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Retirement on Hold: American Workers $6 Trillion Short

8 points by chailatte 16y ago

endlessvoid94 16y ago
Your retirement: courtesy of China.
- CamperBob 16y ago
  Yeah, it must be somebody else's fault.
  - endlessvoid94 16y ago
    Heh, totally not what I meant. I was referring to the main purchaser of our country's debt: China. I wasn't BLAMING them.
Pyrodogg 16y ago
So social security is going to go bust and the markets are losing people money, how is a 20-something techie to build funds for retirement? Go back to stashing hard earned cash in a fireproof safe? Never plan on retiring?
- orangecat 16y ago
  Dollar cost averaging into an index fund. If that doesn't produce a positive return over several decades, then we're completely screwed anyway.
  - jbarham 16y ago
    Just be glad you weren't "yen cost averaging" in the Nikkei 225 which is currently 70% down from its 1989 peak: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikkei_225 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikkei_225
- timwiseman 16y ago
  20 something? Invest aggressively, see the fact that many markets have lost (and are still loosing to a lesser extent) as an opportunity and invest. The market as a whole is likely to improve over time and this could even be seen as a good thing for the younger investers buying in now. This is not really a problem for the 20somethings. It is a problem for the 50-60 somethings. Many of them were still invested aggressively instead of shifting to more conservative options as retirment approached. This recession was also so widespread that even many invested in relatively cautious positions have lost huge amounts.
- Groxx 16y ago
  There are private retirement funds. There always have been (for loose values of "always").
- tptacek 16y ago
  Meta: why would anyone upvote a comment that suggests there might not be any vehicle for savings and investment outside of "fireproof safes" and "compulsory government retirement contributions"? I say this as a proponent of Social Security.
houseabsolute 16y ago
Meh. People should not feel entitled to sit around and do nothing for the last third of their life.
- rdl 16y ago
  Sitting around and doing nothing (or driving around the country in an RV, etc.) is the most depressing thing I can think of doing. I hope when I'm >65 I am still working, if not in an operational role, in some kind of investor or advisory role. Retirement from a physically demanding job makes sense when you can't do that job any more, but enduring a job/life you hate, just to reach (hopefully) retirement and finally enjoy life, really seems like the wrong model.
- chadgeidel 16y ago
  You are correct, but is a goal like mine (taper off working gradually) even possible? I dunno, because it's 30+ years away, but it would be nice to not have to work 40-50 hours a week, and then one day stop working all together.
tptacek 16y ago
This study starts with the assumption that Americans should retire at age 65, which is to say that despite massive changes in health, life expectancy, productivity, and the fundamental nature of work as we shift from the physically demanding manufacture of real goods to a service economy, we should be using the same definition of "retirement age" as our grandparents used.
- kgermino 16y ago
  Exactly, when Social Security was started it was expected that you would live into your early 60's, nowadays the average is about 75 and it's common to live past 80. Yet the retirement age has change very little in the last 70 years. Anecdotally I know quite a few people who are still working well into their seventies, all of them working construction in some form. (I spent several summers working for a remodeling firm so my sample is somewhat biased) But these guys are working in a physically demanding job, and doing it by choice. Sure they cannot do as much as they used to be able to but they are certainly doing enough to be productive. They all work part time, regularly go away for weekends, vacations, etc. and working just enough to make money and enjoy their life. It's very possible to have the relaxed lifestyle that people look forward to in retirement without having to completely stop working, regardless of your job, but especially these days where, as you noted, most people work in a service economy.

8 points by chailatte 16y ago

endlessvoid94 16y ago

Your retirement: courtesy of China.

CamperBob 16y ago
Yeah, it must be somebody else's fault.
- endlessvoid94 16y ago
  Heh, totally not what I meant. I was referring to the main purchaser of our country's debt: China. I wasn't BLAMING them.

Pyrodogg 16y ago

So social security is going to go bust and the markets are losing people money, how is a 20-something techie to build funds for retirement? Go back to stashing hard earned cash in a fireproof safe? Never plan on retiring?

orangecat 16y ago
Dollar cost averaging into an index fund. If that doesn't produce a positive return over several decades, then we're completely screwed anyway.
- jbarham 16y ago
  Just be glad you weren't "yen cost averaging" in the Nikkei 225 which is currently 70% down from its 1989 peak: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikkei_225 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikkei_225
timwiseman 16y ago
20 something? Invest aggressively, see the fact that many markets have lost (and are still loosing to a lesser extent) as an opportunity and invest. The market as a whole is likely to improve over time and this could even be seen as a good thing for the younger investers buying in now. This is not really a problem for the 20somethings. It is a problem for the 50-60 somethings. Many of them were still invested aggressively instead of shifting to more conservative options as retirment approached. This recession was also so widespread that even many invested in relatively cautious positions have lost huge amounts.
Groxx 16y ago
There are private retirement funds. There always have been (for loose values of "always").
tptacek 16y ago
Meta: why would anyone upvote a comment that suggests there might not be any vehicle for savings and investment outside of "fireproof safes" and "compulsory government retirement contributions"? I say this as a proponent of Social Security.

houseabsolute 16y ago

Meh. People should not feel entitled to sit around and do nothing for the last third of their life.

rdl 16y ago
Sitting around and doing nothing (or driving around the country in an RV, etc.) is the most depressing thing I can think of doing. I hope when I'm >65 I am still working, if not in an operational role, in some kind of investor or advisory role. Retirement from a physically demanding job makes sense when you can't do that job any more, but enduring a job/life you hate, just to reach (hopefully) retirement and finally enjoy life, really seems like the wrong model.
chadgeidel 16y ago
You are correct, but is a goal like mine (taper off working gradually) even possible? I dunno, because it's 30+ years away, but it would be nice to not have to work 40-50 hours a week, and then one day stop working all together.

tptacek 16y ago

This study starts with the assumption that Americans should retire at age 65, which is to say that despite massive changes in health, life expectancy, productivity, and the fundamental nature of work as we shift from the physically demanding manufacture of real goods to a service economy, we should be using the same definition of "retirement age" as our grandparents used.

kgermino 16y ago
Exactly, when Social Security was started it was expected that you would live into your early 60's, nowadays the average is about 75 and it's common to live past 80. Yet the retirement age has change very little in the last 70 years. Anecdotally I know quite a few people who are still working well into their seventies, all of them working construction in some form. (I spent several summers working for a remodeling firm so my sample is somewhat biased) But these guys are working in a physically demanding job, and doing it by choice. Sure they cannot do as much as they used to be able to but they are certainly doing enough to be productive. They all work part time, regularly go away for weekends, vacations, etc. and working just enough to make money and enjoy their life. It's very possible to have the relaxed lifestyle that people look forward to in retirement without having to completely stop working, regardless of your job, but especially these days where, as you noted, most people work in a service economy.