5 ms·

Children of the Opioid Epidemic

66 points by dsr12 9y ago

cylinder 9y ago
To get an idea of how the New York Times depicted children of a drug addiction epidemic when it was black children affected, see here: CHILDREN OF CRACK: ARE THE SCHOOLS READY? - A SPECIAL REPORT: Crack Babies Turn 5, and Schools Brace https://www.nytimes.com/1990/05/25/us/children-crack-are-schools-ready-special-report-crack-babies-turn-5-schools.html https://www.nytimes.com/1990/05/25/us/children-crack-are-sch...
- JCSato 9y ago
  *the New York Times of almost 30 years ago
  - watwut 8y ago
    And the result policies are with us till today. It was influential journal that shaped how people got treated and current culture, racial divisions, activism etc etc were influenced by that.
    - mieseratte 8y ago
      > It was influential journal that shaped how people got treated and current culture, racial divisions, activism etc etc were influenced by that. Alternatively, we were already hard on drug addicts and it was reflection of the time. Fast-forward to present day, we've been steadily shifting towards a more reasonable approach towards drugs, slowly but surely. It's also well established that the black community was for the harsh laws of the crack epidemic, having believed it would help end the crisis by keeping criminals off the streets. In that light, the results start to look more as a result of unintended consequences than some type of modern-day chattel system as implied by present-day activists.
      - watwut 8y ago
        They argued also for social services which they did not get. They did argued for tying criminality with blackness either. Every single thing and act is product of it time in same sense. People have no agency nor choice nor make decisions in such view of world. 20 years old 30 years ago are 50 years old now. The people who were shaped by these things are the ones ruling world now and it influences their reactions to events now. Including reactions to youth activism which is, again, reaction to their policies. What I am saying is that it is not distant past 2000 years ago, it is recent past very relevant to now.
        wmeredith 8y ago
        You're making salient points, but it's being undermined by grammatical errors.
      - scarface74 8y ago
        Alternatively, we were already hard on drug addicts and it was reflection of the time. Fast-forward to present day, we've been steadily shifting towards a more reasonable approach towards drugs, slowly but surely. The only time there is a more "reasonable" approach is when it is happening in the burbs with prescription pills and "rural" areas. They are still more than willing to lock up "inner city thugs".
        mieseratte 8y ago
        Is it more reasonable because it's white folks, or because we've evolved our understanding?
        scarface74 8y ago
        Statistically. Blacks get longer prison sentences for the same crime as Whites. https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/black-men-sentenced-time-white-men-crime-study/story?id=51203491 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/black-men-sentenced-time-whi...
      - yardie 8y ago
- drenvuk 9y ago
  It would be nice if an approach with such a humanitarian tact used in the OP's article were used back then. Hopefully we continue to grow in such a way.
  - zenkat 8y ago
    The article points out that race has a lot to do with how these two epidemics of addiction were portrayed.
  - mdanger007 8y ago
    New York times is 35% racial think pieces now. I tapped out.
- ehnto 8y ago
  Although it has been 27 years since then. I would hope the same article would be written differently today.
  - fragmede 8y ago
    27 years and the heroin epidemic has broadened to poor White people
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
sharkjacobs 8y ago
I feel a great deal of sadness and sympathy for drug addicts when I think about them, and a great deal of resentment and anger at drug addicts when I think about the other people in their lives.
- leetcrew 8y ago
  i can understand this sentiment, but there are many mental illnesses that bring pain to the people around the afflicted. why do we single drug addicts out for judgement? anecdotally, i have seen that the ones that recover do not succeed through willpower or strength of character. the main factor is the strength of their support network. it is not a moral deficiency.
  - cfadvan 8y ago
    i can understand this sentiment, but there are many mental illnesses that bring pain to the people around the afflicted. why do we single drug addicts out for judgement? At some point a drug addict, predisposition and circumstances aside, had to make a choice to start taking drugs. Someone with a mental illness never chose to flirt with mental illness, they’re just mentally ill. Now, I also have a lot of sympathy for drug addicts, because we can’t ignore predisposition and environment, but it was still, somewhere in their past, a matter of choice. I don’t think that means we should hang them out to dry, but it’s not quite the same as someone who was just born sick. Of course that does exclude the hefty portion of the drug addicted populace who found their way to drugs as the result of a mental illness...
    - Chernobog 8y ago
      Talking about environment, I saw a very good quote by a woman named Tine Brubak Jahren, that I have taken the liberty to translate to English: "It's odd when it comes to sympathy for drug addicts: Everyone has much sympathy for sexually abused children, children of drug addicts, victims of violence and abuse, people with mental health issues that are not helped by the system. BUT, when they grow up to become dysfunctional adults that use drugs to take away the pain and their problems, then it is suddenly full stop for the sympathy. Suddenly, they are expected to take charge of their lives and behave like everyone else, and if they can't do that, there is no lack of suggestions such as sending them to desolate islands, forced sterilization or simply locking them up for life." She makes a great point, that also highlights the absurdity of using fines and prison for addicts. The system essentially punishes them for something the system has predisposed them to.
lifeisstillgood 8y ago
I find this hard reading, the seeds of tragedy sown early. How many children are abandoned to poor parenting - and is there a fix? I know this is somewhat SF utopian but I keep banging on about "MOOP" - massive open online psychology. the idea that we are monitored day in day out by our phones, listening to us and our interactions, the actual useful data that could be extracted about our psychology, our behaviour and how to improve it is immense (yes the risks huge - but that's why it should be open) anyway - imagine a fridge that says "don't eat the chocolate" or a phone that's says "don't take the opioids" Or a phone that's suggests new ways to talk with your children.
- maxxxxx 8y ago
  You are describing exactly what Google and Facebook and others are doing. With the minor difference that they are telling you "eat that chocolate".
  - wmeredith 8y ago
    *brought you by Nestle^tm
- neffy 8y ago
  To be quite frank about it, that's a fridge that's just going to have to experience a terrible accident to its loudspeaker.
- zeth___ 8y ago
  >I know this is somewhat SF utopian but I keep banging on about "MOOP" - massive open online psychology. the idea that we are monitored day in day out by our phones, listening to us and our interactions, the actual useful data that could be extracted about our psychology, our behaviour and how to improve it is immense (yes the risks huge - but that's why it should be open) And who will control what gets told to whom? >Don't look at his hunky ass, you are wrong in gods eyes. Would have been what every gay would have heard in the 1950s. >Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be "cured" against one's will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals.
Sohakes 8y ago
This is one of the most beautiful and hopeful articles I've read in a long time. I was expecting a depressing read but was delightfully surprised.

