20 ms·
Americans Are a Lonely Lot, and Young People Bear the Heaviest Burden
- juan449 8y agoHurray people, something awesome just happened few days ago. My husband who has already divorced me came back.... All special thanks to lovesolutiontemple1@gmail.com, a priest with a difference powers who help me bring back my husband in just few days, he is a great powerful priest, he can grant help in any kind of relationship problem, he is honest and does what he says he will do, he gave me much confident when i met him and speak with him on video, he did bring my husband back home again, PRIEST MANUKA is great ...... lovesolutiontemple1@gmail.com// facebook priest manuka.
- adamnemecek 8y ago"Millennials are killing socialness."
- frockington 8y agoThanks for the summary, no need to read yet another Millennials are killing ___________ "article"
- maxerickson 8y agoIt merely states that Millennials as a group scored as more lonely than other generations, it doesn't fabricate a reason or cast blame.
- djsumdog 8y agoI like to refer to Adam ruins everything on Millennials: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HFwok9SlQQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HFwok9SlQQ TL;DW Generational titles (Boomers, Gen X, Y, whatever) are invented by authors to sell books. They never bring people up and are always used to tear people down. Everything said about Millennials has been said about every generation ever. You can take a Time magazine cover from the 50s about the entitled generation and slap a modern photo on it and it's the same damn thing. It's lazy. Millennials are the most diverse of any generation. That's about all you can really say, other than we're the most in debt and most likely to take unpaid internships compared to any previous generation. It's a straw man and it needs to die.
- nylonstrung 8y agoI agree with what you have said but there's also no denying that the amount of time at formative ages spent on social media and the internet is unquestionably greater than past generations. I have trouble believing that hasn't contributed to some idiosyncratic issues that weren't seen in other generations (as well as benefits)
- drchickensalad 8y agoAnd that might only increase in the future
- _rpd 8y agoIf "hell is other people," we are that much closer to heaven.
- ProAm 8y agoIm skeptical of any study run by an insurance company.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- deweller 8y agoHealth insurance providers have every incentive to make people healthier - or at least use medical services less.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- Xeoncross 8y ago> nearly 50 percent of respondents reporting that they feel alone or left out Self-centeredness runs high these days. Us young people want the world to cater to us. However, two self-centered people don't get along that great. If I want to make friends, then I have to choose to actively put time and energy into someone else; sometimes without getting much back. The most lonely I've ever been (or ever seen someone else), is when I am totally self-focused - spending all my time on my plans and situation and looking for ways people can fit into those plans. This isn't the only problem, but it's certainly a player.
- toomuchtodo 8y agoI'm not sure why you're downvoted, this is most definitely contributing towards the problem, along with a (perceived?) lack of tolerance to other people's values and beliefs. Somewhere we diverged from "live and let live" and "meet the other person half way" to "if you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best" at scale. "Social Selfishness" or "The Peacock Effect", and it seems social networks galvanize attitudes in this direction. Unsolicited advice: Delete your Facebook and Twitter, leave your phone in your pocket or your car, and enjoy the company of others over a meal or shared activity. Listen more than you speak. Give the benefit of the doubt. Be present in the moment. Be mindful about your emotions when your beliefs or values conflict with those of others. Make the effort to stay in touch with those you love and/or care about (phone or email works, postcards are fun). Empathize.
- psyc 8y ago2/3 of Twitter appears to have no other purpose than to continually identify minor differences of opinion and perceived grievances, and then invite all your followers to castigate the offender.
- aantix 8y agoI can't upvote this enough. The Social Justice Warrior scene seems more concerned about embarrassing anyone that disagrees, posting passive/aggressive meme gifs, and receiving likes/retweets than solving any real issue.
- asperous 8y agoNon text-only link: https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/05/01/606588504/americans-are-a-lonely-lot-and-young-people-bear-the-heaviest-burden https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/05/01/6065885...
- dang 8y agoUrl changed to that from https://text.npr.org/s.php?sId=606588504 https://text.npr.org/s.php?sId=606588504.
- frgtpsswrdlame 8y agoWell we've rooted our political thought in individualism for decades. Politicians and market actors have viewed people as atomistic and so society has been shaped to reflect that view. Perhaps we are now far enough away from the threat of communism that we can realize there is a balance to be had between the individual and the collective.
- oh_sigh 8y ago'American individualism' has always been focused on the community, but in a peer to peer connected sense versus a top-down hierarchical sense. It's not like we consider been who just trudge into the woods and live like a hermit to be living the American dream.
- Mediterraneo10 8y ago> 'American individualism' has always been focused on the community, but in a peer to peer connected sense versus a top-down hierarchical sense. Considering how much brutal treatment workers coming together to form unions have faced from their employers and the state alike over the last century-plus, I wouldn’t say that American society is entirely fine with community provided that they are grassroots, peer-to-peer efforts.
