7 ms·

Maybe this is a good time to plug PICO-8 which describes itself as a "fantasy console for making, sharing and playing tiny games and other computer programs."

Maybe this is a good time to plug PICO-8 which describes itself as a "fantasy console for making, sharing and playing tiny games and other computer programs." https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php I don't even know the difference between the two programs, but someone interested in TIC might also be interested in PICO.

Lerc 8y ago
The PICO-8 is where the current trend for fantasy consoles began. There's a growing number of them (I'm making one myself). They all have slightly different areas of focus. Some are scripting language based, some emulate CPUs. TIC-80 programs are "64KB of Lua or Moonscript or JavaScript". My own is 8-bit AVR (128k rom, 64k ram). Z80 seems a popular base as well.
- wooly_bully 8y ago
  Celeste, which was released to rave reviews this past year for the Switch, started life as a PICO-8 game. I played it on the PICO-8 at first and was blown away! Enjoy: https://www.lexaloffle.com/bbs/?tid=2145 https://www.lexaloffle.com/bbs/?tid=2145
  - shakna 8y ago
    Do you know how it was ported to the Switch? TIC-80 uses SDL, which doesn't have a working port (for the Switch) so far as I know.
    - theresistor 8y ago
      There's an SDL port, but it can't be publicly distributed due to NDAs.
    - djur 8y ago
      The commercial release of Celeste is a new game, written from scratch, implemented in C# (XNA/FNA/MonoGame). It includes a port of the original. I'm kind of curious if they actually wrote a PICO-8 emulator for that or just ported it to C#.
      - barbs 8y ago
        They have a Github repo with some of the source code up (mostly just stuff to do with character movement and control). https://github.com/noelfb/celeste https://github.com/noelfb/celeste Apparently it's based on this framework: https://bitbucket.org/MattThorson/monocle-engine/src/default/ https://bitbucket.org/MattThorson/monocle-engine/src/default...
      - AlyssaRowan 8y ago
        They ported the PICO-8 version line by line to C#. Since there aren't that many lines, apparently it wasn't that hard.
    - doppp 8y ago
      There is an SDL port for the Switch but it's under NDA and you need to request access for it [1]. [1] https://twitter.com/icculus/status/981730137736712192 https://twitter.com/icculus/status/981730137736712192
  - rococode 8y ago
    One of the coolest hidden easter eggs in the main release of Celeste is stumbling upon the little room with the PICO-8 version of the game (https://i.imgur.com/7iNbBNA.png https://i.imgur.com/7iNbBNA.png). I didn't know PICO-8 was a thing, so imagine my surprise when I found an entire complete game built into the main game!
  - krajzeg 8y ago
    PICO-8 (and I assume, TIC-80 as well) are actually great for prototyping bigger game development projects - specifically due to its harsh constraints, which force a limited scope and sharp focus on the design. I'm actually in the process of making SlipWays, a fast-paced 4X game for PC that started as a PICO-8 prototype (https://krajzeg.itch.io/slipways https://krajzeg.itch.io/slipways). A major reason for the tight game design of the game were the tight confines on the console.
    - ZebraCakes 8y ago
      I love SlipWays! It's really impressive that you crammed a game that deep into such a small system. That and Celeste were big inspirations to look into PICO-8 myself. Looking forward to the full release.
- TimTheTinker 8y ago
  Boy, wouldn’t it be fun if there was a Z80-based retro console with an 8-bit color screen and easy access from modern machines (USB, etc)?
