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Is it possible to have air superiority because of missiles fired from the ground? A bit less heroic than manned fighter jets in dogfights, but ...

pietroglyph 9y ago
It seems difficult to create a platform which securely moves said missiles. Although ships somewhat fill this role, they're still huge fairly immobile targets. I think the high speed ceiling/mobility of the sky is what makes a flying missile delivery platform better than one based on land or sea.
- newnewpdro 9y ago
  Don't submarines fill this role?
  - greglindahl 9y ago
    The US already uses them that way, albeit mostly for submarine-to-ground missiles instead of submarine-to-air.
    - riku_iki 9y ago
      Submarines usually don't have good radar, so they can't lock on difficult air targets.
      - newnewpdro 9y ago
        That makes sense, I guess I assumed they just need to surface briefly then it's all the same.
riku_iki 9y ago
And how you will bring those missile on enemy territory? Also dogfight is not a thing for many years, modern jets can also use missiles..
- greglindahl 9y ago
  There are missiles fired from the ground which have long range. Since they don't have to be carried by a plane, they can be bigger. Or if you really want missiles fired from a plane, they can be fired from an unmanned plane.
  - riku_iki 9y ago
    > There are missiles fired from the ground which have long range. Since they don't have to be carried by a plane, they can be bigger. Current generation of US surface to air missiles has range of about 200 miles, which is not that much. > Or if you really want missiles fired from a plane, they can be fired from an unmanned plane. Maybe, but what exactly you propose? Remove pilot from F-35? Or build something completely new?
    - greglindahl 9y ago
      My suggestion is to spend hundreds of billions of dollars on longer-range SAMs and more fragile, unmanned, missile-carrying aircraft cheaper than the F35. Sorry if this isn't obvious, I've seen lots of other people (including people in the military) suggest the same thing.
      - riku_iki 9y ago
        Ok, let's assume your aircraft succeeded to gain air superiority, now you need to do actual bombing of enemy territory with air defense. What now? F-35 has some edge by being stealthy. It can track and target moving targets, it can do CAS. Will your fragile aircraft survive in such conditions?
        greglindahl 9y ago
        Do I get to include the effect of having a lot more stuff because I didn't have to pay for manned F-35s? Also, do I get to track moving targets from low Earth orbit using small-ish satellites, or is that right out?

pietroglyph 9y ago

It seems difficult to create a platform which securely moves said missiles. Although ships somewhat fill this role, they're still huge fairly immobile targets. I think the high speed ceiling/mobility of the sky is what makes a flying missile delivery platform better than one based on land or sea.

newnewpdro 9y ago
Don't submarines fill this role?
- greglindahl 9y ago
  The US already uses them that way, albeit mostly for submarine-to-ground missiles instead of submarine-to-air.
  - riku_iki 9y ago
    Submarines usually don't have good radar, so they can't lock on difficult air targets.
    - newnewpdro 9y ago
      That makes sense, I guess I assumed they just need to surface briefly then it's all the same.

riku_iki 9y ago

And how you will bring those missile on enemy territory? Also dogfight is not a thing for many years, modern jets can also use missiles..

greglindahl 9y ago
There are missiles fired from the ground which have long range. Since they don't have to be carried by a plane, they can be bigger. Or if you really want missiles fired from a plane, they can be fired from an unmanned plane.
- riku_iki 9y ago
  > There are missiles fired from the ground which have long range. Since they don't have to be carried by a plane, they can be bigger. Current generation of US surface to air missiles has range of about 200 miles, which is not that much. > Or if you really want missiles fired from a plane, they can be fired from an unmanned plane. Maybe, but what exactly you propose? Remove pilot from F-35? Or build something completely new?
  - greglindahl 9y ago
    My suggestion is to spend hundreds of billions of dollars on longer-range SAMs and more fragile, unmanned, missile-carrying aircraft cheaper than the F35. Sorry if this isn't obvious, I've seen lots of other people (including people in the military) suggest the same thing.
    - riku_iki 9y ago
      Ok, let's assume your aircraft succeeded to gain air superiority, now you need to do actual bombing of enemy territory with air defense. What now? F-35 has some edge by being stealthy. It can track and target moving targets, it can do CAS. Will your fragile aircraft survive in such conditions?
      - greglindahl 9y ago
        Do I get to include the effect of having a lot more stuff because I didn't have to pay for manned F-35s? Also, do I get to track moving targets from low Earth orbit using small-ish satellites, or is that right out?