- frgtpsswrdlame 8y agoThat's my point though, it's a view of community as composed of the atomistic unit: the individual. Even your language, 'peer to peer' portrays the community as composed of individuals. I think that individuals are just as composed of their communities as their communities are composed of individuals, there is no 'atomistic' unit to society. Even Tocqueville wrote about it: there are more and more people who though neither rich nor powerful enough to have much hold over others, have gained or kept enough wealth and enough understanding to look after their own needs. Such folk owe no man anything and hardly expect anything from anybody. They form the habit of thinking of themselves in isolation and imagine that their whole destiny is in their hands. and later: Each man is forever thrown back on himself alone, and there is danger that he may be shut up in the solitude of his own heart. The hermit isn't just someone who lives in the woods. It's someone who lives in the woods and doesn't come down. A hermit is someone who opts out of the obligations of community. To that extent I think most of us are hermits now. How many groups other than family and the closest friends does the average person now feel a strong obligation to? I'd say very few.
- sudouser 8y agoBut hey, Facebook is getting everyone connected®
- dageshi 8y agoI would say it's a lot easier to distract yourself than it ever has been before.
- phil248 8y agoNo doubt, but it's also much easier to find a date, find an activity group, find an online community for shared interests, and stay in touch with distant friends and relatives.
- zitterbewegung 8y agoI go to Meetups to make friends and influence people. It has basically become more and more of my social life as time goes on.
- mkirklions 8y agoWhich meetups?
- zitterbewegung 8y agoPhilosophy , software engineering (JS , python , react, solditity ) , cryptocurrencies and machine learning .
- cjmoran 8y agoMeetups are great because usually nobody's counting on you to be there (no pressure for introverts like me), but after you've attended enough there will always be someone there who you already know and can introduce you to others. I don't go to software meetups, though. I get enough of that stuff from working/side projects/etc. Nothing against them, I just feel that filling my free/social time with more programming content might cause me to burn out even faster than I already am. My suggestion: find a meetup for something completely unrelated to your work, like bicycling, board/video games, camping.
- zitterbewegung 8y agoI find that the programming meetups counteract burn out . Making friends in the industry means they know the stuff you are going through. The other thing is that if you dislike your job it’s a great way to get a new one.
- chiefalchemist 8y ago> ", with nearly 50 percent of respondents reporting that they feel alone or left out always or sometimes." > "The survey found that the average loneliness score in America is 44, which suggests that "most Americans are considered lonely," Certainly, mental health has been ignored for far too long. That said, there seems to be a lack of context here. - Is this an increase or decrease? - How does it compare to other countries / cultures? - Was this over time, or a snap shot, that would (I would think) be influenced by the current mental state of the person giving the answer? I don't mean to sound cold and lacking in empathy but without transparency my first reaction is: C'est la vie. Life, by definition has highs and lows. I'm not doubting there are people who need treatment / attention. On the other hand, the way this seems to be executed and presented feels like a pitch for more funding, etc. p.s. Why was it / is it called the Loneliness Index? Or was that a self-fulfilling prophesy? Is that part of the pitch for attention?
- coldtea 8y ago>More than half of survey respondents — 54 percent — said they always or sometimes feel that no one knows them well. Fifty-six percent reported they sometimes or always felt like the people around them "are not necessarily with them." And 2 in 5 felt like "they lack companionship," that their "relationships aren't meaningful" and that they "are isolated from others." Well, chasing money and success as ultimate goals, glorifying individualism, being hell bent on branding oneself and selling it, valuing consumerism, and closing into comfort zones etc., comes with a cost.
- ForRealsies 8y agoSouth Korea has had the highest suicide rate in the industrialized world for eight consecutive years. Their culture doesn't glorify/promote individualism, but conformity. I would argue that "chasing money and success" is a trademark characteristic of what young people AREN'T doing, yet this study states they are the Loneliness age group.
- CodeMage 8y agoIt's almost as if you could arrive to similar results in different ways, not only one... Seriously, though, your comment seems to assume South Korean suicide rate is motivated by loneliness. If that's the case, you might want to give the rest of us an argument to support that assumption.
- Footkerchief 8y agoHow do you look at South Korea and conclude that people there aren't chasing money and success? "In 2014 alone, some 840,000 companies sprang up, in a country with a population of 50 million. This high number of enterprises relative to GDP suggests that opening a business is a poplar economic activity for many South Koreans." https://thediplomat.com/2016/01/what-entrepreneurship-means-to-south-koreans/ https://thediplomat.com/2016/01/what-entrepreneurship-means-...
- coldtea 8y ago>South Korea has had the highest suicide rate in the industrialized world for eight consecutive years. Their culture doesn't glorify/promote individualism, but conformity. Did they used to have those suicide rates since forever? Because in the past they were even more conformist (or you think e.g. 50s or feudal Korea was more individualistic?). And of course they chase after work and money like crazy there...
- centra1985 8y agoIt can be really hard for adults to make new friends, especially if they move to a new city/State for work etc which is contributing towards loneliness. Lots of apps like GirlCrew are popping up to help combat loneliness among adults in the US, particularly women aged 25-40. For many the loneliness comes from the fact that all their friends have got married/settled down and they are the last singleton in the group.
- mkirklions 8y agoI think if you force yourself to 'go out' and join activities you enjoy, its easy to meet new people. The next step is following up with the new people. My advice- Be okay with failure. Most people will not follow up, but the ones that do are keepers. 9/10 people will let you down, find the 10%.