  - zokier 8y ago
    Something like FAP80 maybe? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13438610 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13438610
  - rweichler 8y ago
    Gameboy Color......? With an Everdrive?
  - FractalLP 8y ago
    http://www.specnext.com/about/ http://www.specnext.com/about/
  - gpdpocketer 8y ago
    Amstrad CPC with a HxC card...
- lloeki 8y ago
  To me it seems that trend started somewhere along with Notch's dcpu16 and assorted virtual hardware from 0x10c.
  - rtpg 8y ago
    Pico 8 and Voxatron (its predecessor/3d succesor) both predate the 0x10c experiment I believe.
    - lloeki 8y ago
      Hmm, I can only trace PICO-8 as far back as late 2014, while 0x10c happened in 2012. However Lexaloffle likes to label it, Voxatron is hardly a fantasy console, it's a voxel game engine (with fantasy console features retrofitted in later on).
- iuguy 8y ago
  That's interesting. I'm currently building a Chip-8 emulator using an Atmega1284, keypad and SSD1306. What ram chip are you using? I've been looking at 23K640 but it's proving a nightmare to get running on a breadboard.
- tokyodude 8y ago
  PICO-8’s limits are partly tbere to try to ensure all games run on all platforms at full speed including raspberry pi. it can export a stand alone game for windows, macos, linux, and html5
opencl 8y ago
They are conceptually very similar and both obviously inspired by the old CHIP-8. TIC-80 is a bit more 'powerful' in that it's a bit higher resolution with double the sprite count. The most substantial differences: >PICO-8 has its own BASIC-like language >TIC-80 is programmed in Lua or JS > >PICO-8 is commercial software, costs $15 >TIC-80 is open source
- ungzd 8y ago
  PICO-8 uses Lua too.
- Ivoah 8y ago
  As ungzd already said, PICO-8 doesn't use its own language, but instead uses a slightly modified version of Lua https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php?page=manual https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php?page=manual
- crashride 8y ago
  PICO-8 uses plain old Lua also; the editor downcases everything on save which is why it seems case-insensitive.
  - springogeek 8y ago
    It also adds a couple of convenience language features and a simplified API, which is why it appears "BASIC-like".
- pull_my_finger 8y ago
  Pico-8 is restrained by design. > The harsh limitations of PICO-8 are carefully chosen to be fun to work with, encourage small but expressive designs and hopefully to give PICO-8 cartridges their own particular look and feel. It can be a little frustrating at first, but if you focus on the other important elements of a good game it can be really satisfying. In addition, there are some people doing some very cool stuff really pushing that limit as far as possible. - https://twitter.com/paloblancogames/status/977653465165025281 https://twitter.com/paloblancogames/status/97765346516502528... - https://hackernoon.com/pico-8-lighting-part-1-thin-dark-line-8ea15d21fed7 https://hackernoon.com/pico-8-lighting-part-1-thin-dark-line... Just to cherry pick a few. Personally, I like the restraints. To add to the others, Pico-8 definitely uses a modified version of Lua 5.1/5.2.
jdabney 8y ago
There is also LIKO-12 which is open source and has changeable "BIOS" and "OS." https://github.com/RamiLego4Game/LIKO-12 https://github.com/RamiLego4Game/LIKO-12
Avshalom 8y ago
pico-8 is a fantasy that probably couldn't have existed with out a whole subsystem below it. Mojang's DCPU-16 is probably closer to a fantasy computer.
kragen 8y ago
PICO-8 is proprietary; TIC-80 is MIT-licensed free software. There is no reason to consider using PICO-8 now that TIC-80 exists.

