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I don't know why this is being downvoted. This should be the top response to this thread...

by eberfreitas 8y ago

mundo 8y ago
For the same reason that "Just don't drink, what's so hard about that?" would be in a discussion of alcoholism.
- mikeash 8y ago
  If the rest of the discussion revolves around how to drink as much as possible without going broke or getting caught then that would be a fine response. Yes, improving your social skills can be damned hard. But that’s irrelevant if you don’t even want to do it. First we need to convince people that self improvement is the solution, not isolation. Then we can talk about how.
  - mundo 8y ago
    > Yes, improving your social skills can be damned hard. But that’s irrelevant if you don’t even want to do it. Er... your theory is that "too shy/awkward to carry on a casual conversation with a woman" is something that some men prefer? That they could overcome it, but don't want to? That seems more likely to you than "they would like to overcome it, but haven't been able to"?
    - mikeash 8y ago
      When the discussion consists entirely of people saying they just avoid talking to women entirely, yes, that seems much more likely. I’m not saying they’re happy with it, but prefer it over self improvement? You bet. People usually hate trying to change themselves.
      - blattimwind 8y ago
        > I’m not saying they’re happy with it, but prefer it over self improvement? You can want something yet fail to achieve it, that's fairly obvious, no? Compare: fat people who want to be not-fat. Of course, the blatant counter-argument would be that those just don't want it enough; this entire train of thought seems rather damning to me.
        mikeash 8y ago
        You can, but I see no indication of such a desire here.
      - newen 8y ago
        They are talking about the workplace in particular. They are saying, why risk your job being social with women at work when you can be social elsewhere.
        mikeash 8y ago
        Why risk your job being social with anyone at work? Why ever do anything other than exactly what your job requires? I'm saying, if your social skills are so bad that you're risking your job by being social with women at work, you should make fixing that a top priority.
        newen 8y ago
        Okay, but if my social skills are that bad then I certainly wouldn't try fixing them at work. Also, in response to your first sentence, it's about relative risk.

I don't know why this is being downvoted. This should be the top response to this thread...

mundo 8y ago

For the same reason that "Just don't drink, what's so hard about that?" would be in a discussion of alcoholism.

mikeash 8y ago
If the rest of the discussion revolves around how to drink as much as possible without going broke or getting caught then that would be a fine response. Yes, improving your social skills can be damned hard. But that’s irrelevant if you don’t even want to do it. First we need to convince people that self improvement is the solution, not isolation. Then we can talk about how.
- mundo 8y ago
  > Yes, improving your social skills can be damned hard. But that’s irrelevant if you don’t even want to do it. Er... your theory is that "too shy/awkward to carry on a casual conversation with a woman" is something that some men prefer? That they could overcome it, but don't want to? That seems more likely to you than "they would like to overcome it, but haven't been able to"?
  - mikeash 8y ago
    When the discussion consists entirely of people saying they just avoid talking to women entirely, yes, that seems much more likely. I’m not saying they’re happy with it, but prefer it over self improvement? You bet. People usually hate trying to change themselves.
    - blattimwind 8y ago
      > I’m not saying they’re happy with it, but prefer it over self improvement? You can want something yet fail to achieve it, that's fairly obvious, no? Compare: fat people who want to be not-fat. Of course, the blatant counter-argument would be that those just don't want it enough; this entire train of thought seems rather damning to me.
      - mikeash 8y ago
        You can, but I see no indication of such a desire here.
    - newen 8y ago
      They are talking about the workplace in particular. They are saying, why risk your job being social with women at work when you can be social elsewhere.
      - mikeash 8y ago
        Why risk your job being social with anyone at work? Why ever do anything other than exactly what your job requires? I'm saying, if your social skills are so bad that you're risking your job by being social with women at work, you should make fixing that a top priority.
        newen 8y ago
        Okay, but if my social skills are that bad then I certainly wouldn't try fixing them at work. Also, in response to your first sentence, it's about relative risk.