- pm90 8y agoThis is excellent advice. Its really just about trying to spend time doing what you enjoy with other people who enjoy it too. Can be biking, running, video games, dancing, hiking or some sport. The activity makes it enjoyable, sharing with others even more so.
- rhodysurf 8y agoI agree completely. Effort is the largest component in meeting new people IMO.
- crush_xc 8y agoand guess what I'm doing in the next 4 weeks... Really trying to formulate a plan for when I move across the country to try and make friends and have a life.
- com2kid 8y agoMy startup, www.thawd.net, is aiming to fix the exact same problem. Move to a new city and we aim to find you groups of people to hang out with. We also support couples finding other couples to spend time with, and arbitrarily sized groups of people who want to meet new people. It is a space that needs a lot of help, where there is an obvious need to help people live happier lives.
- LastZactionHero 8y agoAnyone wanna grab a beer?
- alexandercrohde 8y agoAre you in NYC?
- djsumdog 8y agoor Chicago?
- LastZactionHero 8y agoBoulder, CO
- levim 8y agoI am and would be down to grab a beer
- alexandercrohde 8y agoCool. Could you send an email to the address on my profile?
- ahstilde 8y agoI can't find an email in your profile, friend.
- alexandercrohde 8y agoMy mistake. I have one entered, but I guess the email field is private. I've corrected it now
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- djsumdog 8y agoIt doesn't look like there's a distinction between friendship loneliness and romantic loneliness in the article (not sure if there's one in the actual studies). I'd hypothesis that the difficulty for most isn't making friends (meetups or shared interest groups like dancing, knitting, boardgames, kickboxing, group instrument lessons, etc), but in partnerships. I think people are really afraid today. Dating sites/apps seem to make it worse, reducing individuals to a photo as a primary interest mechanism. I'm really curious of the huge disparity between men/women messaging one another on such platforms. Women tend to get inundated with messages where as men are typically responsible for initiating. Some platforms try to flip this around like Bumble, but it doesn't seem to really change the dynamic at all (some men get tons of responses while the rest get zero). There just isn't enough depth in this article to draw out any real conclusions about loneliness, the various types of alone-ness and what to do about it.
- notadoc 8y ago> I'm really curious of the huge disparity between men/women messaging one another on such platforms. Women tend to get inundated with messages where as men are typically responsible for initiating. You're basically seeing sexual selection and Bateman's principle at an exaggerated scale, because online dating makes it very easy for males to cast wide nets repeatedly thereby allowing women to be even choosier for their partners.
- majormajor 8y ago> I'd hypothesis that the difficulty for most isn't making friends (meetups or shared interest groups like dancing, knitting, boardgames, kickboxing, group instrument lessons, etc), but in partnerships. I've mostly seen the opposite. People whose social lives were centered around dating and meeting people through that, who then settled down, and now don't know how to make just "friend" friends. Would the two have the same root cause? That's an interesting question - many claim that "tech" (in the abstract, or in the specific eg "facebook likes") are responsible for both, but I don't really buy it. I don't know what historical rate information we have, but there have always been some loners. They have an easier-to-access platform today, does that skew our perception?
- grasshopperpurp 8y ago>328. If for company you find a wise and prudent friend who leads a good life, you should, overcoming all impediments, keep his company joyously and mindfully. 329. If for company you cannot find a wise and prudent friend who leads a good life, then, like a king who leaves behind a conquered kingdom, or like a lone elephant in the elephant forest, you should go your way alone. 330. Better it is to live alone; there is no fellowship with a fool. Live alone and do no evil; be carefree like and elephant in the elephant forest. https://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/buddhism/dp23.htm https://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/buddhism/dp23.htm
- justboxing 8y ago> 321. A tamed elephant is led into a crowd, and the king mounts a tamed elephant. Best among men is the subdued one who endures abuse. Not sure I can agree with this, especially as a man. Essentially saying neuter and emasculate yourself , so the King will ride your ass for the rest of your life and you'll live a content life.
- Bartweiss 8y ago> neuter and emasculate yourself... and you'll live a content life. A lot of Buddhist advice becomes very strange when taken into a secular context. It feels like there's a sense in the West of Buddhism as "less religious" than other faiths because it's less engaged with a deity, but that's a misleading approach. It's worth remembering that most Buddhist traditions don't expect enlightenment in one lifetime, and do believe in literal, bodily reincarnation based on your behavior in this life. I can't speak to this specific verse, but "best among men is one who endures abuse" is the sort of sentiment which is very different in a world where the one abused will be reincarnated and seeks an end to that cycle more than they seek present benefit. There are bits worth using in a secular context, but as with most faiths we should also expect some advice that's grossly wrong without its spiritual framework. (This is also worth remembering when we talk about corporate Buddhist meditation retreats and the like. They seem to assume that if enlightenment is the death of desire and ego, a little Buddhism will be a decrease of greed and selfishness. There are a lot of Buddhist traditions which are very much not about that sort of linear progress.)
