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Showing ads is unethical now? >Maybe if the service is only marginally profitable without acting unethically it should shut down. Also I love this neo puritan

Showing ads is unethical now? >Maybe if the service is only marginally profitable without acting unethically it should shut down. Also I love this neo puritan thinking. I'm sure all the users of these services agree with your ideology and you forcing it down their throats is for their own good correct?

Sylos 8y ago
No, tracking is unethical, which most ads rely on. And yes, it is for their own good to not have thousands of databases with their data littered across the internet. I know, this is not a very American way of thinking, but no one can be an expert at everything. Most people are not experts at computers and even less can grasp the outreach and effects of their data being everywhere. These people need help just as much as the average guy needs assistance with doctors. If they knew enough to tell when a doctor is bullshitting them, they could probably become a doctor, too.
- lajhsdfkl 8y ago
  >And yes, it is for their own good to not have thousands of databases with their data littered across the internet. "With their data". Aka whether or not they liked a group pertaining to motorcycles or whether they searched for fishing rods on google. Yeah, we definitely need to shut off what is the most consumer friendly way of monetizing services in history so that a database of inane shit that is only relevant to marketers isn't tracked.
  - Sylos 8y ago
    Well, it's not only relevant to marketers. Your two most innocent examples are not the only type of information that's going to slip in there. And even with those two examples, you just have to be creative to find ways for them to damage you: You'll probably have to pay more for your health insurance, if they find out that you enjoy motorcycles. And if your next potential employer is vegetarian, they might pass on you for fishing, a.k.a. killing things as a hobby. Someone wanting to rob/extort/kidnap/murder you, might look for you at lonely lakes in the region. And these are the most generic examples of this supposedly useless information being used against a person. Someone who happens to have an actual use, is going to be even more creative, since they'll find themselves in some particular situation where it's useful. And again, there's going to be more information. They can sift through an entire list to find the ones that are useful and they can combine multiple pieces of information, too.
ozim 8y ago
How showing ads is against GDPR? You still can show ads, you just need consent for tracking users. If they are going out of business because of GDPR they were not just showing ads.
- lajhsdfkl 8y ago
  There are no ads without tracking.
  - saratogacx 8y ago
    Ads existed before tracking. DDG uses ads based on the page content, not what is known about the user. This is actually how ads were before everyone went tracking-happy. It is a model I prefer simply because it is more inline with the content I'm viewing. I'm more willing to let those ads get whitelisted because they're more likely to be related to the content I'm looking at and less about "what do we think saratogacx really wants today based on all of the data across the web."
  - ozim 8y ago
    You don't have CTR in newspapers and people still buy adverts in those.
  - AlexandrB 8y ago
    > There are no ads without tracking. I can definitively say you're wrong because I saw a billboard on my way to work today. Also, in the early internet days tracking was referred to as spyware and security software would uninstall it from your machine.
rahoulb 8y ago
GDPR basically says “get consent for what you do with peoples data”. If you can’t do that I would say your business model is it very ethical. Edit: or have “legitimate interest” - in either case it’s a very low bar for ethical standards so GDPR shouldn’t be an issue

Sylos 8y ago

No, tracking is unethical, which most ads rely on. And yes, it is for their own good to not have thousands of databases with their data littered across the internet. I know, this is not a very American way of thinking, but no one can be an expert at everything. Most people are not experts at computers and even less can grasp the outreach and effects of their data being everywhere. These people need help just as much as the average guy needs assistance with doctors. If they knew enough to tell when a doctor is bullshitting them, they could probably become a doctor, too.

lajhsdfkl 8y ago
>And yes, it is for their own good to not have thousands of databases with their data littered across the internet. "With their data". Aka whether or not they liked a group pertaining to motorcycles or whether they searched for fishing rods on google. Yeah, we definitely need to shut off what is the most consumer friendly way of monetizing services in history so that a database of inane shit that is only relevant to marketers isn't tracked.
- Sylos 8y ago
  Well, it's not only relevant to marketers. Your two most innocent examples are not the only type of information that's going to slip in there. And even with those two examples, you just have to be creative to find ways for them to damage you: You'll probably have to pay more for your health insurance, if they find out that you enjoy motorcycles. And if your next potential employer is vegetarian, they might pass on you for fishing, a.k.a. killing things as a hobby. Someone wanting to rob/extort/kidnap/murder you, might look for you at lonely lakes in the region. And these are the most generic examples of this supposedly useless information being used against a person. Someone who happens to have an actual use, is going to be even more creative, since they'll find themselves in some particular situation where it's useful. And again, there's going to be more information. They can sift through an entire list to find the ones that are useful and they can combine multiple pieces of information, too.

ozim 8y ago

How showing ads is against GDPR? You still can show ads, you just need consent for tracking users. If they are going out of business because of GDPR they were not just showing ads.

lajhsdfkl 8y ago
There are no ads without tracking.
- saratogacx 8y ago
  Ads existed before tracking. DDG uses ads based on the page content, not what is known about the user. This is actually how ads were before everyone went tracking-happy. It is a model I prefer simply because it is more inline with the content I'm viewing. I'm more willing to let those ads get whitelisted because they're more likely to be related to the content I'm looking at and less about "what do we think saratogacx really wants today based on all of the data across the web."
- ozim 8y ago
  You don't have CTR in newspapers and people still buy adverts in those.
- AlexandrB 8y ago
  > There are no ads without tracking. I can definitively say you're wrong because I saw a billboard on my way to work today. Also, in the early internet days tracking was referred to as spyware and security software would uninstall it from your machine.

rahoulb 8y ago

GDPR basically says “get consent for what you do with peoples data”. If you can’t do that I would say your business model is it very ethical. Edit: or have “legitimate interest” - in either case it’s a very low bar for ethical standards so GDPR shouldn’t be an issue