66 points by dsr12 9y ago

To get an idea of how the New York Times depicted children of a drug addiction epidemic when it was black children affected, see here: CHILDREN OF CRACK: ARE THE SCHOOLS READY? - A SPECIAL REPORT: Crack Babies Turn 5, and Schools Brace https://www.nytimes.com/1990/05/25/us/children-crack-are-schools-ready-special-report-crack-babies-turn-5-schools.html https://www.nytimes.com/1990/05/25/us/children-crack-are-sch...

JCSato 9y ago
*the New York Times of almost 30 years ago
- watwut 8y ago
  And the result policies are with us till today. It was influential journal that shaped how people got treated and current culture, racial divisions, activism etc etc were influenced by that.
  - mieseratte 8y ago
    > It was influential journal that shaped how people got treated and current culture, racial divisions, activism etc etc were influenced by that. Alternatively, we were already hard on drug addicts and it was reflection of the time. Fast-forward to present day, we've been steadily shifting towards a more reasonable approach towards drugs, slowly but surely. It's also well established that the black community was for the harsh laws of the crack epidemic, having believed it would help end the crisis by keeping criminals off the streets. In that light, the results start to look more as a result of unintended consequences than some type of modern-day chattel system as implied by present-day activists.
    - watwut 8y ago
      They argued also for social services which they did not get. They did argued for tying criminality with blackness either. Every single thing and act is product of it time in same sense. People have no agency nor choice nor make decisions in such view of world. 20 years old 30 years ago are 50 years old now. The people who were shaped by these things are the ones ruling world now and it influences their reactions to events now. Including reactions to youth activism which is, again, reaction to their policies. What I am saying is that it is not distant past 2000 years ago, it is recent past very relevant to now.
      - wmeredith 8y ago
        You're making salient points, but it's being undermined by grammatical errors.
    - scarface74 8y ago
      Alternatively, we were already hard on drug addicts and it was reflection of the time. Fast-forward to present day, we've been steadily shifting towards a more reasonable approach towards drugs, slowly but surely. The only time there is a more "reasonable" approach is when it is happening in the burbs with prescription pills and "rural" areas. They are still more than willing to lock up "inner city thugs".
      - mieseratte 8y ago
        Is it more reasonable because it's white folks, or because we've evolved our understanding?
        scarface74 8y ago
        Statistically. Blacks get longer prison sentences for the same crime as Whites. https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/black-men-sentenced-time-white-men-crime-study/story?id=51203491 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/black-men-sentenced-time-whi...
    - yardie 8y ago
drenvuk 9y ago
It would be nice if an approach with such a humanitarian tact used in the OP's article were used back then. Hopefully we continue to grow in such a way.
- zenkat 8y ago
  The article points out that race has a lot to do with how these two epidemics of addiction were portrayed.
- mdanger007 8y ago
  New York times is 35% racial think pieces now. I tapped out.
ehnto 8y ago
Although it has been 27 years since then. I would hope the same article would be written differently today.
- fragmede 8y ago
  27 years and the heroin epidemic has broadened to poor White people
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