- DanielBMarkham 8y agoI had an interesting conversation earlier today. Let's say that we are in a small team, maybe five or six people. One person comes to work sad, upset. Nothing has to be said. We stop what we're doing and help, right? We're not schmucks. We take time to listen, we reassure the person they're important, we celebrate their being part of our group. Now let's expand the scale several orders of magnitude and change the medium. We are now part of some online system: Facebook, Twitter, Snapchat, whatever. There are tens of millions of people all in one big virtual room. Somebody mentions they are upset online. When we see something wrong or something we care about online, we type things in -- somewhere. We feel moved to act. Without something being said, the feelings don't exist to us. Does that really do what it's supposed to be doing? I know our motivations are good, and in many cases there are fine words provided, but are we really helping and caring about people simply because we're tweeting, retweeting, hashtagging, typing our personal stories in, and so forth? Is a text message saying "You are important to us" the same as going over to somebody, giving them a hug, having them look around the room at people who care about them, and telling them same thing? Assuming it is, there's huge bunch of people involved. On any one day, a million people could be living out some horrible experience because of something in their lives. How could we know unless they type things in, and what kinds of things are those folks going to feel if they type things in and nobody responds? I don't know which is worse. Maybe this type of communication is effectively showing our feelings and makes a difference -- and some people are just going to be ignored. Or maybe it's just so much self-stimulation, telling ourselves we're somehow doing something of importance when in fact all we're doing is making various people internet famous from day to day. We tech folks keep assuming that human communication somehow all boils down to bits moving over a wire. That may be a terribly lossy way of looking at it.
- TimJYoung 8y agoMy wife and I had the same conversation a couple of days ago, and my wife made the exact same concise point: we keep telling ourselves that socializing online is the same as socializing in person, but it's a lie and the sooner that we stop, the better off we'll be.
- eun34ntueon 8y ago> are we really helping and caring about people simply because we're tweeting, retweeting, hashtagging, typing our personal stories in, and so forth? I think the people in the #metoo movement would say that, yes, simply getting the support of a retweet, or being able to tweet about an experience you had that hurt you is very useful and helpful.
- whitepoplar 8y agoI think we're lonely because we have too many choices. When I can go to any meetup, any concert, any social function, any whatever, it makes me less likely to make friends, not more. Looking at my own experience, I didn't even particularly like my friends when I first met them. Several of them seemed outright repulsive. It took several months of being in the same "sticky" social situation to bond--long periods of time in the same school, sport, club, neighborhood, etc. If I had the opportunity to transplant myself into another social situation after the first day/week, I'd never have made any of those friendships. How can we keep the same group of people stuck together for a sufficient amount of time? I think that's the secret for creating friendships and curing loneliness.
- graphitezepp 8y agoIt really is ALL about getting stuck together with people. Friendship is more about familiarity and mutual understanding than similar tastes or whatever initial compatibility people over value. Anecdotally some of my most meaningful friendships are people I legitimately hated but were forced to learn how to get along with.
- billmalarky 8y ago> Friendship is more about familiarity and mutual understanding than similar tastes or whatever initial compatibility people over value. This is exactly how Data interprets friendship. I'm not sure what my point is other than I've been hooked on Star Trek TNG recently. I can't get enough ever since I realized it isn't a show about space and aliens -- it's a show in which the entire premise seems to be simply a story of fascinating interrelationships that form when a diverse team faces unique problems. I LOVE IT.
- ender89 8y agoI don't necessarily agree. I Think that does happen, in fact thats more or less how I met my best friend. But I think coincidence plays a far deeper role. I've made some great friends online just by happening to be playing in the same match and accepting an invitation to a group for no reason. I remember how I joined my six man destiny clan - three years ago I was playing in the iron banner and just so happened to party up. We then played all weekend and for the next three years. Same thing happened when I joined a group that messaged me because my gamertag was coincidentally related to their group name.
- mc32 8y agoUnless we do a comprehensive comparative study across countries, this will be like trying to determine if you’re upside down while spinning in space. You have no concurrent frame of reference other than historical. Is the trend American only, part of the consequences of an economic system, a society, progress in general, etc.
- bhnmmhmd 8y agoLoneliness is: - When you try so hard to make friends and still they ignore you. - When you know you have some really good qualities and characteristics, but are not appreciated for them. - When you realize you're not important to other people; whether you go to school/work/university tomorrow or not doesn't affect others and they won't notice. - When you see all those couples around you and in the street, and think about "what's wrong with me?" and "why don't I have something like that?" - When you realize you've put in too much effort and enthusiasm to help people and make contact with them, but haven't received much in return; as if you were just a tool for them. - When you just want to spend your time with a person and realize they don't like spending their time with you. - When you are too alone that you don't even know where to begin in order to stop being lonely. This is what fking loneliness feels like.
- s73v3r_ 8y ago"- When you see all those couples around you and in the street, and think about "what's wrong with me?" and "why don't I have something like that?"" Unfortunately, and I count myself in this, a lot of people are unwilling to take that deep look inside to be able to answer that question.
- eezurr 8y agoYou dont necessarily have to take a deep look into yourself. Instead, imagine meeting yourself and ask yourself whether or not the person you are now is worth putting time and commitment into. If not, why not? Then work on fixing the parts of you that you dont connect with.
