3 ms·

> All they had to do to find a lab partner is have a pulse. Eh, that sounds a bit like those lab partners may have had dubious motivations. I figure it's on t

> All they had to do to find a lab partner is have a pulse. Eh, that sounds a bit like those lab partners may have had dubious motivations. I figure it's on those of us who strive for the highest degree of professionalism to take the lead on inclusion.

smsm42 9y ago
So, summarizing the comments here: A: Dudes, go befriend a girl, include her! It's not creepy! B: My anecdata experience suggests girls in my lab, where they were in minority, had no problem being included if they wished to, dudes were very eager to do it. C: Motivations of those dudes sound very dubious and creepy! Yup, yup.
- mikeash 9y ago
  You left out the creepy “have a pulse” part.
  - throwaway84742 9y ago
    No, creepiness exists in your mind only. Believe it or not, we valued the fact that those women were there and we tried to help them out in whatever way we could. My field of study back then (guidance systems, weapons design) is even more male dominated than CS. All male peer groups are not a fun thing to be in. To preclude the question, yes those girls did get asked for a date every now and then. If that’s wrong, I don’t want to be right.
    - mikeash 9y ago
      I read “have a pulse” as “it doesn’t matter how qualified or pleasant these women were, the men were eager to have any contact with a woman and would have taken them on just for that.” Does it mean something else?
      - throwaway84742 9y ago
        It means they didn’t have to make any effort whatsoever to get attention and help of their male peers. Interpret this as you wish.
        mikeash 9y ago
        So, creepy.
  - smsm42 9y ago
    What's creepy in having a pulse? It is the thing about discriminating against Zombie-Americans?
- rectang 9y ago
  If you're utterly terrified that cross-gender interaction will end badly for you, then maybe it's not best for you to take the lead on outreach. There are lots of other people who don't feel such an extreme level of fear and discomfort, yet who probably could do more in terms of inclusion. Those are the people I hope the author of this article reaches. I hope the many commenters on this article who feel so uncomfortable with female colleagues do find some way to improve their situation though -- their alienation is bad for them, bad for women, bad for all of us collectively.

smsm42 9y ago

So, summarizing the comments here: A: Dudes, go befriend a girl, include her! It's not creepy! B: My anecdata experience suggests girls in my lab, where they were in minority, had no problem being included if they wished to, dudes were very eager to do it. C: Motivations of those dudes sound very dubious and creepy! Yup, yup.

mikeash 9y ago
You left out the creepy “have a pulse” part.
- throwaway84742 9y ago
  No, creepiness exists in your mind only. Believe it or not, we valued the fact that those women were there and we tried to help them out in whatever way we could. My field of study back then (guidance systems, weapons design) is even more male dominated than CS. All male peer groups are not a fun thing to be in. To preclude the question, yes those girls did get asked for a date every now and then. If that’s wrong, I don’t want to be right.
  - mikeash 9y ago
    I read “have a pulse” as “it doesn’t matter how qualified or pleasant these women were, the men were eager to have any contact with a woman and would have taken them on just for that.” Does it mean something else?
    - throwaway84742 9y ago
      It means they didn’t have to make any effort whatsoever to get attention and help of their male peers. Interpret this as you wish.
      - mikeash 9y ago
        So, creepy.
- smsm42 9y ago
  What's creepy in having a pulse? It is the thing about discriminating against Zombie-Americans?
rectang 9y ago
If you're utterly terrified that cross-gender interaction will end badly for you, then maybe it's not best for you to take the lead on outreach. There are lots of other people who don't feel such an extreme level of fear and discomfort, yet who probably could do more in terms of inclusion. Those are the people I hope the author of this article reaches. I hope the many commenters on this article who feel so uncomfortable with female colleagues do find some way to improve their situation though -- their alienation is bad for them, bad for women, bad for all of us collectively.