sharkjacobs 8y ago

I feel a great deal of sadness and sympathy for drug addicts when I think about them, and a great deal of resentment and anger at drug addicts when I think about the other people in their lives.

leetcrew 8y ago
i can understand this sentiment, but there are many mental illnesses that bring pain to the people around the afflicted. why do we single drug addicts out for judgement? anecdotally, i have seen that the ones that recover do not succeed through willpower or strength of character. the main factor is the strength of their support network. it is not a moral deficiency.
- cfadvan 8y ago
  i can understand this sentiment, but there are many mental illnesses that bring pain to the people around the afflicted. why do we single drug addicts out for judgement? At some point a drug addict, predisposition and circumstances aside, had to make a choice to start taking drugs. Someone with a mental illness never chose to flirt with mental illness, they’re just mentally ill. Now, I also have a lot of sympathy for drug addicts, because we can’t ignore predisposition and environment, but it was still, somewhere in their past, a matter of choice. I don’t think that means we should hang them out to dry, but it’s not quite the same as someone who was just born sick. Of course that does exclude the hefty portion of the drug addicted populace who found their way to drugs as the result of a mental illness...
  - Chernobog 8y ago
    Talking about environment, I saw a very good quote by a woman named Tine Brubak Jahren, that I have taken the liberty to translate to English: "It's odd when it comes to sympathy for drug addicts: Everyone has much sympathy for sexually abused children, children of drug addicts, victims of violence and abuse, people with mental health issues that are not helped by the system. BUT, when they grow up to become dysfunctional adults that use drugs to take away the pain and their problems, then it is suddenly full stop for the sympathy. Suddenly, they are expected to take charge of their lives and behave like everyone else, and if they can't do that, there is no lack of suggestions such as sending them to desolate islands, forced sterilization or simply locking them up for life." She makes a great point, that also highlights the absurdity of using fines and prison for addicts. The system essentially punishes them for something the system has predisposed them to.

lifeisstillgood 8y ago

I find this hard reading, the seeds of tragedy sown early. How many children are abandoned to poor parenting - and is there a fix? I know this is somewhat SF utopian but I keep banging on about "MOOP" - massive open online psychology. the idea that we are monitored day in day out by our phones, listening to us and our interactions, the actual useful data that could be extracted about our psychology, our behaviour and how to improve it is immense (yes the risks huge - but that's why it should be open) anyway - imagine a fridge that says "don't eat the chocolate" or a phone that's says "don't take the opioids" Or a phone that's suggests new ways to talk with your children.

maxxxxx 8y ago
You are describing exactly what Google and Facebook and others are doing. With the minor difference that they are telling you "eat that chocolate".
- wmeredith 8y ago
  *brought you by Nestle^tm
neffy 8y ago
To be quite frank about it, that's a fridge that's just going to have to experience a terrible accident to its loudspeaker.
zeth___ 8y ago
>I know this is somewhat SF utopian but I keep banging on about "MOOP" - massive open online psychology. the idea that we are monitored day in day out by our phones, listening to us and our interactions, the actual useful data that could be extracted about our psychology, our behaviour and how to improve it is immense (yes the risks huge - but that's why it should be open) And who will control what gets told to whom? >Don't look at his hunky ass, you are wrong in gods eyes. Would have been what every gay would have heard in the 1950s. >Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be "cured" against one's will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals.

Sohakes 8y ago

This is one of the most beautiful and hopeful articles I've read in a long time. I was expecting a depressing read but was delightfully surprised.