- bhnmmhmd 8y agoThat's good advice, but unfortunately I've come to realize this doesn't work. Simply because I don't have the mindset of the opposite sex; I'd care about things that only matter to me (and other guys), not things that a girl would find interesting.
- 8y ago
- Esperaux 8y agointeresting maybe as the amount of people who feel lonely rises we will see more horrific attacks with motivation similar to the Toronto attacker and Elliot Rodgers.
- davidw 8y agoThis is something I miss about Italy. It was just easier to meet people. I don't know if it's just that people are more sociable, that spaces make it easier (not everyone is walled off in their car/suburban house all the time) or what.
- _jal 8y ago> not everyone is walled off in their car/suburban house all the time I can't compare to Italy, but I find suburban US bleaker and more isolating than I did living in Germany. My suggestion would be to go to your nearest urban area. Even the worst car-centric US cities have walkable parts - in a pinch, figure out where the local college is to start. Apologies to those who like them, but suburbs are culture-deprived wastelands[1]. Go somewhere where people actually want to engage with the world and you'll have better luck. [1] Obviously, I like cities. But even rural life is better - much cheaper, and instead of the illusion of privacy, you can actually be alone.
- 0x4f3759df 8y agoPossible causes: Death of retail: No social record stores, no social book stores, arcades Internet everywhere: People on laptops at coffeehouse, on mobile phones at bus stop / checkout Bad Transit/Urbanism/Public policy: Streets for cars, no plazas like the Italians, can't drink a bottle of wine in a public park
- djsumdog 8y agoHow many people really met in record stores or arcades? I'd usually just go there with friends. I knew one person who met their husband in a comic book store. As for transit, that is a huge US problem for sure. But don't blame the Internet or phones. Look at videos from the 50s/60s and you'll see just as many people silent on the train/tram/bus reading magazines or newspapers. By the 80s they'd have newspapers and the nerds would have walkmans. By the 90s it was more common for even-non nerdy types to carry discmans and now, everyone wears headphones. But that's always been there, it's not really new.
- notadoc 8y agoEngaging in social media is largely an anti-social activity. How many times have you been in a restaurant, bar, or other public space, and noticed groups of people all staring at their phones on 'social' media, rather than engaging in the actual social situation around them? Or how many times have you been at someones house, or even in your own home, and looked to find a child, friend, partner, family member, staring at their phone, rather than engaging with the real world? How many times has that person been you, staring blindly into the screen rather than engaging with actual humans around you?
- djsumdog 8y agoRarely. Like people might check their phone if they get a message or need to respond to a spouse. But the majority of my friends, if in a bar or shop or party, rarely ever look at their phones .. unless a good several minutes go by and no one talks to them and it's a way to avoid boredom or awkwardness. I mean people look at them when they're alone on a bus or train, but I mean before that we just looked at books or magazines. It's like a better book or magazine that's interactive.
- cjmoran 8y agoI agree, I think people are putting too much stock in this idea that "phones and social media are killing real social interaction!" It's definitely true that some people have issues "unplugging." One fried of mine comes to mind; I'll go get dinner with this guy and he'll stare at his iPhone grinding away at some mobile MMO or messaging other friends the entire time, while I'm left to eat my food in near silence (until he finds some hilarious image or video I absolutely need to see, at which point his phone gets thrust in my face). I can even ask the dude a question or make some remark and watch him miss it completely, only to ask "oh did you say something?" about 2 minutes later. People like my friend need some kind of intervention for sure, but I'm not convinced that a majority of people behave like this. I'm very social and this is the only friend I can name with this sort of problem.
- bradlys 8y agoIt sounds like a lot of people feel like they're missing out. This could be because so many on social media are trying to imitate the image of that lifefaker website that came up here recently. It's no surprise that the 18-22 age group feels the worst. They're the ones cultivating this fake life image the most! If you're connected to 500 people and each person has 2-3 days a year that are "lifefaker" worthy... then it's pretty obvious how you'd feel left out. Each day you'll see 5 amazing posts that make you feel like you're living a terrible life. This is pretty standard stuff. It's standard by young people to not share sad things or things that won't fetch a lot of likes or envy. It's common to post things that aren't even happening now or recently but to share moments from the past that were great even if your life is pretty crap at the moment. It's about creating the image that your life is fantastic even if it really isn't.
- com2kid 8y agoEven worse than this, people start optimizing their life to be lifefaker worthy. My wife and I bought a drone for, honestly, just this purpose, and as has been repeatedly mentioned, more and more restaurants plate their food to look good photo'd and posted online. The local cherry blossom season is over crowded with people taking pictures, some of them bring out DSLRs just for the occasion. There is a local tulip festival that has changed over the years from admiring nature to being a great photo op. The world is becoming optimizing for photo ops, it is now pretty easy to get in more than 2-3 photo-perfect days a year.
