female employees. The last thing I need to hire someone who might make my workplace “toxic”. If you have some good friends who are better at “this human stuff”, ask them to look over your resume/CV/cover letters and help you. This is great advice for anyone really. Good luck with your job search!
        Jugurtha 8y ago
        Where to begin.. First, I'm debating not because I lack perception of the possible ways OP's content may be interpreted, but because I am questioning the reasons of the ways it may be interpreted. There's a nuance that is not so hard to grasp. > most women would not agree to such a relationship. And you think that because you believe people treat all people the same? Meaning just because it is your experience that women would not agree to such a relationship means that they do not agree with such a relationship period? Did it occur to you that they may not be "agreeing" to such a relationship with you, i.e: that you are a variable that must be controlled in an experiment. Did it also occur to you that they may not be agreeing to such a relationship because you're the kind of person who thinks they may not? Did you think that such a thing may only be something you believe to be true, have you tried to prove yourself wrong and actually be in that kind of relationship? And if you did and failed to be in such relationships, is it enough to generalize and say that it's the women who do not agree to these relationships (and taking yourself out of the equation) or does it have something to do with you? Let me drive the point home: your whole argument is saying that you should separate your "private" persona from your "professional" persona. Which means you do not behave the same with your buddies as you do with your coworkers/employer.. Which means there are whole swaths of your personality that are unknown from your colleagues. Does the fact that some aspects of your personality are unknown to your colleagues mean that these aspect do not exist or do they just not exist in the same space and time as your colleagues? Does women willingness to be in such relationship not exist at all just because it does not exist within your time and space? Isn't this what someone who's good at "human stuff" should be aware of, or is it enough to have one's biases in check? Do you think the barely veiled condescension and snark in your penultimate sentence helps people expose their true self to you knowing they might be so negatively judged, do you not think it reinforces your beliefs about what "most" people would and would not agree to?
      - speedplane 8y ago
        Are you really equating women (i.e., humans), with guitars?
        Jugurtha 8y ago
        > Are you really equating women (i.e., humans), with guitars? Is this really the best you can do?

6 points by devnonymous 8y ago

May wanna drop the following: “But also one of my favorite activities is to spend some wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love. ” Not only is it completely unrelated to a job hunt, but doesn’t come off very tastefully. Good luck!