Lerc 8y ago

The PICO-8 is where the current trend for fantasy consoles began. There's a growing number of them (I'm making one myself). They all have slightly different areas of focus. Some are scripting language based, some emulate CPUs. TIC-80 programs are "64KB of Lua or Moonscript or JavaScript". My own is 8-bit AVR (128k rom, 64k ram). Z80 seems a popular base as well.

wooly_bully 8y ago
Celeste, which was released to rave reviews this past year for the Switch, started life as a PICO-8 game. I played it on the PICO-8 at first and was blown away! Enjoy: https://www.lexaloffle.com/bbs/?tid=2145 https://www.lexaloffle.com/bbs/?tid=2145
- shakna 8y ago
  Do you know how it was ported to the Switch? TIC-80 uses SDL, which doesn't have a working port (for the Switch) so far as I know.
  - theresistor 8y ago
    There's an SDL port, but it can't be publicly distributed due to NDAs.
  - djur 8y ago
    The commercial release of Celeste is a new game, written from scratch, implemented in C# (XNA/FNA/MonoGame). It includes a port of the original. I'm kind of curious if they actually wrote a PICO-8 emulator for that or just ported it to C#.
    - barbs 8y ago
      They have a Github repo with some of the source code up (mostly just stuff to do with character movement and control). https://github.com/noelfb/celeste https://github.com/noelfb/celeste Apparently it's based on this framework: https://bitbucket.org/MattThorson/monocle-engine/src/default/ https://bitbucket.org/MattThorson/monocle-engine/src/default...
    - AlyssaRowan 8y ago
      They ported the PICO-8 version line by line to C#. Since there aren't that many lines, apparently it wasn't that hard.
  - doppp 8y ago
    There is an SDL port for the Switch but it's under NDA and you need to request access for it [1]. [1] https://twitter.com/icculus/status/981730137736712192 https://twitter.com/icculus/status/981730137736712192
- rococode 8y ago
  One of the coolest hidden easter eggs in the main release of Celeste is stumbling upon the little room with the PICO-8 version of the game (https://i.imgur.com/7iNbBNA.png https://i.imgur.com/7iNbBNA.png). I didn't know PICO-8 was a thing, so imagine my surprise when I found an entire complete game built into the main game!
- krajzeg 8y ago
  PICO-8 (and I assume, TIC-80 as well) are actually great for prototyping bigger game development projects - specifically due to its harsh constraints, which force a limited scope and sharp focus on the design. I'm actually in the process of making SlipWays, a fast-paced 4X game for PC that started as a PICO-8 prototype (https://krajzeg.itch.io/slipways https://krajzeg.itch.io/slipways). A major reason for the tight game design of the game were the tight confines on the console.
  - ZebraCakes 8y ago
    I love SlipWays! It's really impressive that you crammed a game that deep into such a small system. That and Celeste were big inspirations to look into PICO-8 myself. Looking forward to the full release.
TimTheTinker 8y ago
Boy, wouldn’t it be fun if there was a Z80-based retro console with an 8-bit color screen and easy access from modern machines (USB, etc)?
- zokier 8y ago
  Something like FAP80 maybe? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13438610 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13438610
- rweichler 8y ago
  Gameboy Color......? With an Everdrive?
- FractalLP 8y ago
  http://www.specnext.com/about/ http://www.specnext.com/about/
- gpdpocketer 8y ago
  Amstrad CPC with a HxC card...
lloeki 8y ago
To me it seems that trend started somewhere along with Notch's dcpu16 and assorted virtual hardware from 0x10c.
- rtpg 8y ago
  Pico 8 and Voxatron (its predecessor/3d succesor) both predate the 0x10c experiment I believe.
  - lloeki 8y ago
    Hmm, I can only trace PICO-8 as far back as late 2014, while 0x10c happened in 2012. However Lexaloffle likes to label it, Voxatron is hardly a fantasy console, it's a voxel game engine (with fantasy console features retrofitted in later on).
iuguy 8y ago
That's interesting. I'm currently building a Chip-8 emulator using an Atmega1284, keypad and SSD1306. What ram chip are you using? I've been looking at 23K640 but it's proving a nightmare to get running on a breadboard.
tokyodude 8y ago
PICO-8’s limits are partly tbere to try to ensure all games run on all platforms at full speed including raspberry pi. it can export a stand alone game for windows, macos, linux, and html5

opencl 8y ago

They are conceptually very similar and both obviously inspired by the old CHIP-8. TIC-80 is a bit more 'powerful' in that it's a bit higher resolution with double the sprite count. The most substantial differences: >PICO-8 has its own BASIC-like language >TIC-80 is programmed in Lua or JS > >PICO-8 is commercial software, costs $15 >TIC-80 is open source

ungzd 8y ago
PICO-8 uses Lua too.
Ivoah 8y ago
As ungzd already said, PICO-8 doesn't use its own language, but instead uses a slightly modified version of Lua https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php?page=manual https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php?page=manual
crashride 8y ago
PICO-8 uses plain old Lua also; the editor downcases everything on save which is why it seems case-insensitive.
- springogeek 8y ago
  It also adds a couple of convenience language features and a simplified API, which is why it appears "BASIC-like".
pull_my_finger 8y ago
Pico-8 is restrained by design. > The harsh limitations of PICO-8 are carefully chosen to be fun to work with, encourage small but expressive designs and hopefully to give PICO-8 cartridges their own particular look and feel. It can be a little frustrating at first, but if you focus on the other important elements of a good game it can be really satisfying. In addition, there are some people doing some very cool stuff really pushing that limit as far as possible. - https://twitter.com/paloblancogames/status/977653465165025281 https://twitter.com/paloblancogames/status/97765346516502528... - https://hackernoon.com/pico-8-lighting-part-1-thin-dark-line-8ea15d21fed7 https://hackernoon.com/pico-8-lighting-part-1-thin-dark-line... Just to cherry pick a few. Personally, I like the restraints. To add to the others, Pico-8 definitely uses a modified version of Lua 5.1/5.2.

jdabney 8y ago

There is also LIKO-12 which is open source and has changeable "BIOS" and "OS." https://github.com/RamiLego4Game/LIKO-12 https://github.com/RamiLego4Game/LIKO-12

Avshalom 8y ago

pico-8 is a fantasy that probably couldn't have existed with out a whole subsystem below it. Mojang's DCPU-16 is probably closer to a fantasy computer.

kragen 8y ago

PICO-8 is proprietary; TIC-80 is MIT-licensed free software. There is no reason to consider using PICO-8 now that TIC-80 exists.