- djsumdog 8y agoI don't think this is it at all. I never read facebook/twitter posts (I just use FB for the messenger), and I know I'm not missing out. In my late 20s I took jobs in the South Pacific and spent a year backpacking through Asia/Europe. I've also done a 5 month drive across the US. I've literally done the world travel thing (and loved it) but I still often feel lonely. Part of that is moving and starting in new cities a lot, but part of it is just difficultly in finding a partner. Within two years of being in a city I usually have a strong core group of friends, but romantic partners are much harder to establish (distinguishing between friendship loneliness vs romantic loneliness). By your argument, maybe I'm part of the problem. :-P I only use social media to promote my own blog with details about travels or my photography, so maybe I make people feel left out. But then again, I still feel lonely myself. I think your statement tries to narrow down something that's a much more complicated issue. And what you said may be true for some people experience loneliness, but not all for sure.
- danans 8y ago> The survey also found that working too little or too much is also associated with the experience of loneliness, suggesting that our workplaces are an important source of our social relationships and also that work-life balance is important for avoiding loneliness. This paragraph hints at what might be a significant factor in increased loneliness: A lack of community. Community can be a workplace or it could be a neighborhood, but in both it's a place where you feel like you and your colleagues/neighbors "have each-others' back". It's not even important that you are all best friends, just that you trust each-other enough. These two, work and home, are of particular importance vs the other venues that we inhabit, because for most people, our time is spent either working, or in the neighborhood in which we live. If neither provides a trusting-enough sense of community, you don't have much time left in your life to find that elsewhere. But for many people a trusted community is inaccessible for a variety of social, cultural, and economic reasons. Many (most?) workplaces don't offer a sense of community (which is fine, they shouldn't have to if that's not what their workers are seeking), and many people - especially younger adults - live in neighborhoods where they don't know many people around them.
- borplk 8y agoYes and the remaining one (and often the only one) is family. For many people workplace and neighbourhood have no sense of community at all and if you are single as well effectively you have no one to fall back to. Sure you can go to a coffee shop with your gym friend or coworker once in a while but when you seriously need someone like if you get sick or need a shoulder to cry on it's not going to work with people with whom you don't have a intimate high priority relationship like partner or family.
- jboles 8y agoCould this be related to the recent rise in tribalism and identity politics in American culture? In the sense that, without genuine connections to other people, some people focus on superficial characteristics as a way of belonging?
- dragonwriter 8y ago
- acd 8y agoThe open question is what technology replaces? For example what does social media replace? Does it replace real in person interaction between friends? Does it replace calling someone with text? Does it replace opportunities to meet up and connect in person? What does Netflix and streaming video apps replace, did it replace going with your friends to the video store renting a movie together? What does online shopping replace? Does it replace real human interaction asking someone in a physical store for advice what to purchase? These questions are going to get more real as we get more robotics and automation around us. If you work remote most of the time, then all interactions will be through online chat rooms. Coworking is a solution to that.
- eezurr 8y agoYour thoughts reflect my own questions about technology. I feel every year, a tiny bit of my agency is chipped away through automation or simplification. I feel like every (in person) human interaction we have refreshes our ability to communicate and connect with people, and probably makes the brain happy on some primal/chemical level. Bit by bit, these brief interactions are being removed from our lives (self checkouts, online shopping, google maps/GPS, online dating etc). I thought having more time to focus on myself would be great--and it was, on the surface. But now I see great importance in smiling and saying hello to a cashier, or stopping a stranger to ask for directions. The eye contact.. the warmth of another human. It's really important.
- proverbialbunny 8y agoSure, it replaces some things, but not what is imho important for shaving off depression and anxiety and probably a lot more than I know. When people physically hang out, be it at meetups, or something similar, there is a sort of physical activity and energy that reduces (or even removes) depression for days at a time in many people. (I think the trick is to socialize in a non-judgemental atmosphere.) I'm probably biased as I regularly went to meetups and traveled, but I've worked remote, and I did not have any problems with it on the loneliness front. If anything, it helped reduce my anxiety and depression because I was experiencing less shallow faceless conversations, and instead my social interactions were me being me talking about my day or geeking out about something. When you come to expect social to be that positive experience, instead of a chore, anxiety goes down, and from that depression can too.
- austincheney 8y ago> It finds that loneliness is widespread in America, with nearly 50 percent of respondents reporting that they feel alone or left out always or sometimes. I know this is going to sound a bit hostile to younger generations, but perhaps if they put their phones down and stopped looking at screens they would see the person sitting across the room. Perhaps they might even talk to that person.
- OnMyPhone 8y agoSeeing people glued to their phones while out somewhere social infuriates me to no end. If that's their thing, then so be it. At least they're usually quiet while doing it. But hearing them bitch about their shitty social life while not even looking up on their phone to look at the person across from them (who's usually on their phone too) boggles my mind. I have noticed this happens more to younger people, but I have seen quite a fair share of older people doing the same thing. The good thing about seeing this in public is that I feel like a jackass if I think about doing it. So I just leave my phone in my car or at home when I'm with someone.
- EdSharkey 8y agoI think young boys are being treated terribly. I am so disturbed by this and am to the point where I feel compelled to intercede in the emotional life of a troubled young relative of mine. In my opinion, the problem is that we're no longer celebrating masculinity, but rather it seems we trash it at every opportunity nowadays. Not sure how much that weighs on the loneliness problem, but I suspect having young men not acting like men isn't helping with our collective well-being and sociability.