Jugurtha 8y ago
Why? Has love become a bad thing?
- borplk 8y ago
  It's not professional and written badly. Really? you need someone to write an elaborate explanation about it?
  - Jugurtha 8y ago
    Yes, let's elaborate. Would it be more "professional" to replace "women" in the sentence by "guitars" to make it: >But also one of my favorite activities is to spend some wonderful hours with wonderful guitars to give them all my love. Does that make it more "professional", and if so why? I see people talking about their favorite activities looking for a job all the time, and the prose written to describe their love for backpacking, rock climbing, chess, and puppies surely is unprofessional, right?
    - borplk 8y ago
      > one of my favorite activities is to spend some wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love. "spend wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love" would be interpreted by many as some variation of "I'm a horny creep who loves tits". "hey what is this guy's favorite activity?" "he likes to give all his love to wonderful women during some wonderful hours, not some of it, ALL his love." "spend wonderful hours" is vague and doesn't refer to a specific activity (as opposed to "rock climbing" or "tennis"). "wonderful women" is also broad and implies "many" (as opposed to "my wife", "my two amazing sisters", "my best friend Lisa"). also mentioning "women" specifically is not a great idea (as opposed to just saying "people" or "friends") it makes it sound like them being women is of some special importance and preference. "to give them all my love" ... do I have to explain this too? it sounds unnecessarily "dirty". So an unforgiving interpretation of it leans towards "yum I love women and I love lots of em". So speaking of professional, it's best to leave something like this out. It's written in a way that is screaming "SKIP ME SKIP ME SKIP ME". A better version would be something along the lines of, "one of my favorite activities is playing tennis with my friends." There are already enough random arbitrary things that employers may pick on to skip on a candidate as it is. Especially in this climate where saying "hi" to the wrong person at the wrong time can easily score you a "sexual harassment complaint". If someone is looking for a job they should work to minimise those not to add on to it by saying "I like to spend wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love".
      - Jugurtha 8y ago
        >would be interpreted by many as some variation of "I'm a horny creep who loves tits". Which mental sinuosities must one cross to get from OP's statement to "horny creep who loves tits". Do you think loving tits makes one a horny creep? Is it the creepiness that is not okay, or the horniness? Are non horny creeps okay? What do you have against tits? Is that not sexist? Is that not called projection or some other similar word? These are all valid questions given that to get from OP's statement to your thought would be quite a feat, even for a Tolkien's character. >"wonderful women" is also broad and implies "many" (as opposed to "my wife", "my two amazing sisters", "my best friend Lisa"). >So an unforgiving interpretation of it leans towards "yum I love women and I love lots of em". And whether it's his sisters or his friend Lisa our business how exactly? Would it be okay if it were his sisters? Why would it be okay for these women to be his sisters/wife? Do you have something against poly people? Would you go as to discriminate against them? If so, who else would you discriminate against because they do not conform to your view on who it is okay to spend hours and give love to and who is not good enough for love? >Especially in this climate where saying "hi" to the wrong person at the wrong time can easily score you a "sexual harassment complaint". Do you not think that the kind of interpretations and projections above exacerbate that climate? And if that "climate" were a company, why would anyone want to spend the tiniest amount of time in that kind of environment, except to avoid starvation. >If someone is looking for a job they should work to minimise those not to add on to it by saying "I like to spend wonderful hours with wonderful women to give them all my love". If someone is about to starve, maybe. If not, it's a waste of life to spend most of one's waking hours with people who are like that.
        borplk 8y ago
        You are over-analysing and over-complicating something quite simple. None of what I described is necessarily my belief or opinion I just described how that sentence can work against a job candidate. There will be tens of resumes piled up in front of someone who is tired and overworked and they don't have the time or interest to dig into your deep philosophy about the meaning of the sentence. When there are lots of other options in front of them that don't have the same "problems" they are going to pick those out of caution. It's asking for a misunderstanding and asking to be skipped/rejected. You may lose great opportunities because the HR person filtered you out on step 0 because you were so insistent to announce your interest in giving all your love to wonderful women.
    - chrisbennet 8y ago
      You can “go with your gut” and include that in your information to potential employers and wonder why you can’t find work OR you can alter your approach given the HN advice and increase your chances. Here are a couple of reasons to remove that “hobby” from you job pitch: - It makes you seem like you like to give “all your love” to multiple women - at the same time. Now this may be acceptable to some but, generally speaking, this comes off as duplicitous since it might be assumed that the women don’t know this since most women would not agree to such a relationship. While this may not be your intent, it is a reasonable interpretation. - If I was an employer, the fact that your wrote this would make you seem like someone who might “hit” on my female employees. The last thing I need to hire someone who might make my workplace “toxic”. If you have some good friends who are better at “this human stuff”, ask them to look over your resume/CV/cover letters and help you. This is great advice for anyone really. Good luck with your job search!
      - Jugurtha 8y ago
        Where to begin.. First, I'm debating not because I lack perception of the possible ways OP's content may be interpreted, but because I am questioning the reasons of the ways it may be interpreted. There's a nuance that is not so hard to grasp. > most women would not agree to such a relationship. And you think that because you believe people treat all people the same? Meaning just because it is your experience that women would not agree to such a relationship means that they do not agree with such a relationship period? Did it occur to you that they may not be "agreeing" to such a relationship with you, i.e: that you are a variable that must be controlled in an experiment. Did it also occur to you that they may not be agreeing to such a relationship because you're the kind of person who thinks they may not? Did you think that such a thing may only be something you believe to be true, have you tried to prove yourself wrong and actually be in that kind of relationship? And if you did and failed to be in such relationships, is it enough to generalize and say that it's the women who do not agree to these relationships (and taking yourself out of the equation) or does it have something to do with you? Let me drive the point home: your whole argument is saying that you should separate your "private" persona from your "professional" persona. Which means you do not behave the same with your buddies as you do with your coworkers/employer.. Which means there are whole swaths of your personality that are unknown from your colleagues. Does the fact that some aspects of your personality are unknown to your colleagues mean that these aspect do not exist or do they just not exist in the same space and time as your colleagues? Does women willingness to be in such relationship not exist at all just because it does not exist within your time and space? Isn't this what someone who's good at "human stuff" should be aware of, or is it enough to have one's biases in check? Do you think the barely veiled condescension and snark in your penultimate sentence helps people expose their true self to you knowing they might be so negatively judged, do you not think it reinforces your beliefs about what "most" people would and would not agree to?
    - speedplane 8y ago
      Are you really equating women (i.e., humans), with guitars?
      - Jugurtha 8y ago
        > Are you really equating women (i.e., humans), with guitars? Is this really the best you can do?