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The argument I've made is that if they're blocking certain parts of the internet, then they shouldn't be allowed to call themselves an Internet Service Provider
by bb88 9y ago
The argument I've made is that if they're blocking certain parts of the internet, then they shouldn't be allowed to call themselves an Internet Service Provider.
- wtallis 9y agoIt does seem like quite a few ISPs are little more than WWW providers with partial email functionality.
- sjm-lbm 9y agoI've made this argument before (and it does make some sense), but I also doubt that enough people will understand this nuance for it to really matter.
- DoofusOfDeath 9y agoA court might.
- robomc 9y agobut they'd just call themselves a "networking communications service provider" or something, or call themselves nothing, and people will still just use them.
- dzhiurgis 9y agoYou can call yourself whatever you want, but these are the regulations.
- theandrewbailey 9y agoIn the US, the internet is hardly regulated at all. ISPs can legally get away with anything.
- adictator 9y agoNothing stopping any of us from filing a class action suit against such "internet" service providers.
- bb88 9y ago> but I also doubt that enough people will understand this nuance for it to really matter. Certainly that's the first step. There's options for the second step. But advertising seems like it would be the most powerful. "Why use us over AT&T? Because you're not getting the Internet. You're getting what AT&T decides you should look at." "We don't block Netflix or Hulu or a whole host of other streaming services, unlike AT&T"
- rrix2 9y agoWho's advertising this when AT&T has a legal monopoly or duopoly in your town?
- bb88 9y agoThe arguments for anti-net-neutrality has basically come down to "let the free market sort it out." I don't agree with that, but if we can't have net neutrality, at least define to the customers what the "internet" means. And in that case, the town just lost it's internet. What makes you think the residents won't remember this come election day?
- icebraining 9y agoExcept they haven't, really. They can still turn on their phone and login onto Facebook and watch stuff on YouTube. Someone telling them they no longer have Internet will just sound silly.
- zentiggr 9y agoOh god I really hate that that sounds so accurate in so many cases. How do we provide a kiddie day care service level for people who won't or don't want to care, and a full service level for the rest of us? Or do I owe the Internet an apology?
- topranks 9y agoThe problem with the "let the market decide" is that there is no free market for Internet access in the US! In most areas there is effectively a government imposed monopoly on who can provide you access. So there is no "market" to normalise things. You simply cannot vote with your feet. In Europe, where the regulatory framework is different, people would just switch ISPs if one started acting in bad faith.
- raquo 9y agoMaybe not-really-ISPs should be made ineligible for certain privileges / rights given to real ISPs. Like not-really-doctors can't do everything that real doctors can (grasping for a better analogy).
- ForHackernews 9y agoOther entities could punish them by revoking peering agreements. Or if CloudFlare wanted to play hardball, they could deny access to their CDN from AT&T IP ranges. That would be punishing AT&T customers further, but it would get their attention quickly and they'd complain to their ISP.
- colechristensen 9y agoIt would also be punishing CloudFlare customers quite a lot. Taking a moral stand is honorable, but using your customers to do it isn't.
- desireco42 9y agoGreat point. Like at some point Hershey was on the verge to lose ability to call it's chocolate 'milk chocolate' because it's contents didn't have enough of it and cocoa. I really love your idea.
- gargravarr 9y ago"Internet-like product"
- JackFr 9y agoYou know what happens then . . . "Last year, a number of industry groups lobbied for a change to the FDA’s definition of chocolate — a change that would have allowed cocoa butter to be replaced with vegetable oil. At the time, Hershey’s spokesman Kirk Saville told the Harrisburg Patriot-News that “there are high-quality oils available which are equal to or better than cocoa butter in taste, nutrition, texture and function, and are preferred by consumers.”" https://www.today.com/food/chocoholics-sour-new-hersheys-formula-2D80555560 https://www.today.com/food/chocoholics-sour-new-hersheys-for...
- colordrops 9y agoDo you think anyone will notice or care if Spectrum or Verizon stops using the term ISP to describe themselves?
- tekproxy 9y agoI'm fine with this. It's fraud otherwise.
- tekproxy 9y agoOrganic, fair trade, vegan, gluten free internet service provider
- SturgeonsLaw 9y agoMade From Reconstituted Internet
- xg15 9y agoI think ISPs would be welcoming to that change. They'd market as "WWW-Providers" or "Social media providers" and most people would be happy. But hey, if you have advanced needs, no problem, let me refer you too our Gaming Provider and Streaming Provider subsidiaries. Oh you need actual technical access to the internet because you write your own software? Tricky, but I'm sure our Business Technology Services Provider subsidiary will have the service you need. (You do have a business, right?)
- bb88 9y ago> I think ISPs would be welcoming to that change. They'd market as "WWW-Providers" or "Social media providers" and most people would be happy. They'd also become unreliable and untrustworthy. "Mom, I'm going over to Timmy's house tonight. They have _good_ Internet"
- gargravarr 9y ago"Mom, I'm going over to Timmy's house tonight. They have more internet, not just Facebook!"
- xg15 9y ago"Hold on... they have what?! I'll talk with Timmy's mother - and you don't go anywhere. The nerve of her to her own child roam around unsecured just like that. What if you'd hit one of those pedophile sites?" (Meanwhile this whole exchange is probably already obsolete because who visits their people's houses when you have phones?)
- ge0rg 9y ago"Mom, we need to move downtown, where there are two competing shady ISPs and not just the one we've got here, so we can buy different packages from both to get 95% of the Internet we need."
- stickdogg 9y agoNo doubt. That is absolutely how it would work out.
- userbinator 9y agoIn many parts of southeast Asia you can find plenty of "web access" providers that literally give you a private IP behind a NAT in their "LAN", and they are much cheaper than "real Internet". Free WiFi is almost always a similar thing. They are sometimes called InterNAT instead of Internet service.