- s73v3r_ 8y agoI think we're trashing the toxic masculinity. The idea that men should always be stoic; should not have any feelings, and are supposed to be the epitome of manliness and power.
- the_gastropod 8y agoI think both of these can be true. I think (hope?) most people would agree that the toxically masculine way we often raise boys ("no crying! man up! don't be a wuss!") is abusive and awful. In the critical response to this kind of toxic masculinity, I think some of the rhetoric has been a bit inelegant, and has made some men feel attacked. I think it's especially easy for boys/young men to struggle to grok the necessary nuance to these kinds of discussions.
- jessaustin 8y agoDisplays of emotion from men are quite unwelcome in many contexts. Perhaps that is less true than in the past, but if this is changing it is changing very slowly.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- EdSharkey 8y agoI think the "toxic masculinity" label isn't being heard by young males quite the way you intend. Drumming the word 'toxic' in front of 'masculinity' and a lot of kids are going to believe, "it's poisonous to be male". That's because kids lack the insights and knowledge to think beyond the literal meanings of those words. I wonder if you think there won't be consequences to your words? I wonder what you think the consequences might be? I hope you'll be pleased to learn that aggressive tendencies can encouraged, shepherded, and focused towards the positive. So, perhaps "unfocused aggression" is the more politically correct negative label you were searching for? Your word choice is too full of hurt. (I'm sorry if some men have hurt you.) It's not a spite thing, but we just cannot let your feelings win the day, and you have to lose this fight for all our sakes. We want our men to be aggressive, competent, and noble creatures after all. We'll silence your "toxic masculinity" messages at every opportunity with our powerful charm and energy. We'll show our young men how to be the boss and love our women too. ;)
- jernfrost 8y agoI am Norwegian and I believe we also have problems with loneliness in Scandinavia, but perhaps not this severe. While living in the US I did in fact feel very lonely. It was easy to make lots of friends, but most friendships felt fairly shallow. I felt people in America was so into putting on a facade all the time rather than showing their true self and their vulnerabilities. It could of course just be a cultural difference, the place I was in or whatever. But regardless it was one of the reasons I left the US. I've been able to find deeper friendships in other countries. Although no place has it been so quick to make friends as in the US, getting invited to people's home etc. So Americans are easy to be around and fun to hang around. But when you are alone in a country without family, you feel a need to have some really close friends.
- randomwhatever 8y agoI might be biased, but try north of Portugal. You have that quick friendliness you get in the USA, but after a few times, they will have no worries opening up to you with any problem or life situation. ps: I'm from there, and lived in most of Europe and various places in Portugal, even when I was away from Porto for 4 years, coming back, I made a bunch of new friends (and reconnected with older ones) that I have a deep connection with!
- 394852034 8y agoIt's what happens when your culture and society has been gutted by the elite who have sold you out to globalism and multiculturalism in the pursuit of personal enrichment. American culture and society has been totally and utterly eviscerated and shattered and destroyed and ground down, which has been going on since the early 60s. This is the future everyone else has to look forward to if you follow us down this path like Europe is continuing down. I know that won't be well received by many, but fact of the matter is that the reality that the subject article describes is not only the consequence of the self-destructive evisceration of American culture perpetrated by the liberal/communist forces in America, and it is the future Europe has to look forward to. I would like to warn all other societies, Indians, Chinese, Japanese, ... anyone else. Let this be a warning to you. Do not under any circumstances allow liberals to spread in your society. They are a real world zombie apocalypse that will destroy your culture and societies just as it is burning through American culture and society and is starting to accelerate in Europe. You are on the sidelines of a monumental historic event; the total and utter implosion of a dominant and previously flourishing society and culture through self-imposed destruction. Pay attention and enshrine it in your culture to never let liberalism, the obsessive entitlement and taking all that others created for them as granted by spoiled rotten brats. Yes, Americans are lonely, because liberals destroyed culture and society and communities ... all while proclaiming they were going to improve all of them. They are a scourge on humanity and you must eradicate them wherever you can without mercy. They are the forces of evil and entropy.
- vinceguidry 8y agoIt's hard to learn how to spend time with others. Once the external reasons are gone, (mostly school) you're left with the uncomfortable reality that a social life doesn't just make itself. Tools like social media give us more choice, but choice can only lead the horse to water. You have to take a step outside your comfort zone if you want to actually have friends. I got lucky in some respects, I generally disliked my military coworkers, and I didn't want to only have them in my socializing pool, so I started spending lots of time off base. The habit stuck, and to this day I spend weekend mornings socializing at a coffee shop. But I can see how lots of people get stuck in a rut of unfulfilling computer friendships and worse, Internet romances. Much as we bemoan the role of social media, I suspect the real issue is that lots of Americans just have higher standards for who they'll spend time with, and just as 15-20 years ago, most people still don't work on their social skills. Used to be, even if you didn't agree with someone politically, you could still have an amicable conversation. Nowadays it seems like a lost art, nobody wants to even try. Everyone wants dead assurance that they're not "wasting their time." All this is to say, I'm not all that sympathetic to the "epidemic" of loneliness, especially in young people, it feels like just another form of entitlement. Connecting with others is hard. Do it anyway.
