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I've always noticed that companies advertise for Sr. Programmers. Everyone wants trained programmers but few are willing to train them. Since those are the only

by nhebb 16y ago

I've always noticed that companies advertise for Sr. Programmers. Everyone wants trained programmers but few are willing to train them. Since those are the only jobs advertised, job seeking junior programmers are forced to apply for jobs they know they aren't qualified for, virtually guaranteeing that hiring managers will receive a bevy of applicants that, on paper at least, don't match the hiring criteria.

the_dude 16y ago
Yes, I've run into this many times as well. Personally I'd love to get into some type of programming job (esp. at a startup), but I didn't major in CS or Computer Engineering nor have I had any professional experience in the field (read: haven't had a job programming professionally, therefore not qualified for a senior position). Maybe it's just the current economic climate but I've found this true of many startups as well (looking on job boards like Startuply, for instance).
- nhebb 16y ago
  Maybe it's just the current economic climate For advertised jobs, the "Sr." requirement has been true for years. Everyone has their own way of judging economic growth and decline. Me, I like to look at job ads - esp. engineers and programmers. Both of those areas have senioritis.
jerf 16y ago
If it takes "10 years" to learn to program, and you hire a guy five years into his ten years, and the average duration of employment is two years, and all of these clauses are "common knowledge" regardless of whether they are actually true, you can see the problem. Training is a real long-haul investment, and in an at-will environment and culture even strictly considering the employer's side in an environment where the employee can leave literally at any minute makes this a very risky move. Train people to some extent, sure, but like actually give them the equivalent of a college education "on the job"? Sounds like a fast way to bankruptcy to me.

by nhebb 16y ago

the_dude 16y ago

Yes, I've run into this many times as well. Personally I'd love to get into some type of programming job (esp. at a startup), but I didn't major in CS or Computer Engineering nor have I had any professional experience in the field (read: haven't had a job programming professionally, therefore not qualified for a senior position). Maybe it's just the current economic climate but I've found this true of many startups as well (looking on job boards like Startuply, for instance).

nhebb 16y ago
Maybe it's just the current economic climate For advertised jobs, the "Sr." requirement has been true for years. Everyone has their own way of judging economic growth and decline. Me, I like to look at job ads - esp. engineers and programmers. Both of those areas have senioritis.

jerf 16y ago

If it takes "10 years" to learn to program, and you hire a guy five years into his ten years, and the average duration of employment is two years, and all of these clauses are "common knowledge" regardless of whether they are actually true, you can see the problem. Training is a real long-haul investment, and in an at-will environment and culture even strictly considering the employer's side in an environment where the employee can leave literally at any minute makes this a very risky move. Train people to some extent, sure, but like actually give them the equivalent of a college education "on the job"? Sounds like a fast way to bankruptcy to me.