3 ms·

Only one reservation: it's not scalable.

by cup-of-tea 8y ago

hvidgaard 8y ago
What part of it is not scalable? Storage of history? Supported transaction volume?
- cup-of-tea 8y ago
  Yes. Add to that the environmental impact of proof-of-work as well. Are people still not seeing this? I think the question should be, how is it scalable?
dfdfdfwff 8y ago
A lot of people are working on that, though. Lightning Network seems like a huge improvement already? Proof of Stake, if it can be made to work, might also scale much better than Proof of Work.
bitreality 8y ago
So you're saying that with all the investment into crypto-currency development, and a techonology that did not exist in any form 10 years ago, that it is impossible to scale? You are saying it is impossible to create an improved form of crypto currency that solves scaling? Even with 10's of billions of dollars being invested this year into their development? People are throwing a lot of money at this technology. The stakes are incredibly high. If someone does find a solution and creates a form of crypto currency which can operate at scale and do so for cheap fees, they'll become at least a billionaire. On top of becoming a billionaire, a crypto currency that was able to transact at scale, securely, for pennies in TX costs would fundamentally change the world.
- cup-of-tea 8y ago
  > You are saying it is impossible to create an improved form of crypto currency that solves scaling? No I'm not saying that at all. I'm talking about Blockchain as it currently exists and as the only real solution to decentralised digital money that we have right now. Who cares how much money is being invested into it? I'll believe a solution when I see it. And I'll welcome it with open arms. But until then it's purely hypothetical.
  - bitreality 8y ago
    It's not purely hypothetical. The foundation is there. It's been running for 9+ years. People have shown a willingness to assign real value to digital assets. What you're complaining about is the technology as it exists today. The technology can improved. The money being invested into the space is an incentive and a validation for people who wish to work on improving the technology. Money attracts talent. There's also some very genuine reasons why blockchain technology can serve the greater good.
Taek 8y ago
It will scale. But let's say it doesn't. The global gold market makes something like 1 transaction per day. Global inter-bank interest rates are also on the volume of a few transactions per day. Deep, core infrastructure (even things like BGP and DNS) don't need all that much scalability. As long as it has a use case in deep infrastructure, it can become globally relevant without scale. But it will scale.
- anonymouz 8y ago
  So... those seven years of research don't allow you to give any specifics on how it will scale? Just "believe me"? I think that's what all the sceptics (including me) are worried about: lots of hyperbole and wishful thinking, but no specifics; grand claims about applicability that vanish as soon as you asked for details or how exactly it solves a problem, and the major problems just being handwaved away with a "don't worry, it'll work in the future". If it every works as a money transfer network, a store of value, or actually solves any of my other problems in more efficient way than other solutions, then I'll use it then. No need for me to speculate on it now.
  - cup-of-tea 8y ago
    Yeah. There is so much wishful thinking in all cryptos and that's what ultimately drove me away. So many people don't understand the technology or what it really means to have a system running at global scale yet they are sure that someone else will solve the problem for them. This actually gets at a deeper problem in our society. Lots of people justify their unsustainable lifestyles by thinking that some day technology will make it sustainable. It doesn't work like that. When new technology happens you won't go sustainable, you'll want more.

Only one reservation: it's not scalable.

hvidgaard 8y ago

What part of it is not scalable? Storage of history? Supported transaction volume?

cup-of-tea 8y ago
Yes. Add to that the environmental impact of proof-of-work as well. Are people still not seeing this? I think the question should be, how is it scalable?

dfdfdfwff 8y ago

A lot of people are working on that, though. Lightning Network seems like a huge improvement already? Proof of Stake, if it can be made to work, might also scale much better than Proof of Work.

bitreality 8y ago

So you're saying that with all the investment into crypto-currency development, and a techonology that did not exist in any form 10 years ago, that it is impossible to scale? You are saying it is impossible to create an improved form of crypto currency that solves scaling? Even with 10's of billions of dollars being invested this year into their development? People are throwing a lot of money at this technology. The stakes are incredibly high. If someone does find a solution and creates a form of crypto currency which can operate at scale and do so for cheap fees, they'll become at least a billionaire. On top of becoming a billionaire, a crypto currency that was able to transact at scale, securely, for pennies in TX costs would fundamentally change the world.

cup-of-tea 8y ago
> You are saying it is impossible to create an improved form of crypto currency that solves scaling? No I'm not saying that at all. I'm talking about Blockchain as it currently exists and as the only real solution to decentralised digital money that we have right now. Who cares how much money is being invested into it? I'll believe a solution when I see it. And I'll welcome it with open arms. But until then it's purely hypothetical.
- bitreality 8y ago
  It's not purely hypothetical. The foundation is there. It's been running for 9+ years. People have shown a willingness to assign real value to digital assets. What you're complaining about is the technology as it exists today. The technology can improved. The money being invested into the space is an incentive and a validation for people who wish to work on improving the technology. Money attracts talent. There's also some very genuine reasons why blockchain technology can serve the greater good.

Taek 8y ago

It will scale. But let's say it doesn't. The global gold market makes something like 1 transaction per day. Global inter-bank interest rates are also on the volume of a few transactions per day. Deep, core infrastructure (even things like BGP and DNS) don't need all that much scalability. As long as it has a use case in deep infrastructure, it can become globally relevant without scale. But it will scale.

anonymouz 8y ago
So... those seven years of research don't allow you to give any specifics on how it will scale? Just "believe me"? I think that's what all the sceptics (including me) are worried about: lots of hyperbole and wishful thinking, but no specifics; grand claims about applicability that vanish as soon as you asked for details or how exactly it solves a problem, and the major problems just being handwaved away with a "don't worry, it'll work in the future". If it every works as a money transfer network, a store of value, or actually solves any of my other problems in more efficient way than other solutions, then I'll use it then. No need for me to speculate on it now.
- cup-of-tea 8y ago
  Yeah. There is so much wishful thinking in all cryptos and that's what ultimately drove me away. So many people don't understand the technology or what it really means to have a system running at global scale yet they are sure that someone else will solve the problem for them. This actually gets at a deeper problem in our society. Lots of people justify their unsustainable lifestyles by thinking that some day technology will make it sustainable. It doesn't work like that. When new technology happens you won't go sustainable, you'll want more.