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> There really needs to be a 2nd grid of roads to handle scooters, bikes, and pedestrians. Bikes and scooters should be allies not competitors. Pedestrians alr
by skrause 8y ago
> There really needs to be a 2nd grid of roads to handle scooters, bikes, and pedestrians. Bikes and scooters should be allies not competitors.
Pedestrians already have their 2nd grid of roads, it's called the sidewalk. Problem is that bikes also don't fit there, so basically they need a 3rd set of roads.
- vinceguidry 8y agoDon't forget about buses, they need their own road section too!
- icebraining 8y agoWon't those be empty 99% of the time? Sounds wasteful.
- ndespres 8y agoNo more wasteful than the passenger cars which clog the roads and are only 17-25% occupied.
- icebraining 8y agoNo argument there, but "no more wasteful than [very wasteful thing]" is not great :) I'm just wondering if a better use of the street could be achieved; that doesn't have to mean cars. What about a bus + moped lane? Electric mopeds seem like a pretty good alternative for people who need something faster than a scooter, and having ridden a bicycle in Amsterdam, where mopeds could use the bicycle lane, I can tell you they don't belong there!
- _nalply 8y agoYes, Switzerland where everything is small doesn't often have space for separate bus lanes. They use a trick: where the bus lane merges they have a traffic light. Cars have to wait for the bus -- literally -- and are only allowed to merge behind the bus. When the bus stops there are street baffles preventing the cars overtaking the bus. This way the bus has a free lane ahead. And the cars would have needed to wait in the traffic jam anyway, so why not let them wait intelligently behind buses?
- akie 8y agoThey can also be used by taxis and other utility vehicles (e.g. the police) like here in Germany, but yes - it's a bit wasteful. This is why they only build them where there's space.
- vinceguidry 8y agoYou may have missed the recent article that made the front page about buses. But the idea is, if you put them in dedicated center lanes, provide civilian walk paths over the street, and give them priority over other vehicle traffic, then people treat them more like subways. Several cities in Latin America do this, the one I'm familiar with and used was TransMilenio in Bogota. Of course, at this point, you might as well use streetcars. But I think buses are still cheaper at that point.
- icebraining 8y agoI did miss the article! Do you happen to have a link? Search for "buses" finds two articles from the past month, but I don't see the reference to that idea. EDIT: Nevermind, this is it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17034100 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17034100
- NegativeLatency 8y agoIt’s also easier to change a bus route than a streetcar route
- dingdingdang 8y agoEmpty 99% of the time - no, they are generally used in busy areas of larger cities where multiple bus-lines overlap (at least that goes for Copenhagen)
- mattlondon 8y agoIn London there are special lanes for buses. There are fines for using them at certain times of the day if you are in a private vehicle (there are fixed cameras, and cameras in the busses too). Cyclists are free to use them Pics: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=london+bus+lanes&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjrx7XFw_3aAhUBQ8AKHe-PAAoQ_AUICigB&biw=1200&bih=1829#imgrc=QyXL_PTK2cSk1M https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=london+bus+lanes&source=ln...:
- simonsarris 8y agoInner city Bus lanes should naturally double as bicycle lanes, as they are in Paris.
- justinator 8y agoHave you used them? Bicycles and buses aren't a great combination. Passing and being passed is not so pleasant. I think bus/bike lanes were put together for lack of space, and not because it's a natiral or fabulous solution.
- wiredfool 8y agoIt's ok if the bus lanes are mostly travel lanes (ok, not great, there's a pretty strong speed mismatch between bus speed and casual cyclist), but it falls down when it's an area with lots of stops. It can be wall to wall busses in some places in Dublin (quays) where many bus lines meet and there are literally continuous stops for several blocks.
- imgabe 8y agoIf we get rid of the cars, there's plenty of room.
- mattsdni 8y agoI'd rather drive a car in this weather https://i.imgur.com/i5oLpec.jpg https://i.imgur.com/i5oLpec.jpg
- imgabe 8y agoI'd rather stay home in that weather ;)
- Infernal 8y agoJeep Wrangler?
- naravara 8y agoYou’ve clearly never lived anywhere that only occasionally gets snow. Driving a car in that weather is fender-bender city because most people have no clue how to drive with any kind of precipitation.
- aeternus 8y agoEven more reason to drive a car vs. a scooter / bike.
- paulddraper 8y ago...and you'd rather be in a 15 mph scooter fender bender than a 15 mph car fender bender?
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- celticninja 8y agoStill better on a bike :)
- 8y ago
- namlem 8y agoCopenhagen has it. So do many cities in the Netherlands. It's great. There's the road for cars, a small curb, a lane for bikes, a small curb, and the sidewalk.
- Sammi 8y agoIt's more than that. Denmark and the Netherlands have bike lanes all over the countries. Basically everywhere. It's weird when you can't find the bike lane. But Denmark and the Netherlands are also flat like pancakes and therefore just super bike friendly from the get go. So that might be a big reason why people were in favor of making bike lanes in the first place.
- romwell 8y agoThat 3rd set exists and functions fine in... Waterloo/Cedar Falls, IA, of all places. When they took down the passenger rail way back in the day, they replaced the network with hiking/biking trails. And in the winter, you have a cross-city skiing network. Granted, there's plenty of space around those corn fields, but something tells me that if Cedarloo can pull it off, the richer cities can, too.
- stcredzero 8y agoThat 3rd set exists and functions fine in... Waterloo/Cedar Falls, IA, of all places. Is it flat like Copenhagen?
- romwell 8y agoIt's not hilly. In any case, the trails were laid over a former rail track, so the trails are very flat[1] - never steeper than 2% grade. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cedar_Valley_Trail https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cedar_Valley_Trail
- konschubert 8y agoElectric assistance on a bike makes every city flat.