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Plenty of anecdotes in this thread, predictably. Let's talk about why things are so messed up. The thing to realize here is that total government provision of
by clarkmoody 8y ago
Plenty of anecdotes in this thread, predictably. Let's talk about why things are so messed up.
The thing to realize here is that total government provision of healthcare is probably cheaper than the way the US does it, but that doesn't mean the market has failed. Healthcare in the United States is anything but a free market. It's the worst of all worlds: special interests extract rents through government regulations (drug patents, occupational licensing, handouts to insurance companies in legislation); the government effectively controls prices through its own payment programs; the whole system is over-regulated to an absurd degree. There is no price mechanism to help consumers or producers make proper choices.
So when someone says something like, "the free market can't effectively provide healthcare," I would kindly ask where they see a free market healthcare system. This sounds like a No True Scotsman argument, but it's not. You can't label something so ridiculous as US healthcare as "free market" without either total ignorance or intent to deceive.
- minikites 8y agoIt's impossible to make healthcare into a free market when the cost of declining to participate in that market is usually your life.
- clarkmoody 8y agoYour statement makes no sense. You can decline to participate in the current system. And there are so many ways healthcare could be better in non-life-threatening situations.
- assblaster 8y agoThis poster gets it right 100%. In an ideal hospital, you should only have doctors, nurses, nurse assistants, nurse manager, accounting, pharmacy. Think of all the unnecessary healthcare MBAs that siphon off enormous amounts of resources to generate as much profit as possible to be shared with other healthcare MBAs. Think of all the suppliers of healthcare goods that try to patent and profit off of unnecessary medical "inventions" which do not make a difference compared to what was done previously. Think of all the government bureaucrats paid to ration healthcare resources by underpaying for services which burden hospitals and doctors to raise charges for private insured. Think of all the patients who don't give a crap about their health and refuse to correct their chronic conditions and rather go to the ER when things get really bad. Think of all the lawyers who profit off of bad outcomes (not malpractice necessarily) which forces hospitals and doctors to practice defensive medicine. Making everything single payor won't work, because guess what, there will still be a private insurance system for the people who can afford it vs the system for the rest. It doesn't fix anything.
- uberduber 8y agoYou do need some administrators, like the receptionist, someone to manage the janitorial staff, etc. There's now something like 18 administrators for every doctor in a hospital. I think it was barely 5-6 years ago I was complaining because the ratio was 10 to 1. Their salaries are also pretty high, typically in the $250k range.
- assblaster 8y agoThose are all relatively low level though. I think the boom has been in pay and employment of hospital CEO, CFO, CTO, nurse directors, nurse compliance officers, legal, billing departments and supervisors of supervisors. The people who actually deliver care, ie doctors and nurses, are being perpetually marginalized.
- uberduber 8y agoYep, the closest thing I've seen to a free market is the pet healthcare market in the US. I've met businessmen who got out of the human healthcare market into vet care because it was so much more profitable even though the prices are way, way lower.