3 ms·

science education in the US suck?

9 points by getp 18y ago

technoguyrob 18y ago
For anyone who missed it, there was a beautiful exposition written on the quagmire that is mathematics education in the United States: http://www.maa.org/devlin/LockhartsLament.pdf http://www.maa.org/devlin/LockhartsLament.pdf
Maven911 18y ago
I agree, there is a complete disconnect between what industry wants and what is taught at engineering school. 5 years down the line, most people can't recognize the equations used in school.
- pixcavator 18y ago
  5 years down the line, most people can't recognize the French used in school.
dangoldin 18y ago
There has been a lot of articles/papers written about the lack of the creativity element in modern education although it is used in almost every high level field. I think that the problem is all these standardized tests where student performance is directly related to the teacher's and school's funding.
- yummyfajitas 18y ago
  >I think that the problem is all these standardized tests where student performance is directly related to the teacher's and school's funding. Teacher and school funding has little to do with it. Student performance is directly related to parental income, which is (often) related to school funding. But parental income is the driving factor, not school funding. As an example, take Hoboken NJ. The main people attending the public schools are kids from the housing projects at the back of the city. They rank in the bottom 18% of NJ: http://hoboken411.com/archives/11398 http://hoboken411.com/archives/11398 School funding: $24,949 per student. http://www.nj.com/hobokennow/index.ssf/2008/04/boe_challengers_district_spend.html http://www.nj.com/hobokennow/index.ssf/2008/04/boe_challenge...
  - dangoldin 18y ago
    But that's a correlation relationship, well off families tend to have higher performing kids. A reason for that may be that in order to become successful you need to value an education. I'm trying to find the underlying causation of why things got that way and I'm sure it's much more complex than I'm making it out to be.
yters 18y ago
I think it is because America isn't meant to produce smart people. It is meant to make an environment hospitable for smart people. Cynical as it may sound, this means a consumer based worker population, which entails dumbing down. Our economy runs off of mass production, so the products need to meet the greatest common denominator. You get a big common denominator by leveling society.
nazgulnarsil 18y ago
it doesn't suck. our standards continually get higher as globalization makes the number of people we are competing with larger. in 1900 you were competing with someone down the block in 1925 you were competing with a city of people in 1950 you were competing with the nation in 1975 you were competing with japan in the year 2000 and onwards you're competing with the population of china and india

9 points by getp 18y ago

For anyone who missed it, there was a beautiful exposition written on the quagmire that is mathematics education in the United States: http://www.maa.org/devlin/LockhartsLament.pdf http://www.maa.org/devlin/LockhartsLament.pdf

Maven911 18y ago

I agree, there is a complete disconnect between what industry wants and what is taught at engineering school. 5 years down the line, most people can't recognize the equations used in school.

pixcavator 18y ago
5 years down the line, most people can't recognize the French used in school.

dangoldin 18y ago

There has been a lot of articles/papers written about the lack of the creativity element in modern education although it is used in almost every high level field. I think that the problem is all these standardized tests where student performance is directly related to the teacher's and school's funding.

yummyfajitas 18y ago
>I think that the problem is all these standardized tests where student performance is directly related to the teacher's and school's funding. Teacher and school funding has little to do with it. Student performance is directly related to parental income, which is (often) related to school funding. But parental income is the driving factor, not school funding. As an example, take Hoboken NJ. The main people attending the public schools are kids from the housing projects at the back of the city. They rank in the bottom 18% of NJ: http://hoboken411.com/archives/11398 http://hoboken411.com/archives/11398 School funding: $24,949 per student. http://www.nj.com/hobokennow/index.ssf/2008/04/boe_challengers_district_spend.html http://www.nj.com/hobokennow/index.ssf/2008/04/boe_challenge...
- dangoldin 18y ago
  But that's a correlation relationship, well off families tend to have higher performing kids. A reason for that may be that in order to become successful you need to value an education. I'm trying to find the underlying causation of why things got that way and I'm sure it's much more complex than I'm making it out to be.

yters 18y ago

I think it is because America isn't meant to produce smart people. It is meant to make an environment hospitable for smart people. Cynical as it may sound, this means a consumer based worker population, which entails dumbing down. Our economy runs off of mass production, so the products need to meet the greatest common denominator. You get a big common denominator by leveling society.

nazgulnarsil 18y ago

it doesn't suck. our standards continually get higher as globalization makes the number of people we are competing with larger. in 1900 you were competing with someone down the block in 1925 you were competing with a city of people in 1950 you were competing with the nation in 1975 you were competing with japan in the year 2000 and onwards you're competing with the population of china and india