- dkoubsky 8y agoI like this a lot. I also believe that taking complete responsibility for all of the issues in your life (some call it extreme ownership) is better than the inverse. If everything is your fault then at least you can try to change it, but if nothing is your fault then you're hopeless.
- BadassFractal 8y agoBeing a secular founder in tech seems exceptionally lonely. Especially when it comes to dating. You don't have school or church as traditional recurring ways to network with people with your values. You cannot make friends at work (they're your employees, not your buddies, you might have to let them go any day, and often you do), you cannot date at work, and that's the one thing you spend 10-12 hours a day at. Most of social gatherings within your sphere of influence (tech and entrepreneurship) are very male-dominated as well. And you live in the Bay, where you relocated for work, losing your existing network. Your family and old friends are possibly thousands of miles away. And the Bay is again all about tech and a skewed gender ratio. Even when you do make friends and expand your social circle, it's always more men. You're stuck with the rather soul-sucking process of online dating and spending hours swiping on strangers who are about as jaded about the process as you are. I suppose you have to find a co-ed hobby and hope that one day you run into someone who's a match through that. But realistically, how many new people will you meet through that?
- fogzen 8y agoBest thing I did for my social life was stop working in tech and using tech as much as possible. I visit the same cafe every morning and now know all the regulars. I stopped buying groceries online and go to the store now. I call friends instead of texting and plan outings. I ride a bike and stop to chat with people wherever I go. I don’t watch TV, or play video games. I go the bookstore (only one left in my city) instead of Amazon, and I chat with people in the bookstore. I now deeply regret working as a software engineer in my 20s, as I’ve realized it contributed massively to my loneliness. Which is sad because I used to be so excited about technology and now I see it as the biggest trend in reducing quality of life. It seems the more interactions that are mediated by technology the less human contact we have.
- soulnothing 8y agoIf you don't mind me asking what career did you switch too? I've long thought of leaving software.
- fogzen 8y agoI don’t have a career. I don’t want one anymore. I work for low wage at a sign shop part time, and do consulting part time. I have some software side projects but they don’t make much money. I’m saving all the money from consulting and odd jobs to put towards starting some sort of small business, but I don’t know what yet. I sometimes build bikes and sell them.
- static_noise 8y agoHow do you finance your daily living?
- hackits 8y agoPretty easy to eat a healthy diet of legumes, chick-peas, vegetables, white meat on a low budget. Use a bike to get around.
- Codewyn 8y agoI have an idea: lonely young people can volunteer to spend their time with lonely old people (who there are far more of) instead of having a pity party.
- Mikho 8y agoSocial networks made this happen. They give a feeling of inclusion and conversation while they are just a surrogate and imitation of a real human connection. Previously one had to make itself go out to meet real people and train itself to be social in real life -- being alone at home was too lonely. Today sitting in front of a screen with a beer in a kitchen and participating in some absolutely irrelevant to our life flame with people one doesn't know and doesn't care about gives a perverted sense of socialization and inclusion. But at the end of a day, a person stays alone without real friends. Instead, it'd be better to invite friends to go to a bar or a bicycle ride -- but it's so tempting and effortless to just go online and just sit on a sofa. Wonder how the next generation is even going to breed.
- Karishma1234 8y agoWould love to see the data split by race. My bet is that this is a white and asian people specific problem and not applicable to Hispanics and Blacks.
- ttonkytonk 8y agoCan you explain why?
- kiviuq 8y agoThis is the price for Americas individualism I guess.
- kadenshep 8y agoAnd what if a significant portion of these people are actually just terrible people to hang out with in sociable contexts? I see a lot of discussion around blaming tech, or even funnily enough thinking that males aren't somehow allowed to be masculine is the cause for this (well, maybe it's related, though not for reasons the OP wants it to be). I see it as the opposite. The U.S. with the newer generations is maturing, socially. We don't just associate with people because of where they're from, what they look like (for the most part), or who they want to have in their bed. What I think we're getting better at judging is the actual characteristics of substance that make hanging out with people great. Anecdotally, I know of a few people that I would from an outside perspective consider "lonely." They have a few notable characteristics that make them undesirable to hang out with, let alone be in a relationship with. Maybe it's their politics, maybe it's how they act when it's just them and another in a room, maybe they're just a pretty big bore (due to having a mediocre job, no hobbies, etc). That's something I don't see being mentioned in great detail. It's just kind of ignored that the people reporting loneliness might just be socially irredeemable (at the moment, anyone can change). Why do these reporters of loneliness deserve the social energy of other people when they can't comparably contribute, or even in some cases actively devalue the social meetings for other groups of people? There are definitely contributing factors like: how our cities are built, transportation infrastructure, how much we have to work, etc. But I'm willing to wager that a decent portion of people who report loneliness might just have themselves to blame.
- thepra 8y agoI was born in the 90s, and I feel pity seeing my generation adults feeling unhappy because of loneliness, I can perceive happiness in both ways, alone or not, why many other people can't?