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It uses HTTP requests for transit! I know you don't actually know what youre talking about, so I'll explain: There is much more overhead to opening a connectio

by jrq 8y ago

It uses HTTP requests for transit! I know you don't actually know what youre talking about, so I'll explain: There is much more overhead to opening a connection and maintaining a connect and sending and receiving, to the degree that people with bad connections are excluded entirely from being able to reliably use it. This is not true with irc. People in third world countries can use irc. If you can ping, you can chat. We don't WANT a chat for less technical people. We want e2e safety. We should never prioritize """normal users""" over security in a security oriented proposal! That's insane! But hey, I'm sure youre just a teen with a laptop, so I won't hold it against you that you'd make such an irresponsible decision.

kqr 8y ago
Insert counter-patronizing preamble here. ------8<--------------- While the overhead of setting up a fresh TCP connection for every exchange is non-trivial, I'm not sure "reliable on a bad connection" is a characteristic I would attribute to IRC. The protocol is notoriously unreliable to the point where established practise is to run a client on a server somewhere and then connect to that from your bad connection computers. People who don't lose IRC messages sent while their connection crapped out, while Matrix ensures their client is updated to reflect the current state of the servers as soon as they go online again. I believe also that modern HTTP options let you reuse the same connection for multiple requests, obviating much of the overhead. Not to mention that you are free to extend the Matrix server with alternative connection methods. We do want a chat for less technical people. In order for humanity to not screw over itself royally, we need to target the 99%, not the 1%. Things can be good and still target non-technical people, as long as they are open and federated. Of course, convenience does not trump security, but I don't see how that is the case here either.

by jrq 8y ago

kqr 8y ago

Insert counter-patronizing preamble here. ------8<--------------- While the overhead of setting up a fresh TCP connection for every exchange is non-trivial, I'm not sure "reliable on a bad connection" is a characteristic I would attribute to IRC. The protocol is notoriously unreliable to the point where established practise is to run a client on a server somewhere and then connect to that from your bad connection computers. People who don't lose IRC messages sent while their connection crapped out, while Matrix ensures their client is updated to reflect the current state of the servers as soon as they go online again. I believe also that modern HTTP options let you reuse the same connection for multiple requests, obviating much of the overhead. Not to mention that you are free to extend the Matrix server with alternative connection methods. We do want a chat for less technical people. In order for humanity to not screw over itself royally, we need to target the 99%, not the 1%. Things can be good and still target non-technical people, as long as they are open and federated. Of course, convenience does not trump security, but I don't see how that is the case here either.