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Then move on and don't respond at all. Leave the begging to the users that want to help new users get better. There's a genuine complaint that responses to new

Then move on and don't respond at all. Leave the begging to the users that want to help new users get better. There's a genuine complaint that responses to new users are often harsher than required. "I shouldn't have to beg for information" is not a valid response to that criticism. Answerers have no idea about the skill level of the people asking the questions. Their english might not be so good. This might be the first time someone is programming and they don't know which line in a stack trace is particularly important. They Need Help. If you're not willing to help users at that skill level, then don't. But it's totally unfair to criticise them.

nanis 8y ago
> Then move on and don't respond at all. You misunderstand. If you are paying me, I have no problem letting you spend more of your money by not giving enough information to solve the problem. I will point out once, and if you express the desire that I spend more time validating you, I will gladly do that. As it stands, you should keep in mind that you don't get to tell me what to do. Telling someone "we can't figure out what's wrong on line 49 if you don't show us what's on line 49" is not condescending, rude, discriminatory, racist, sexist, etc etc at all. It is a factual statement that is aimed at pointing out exactly what the person who is seeking help needs to do to get said help. Now, if I point something out like this, and I get a response like yours, I move on. Before moving on, however, I do vote to close the question because 1) there isn't enough information to diagnose the problem; and 2) the OP is unwilling to provide it. If you think I did something wrong in my response to you, you can flag my response for moderator attention. If that is not resolved to your liking, you can post on Meta. It is interesting to me that supposedly all these people who just want more niceness are the ones calling high-rep users and moderators assholes, insulting them indiscriminately etc. As I mentioned before, you can always go on Meta, and suggest ways to improve https://stackoverflow.com/help/how-to-ask https://stackoverflow.com/help/how-to-ask . If a first time user fails to follow the recommendations therein, it is incumbent upon the people who are trying to help to point it out so the mistake can be corrected. If people persist in not following advice, instead accusing people of all sorts of nasty things, they are unlikely to get the help they want. Keep in mind that some of these people may be writing the software for your bank or may end up next to you in that open floor plan office of yours. Helping them learn how to most effectively find answers to their questions may help you save time and aggravation later on.
- jsmeaton 8y ago
  > Telling someone "we can't figure out what's wrong on line 49 if you don't show us what's on line 49" is not condescending You've edited the quote, leaving out the bits that are condescending. Here it is again: > "If the error says line 49, it tells you exactly where the problem lies. If you post 7 lines of code here, we clearly cannot tell you what the problem is in line 49." The second sentence is where the snark starts to creep in. The tone is unnecessary, and the word "clearly" can easily make the asker feel bad. That's where the condescension comes from. It's totally not clear to the person asking, or they wouldn't be asking the question as they are. > If you think I did something wrong in my response to you, you can flag my response for moderator attention. I think more of this should be happening, and more tools available to manage unhelpful answerers. I don't know what these tools should look like, but I have some ideas. > I mentioned before, you can always go on Meta A lot of these users are new! They don't know about Meta. Their first interaction with the site boils down to "wow you're dumb, can't you read?", and then they're gone for good. Someone brings up on a HN post that SO is elitist and the original asker, who now has some experience under their belt, confirms "yep, it was a horrible toxic place". > Helping them learn how to most effectively find answers to their questions may help you save time and aggravation later on. I totally agree. Helping people diagnose their issues and teaching them how to write good questions is fantastic. It can be done with a better tone than what's currently happening.

nanis 8y ago

> Then move on and don't respond at all. You misunderstand. If you are paying me, I have no problem letting you spend more of your money by not giving enough information to solve the problem. I will point out once, and if you express the desire that I spend more time validating you, I will gladly do that. As it stands, you should keep in mind that you don't get to tell me what to do. Telling someone "we can't figure out what's wrong on line 49 if you don't show us what's on line 49" is not condescending, rude, discriminatory, racist, sexist, etc etc at all. It is a factual statement that is aimed at pointing out exactly what the person who is seeking help needs to do to get said help. Now, if I point something out like this, and I get a response like yours, I move on. Before moving on, however, I do vote to close the question because 1) there isn't enough information to diagnose the problem; and 2) the OP is unwilling to provide it. If you think I did something wrong in my response to you, you can flag my response for moderator attention. If that is not resolved to your liking, you can post on Meta. It is interesting to me that supposedly all these people who just want more niceness are the ones calling high-rep users and moderators assholes, insulting them indiscriminately etc. As I mentioned before, you can always go on Meta, and suggest ways to improve https://stackoverflow.com/help/how-to-ask https://stackoverflow.com/help/how-to-ask . If a first time user fails to follow the recommendations therein, it is incumbent upon the people who are trying to help to point it out so the mistake can be corrected. If people persist in not following advice, instead accusing people of all sorts of nasty things, they are unlikely to get the help they want. Keep in mind that some of these people may be writing the software for your bank or may end up next to you in that open floor plan office of yours. Helping them learn how to most effectively find answers to their questions may help you save time and aggravation later on.

jsmeaton 8y ago
> Telling someone "we can't figure out what's wrong on line 49 if you don't show us what's on line 49" is not condescending You've edited the quote, leaving out the bits that are condescending. Here it is again: > "If the error says line 49, it tells you exactly where the problem lies. If you post 7 lines of code here, we clearly cannot tell you what the problem is in line 49." The second sentence is where the snark starts to creep in. The tone is unnecessary, and the word "clearly" can easily make the asker feel bad. That's where the condescension comes from. It's totally not clear to the person asking, or they wouldn't be asking the question as they are. > If you think I did something wrong in my response to you, you can flag my response for moderator attention. I think more of this should be happening, and more tools available to manage unhelpful answerers. I don't know what these tools should look like, but I have some ideas. > I mentioned before, you can always go on Meta A lot of these users are new! They don't know about Meta. Their first interaction with the site boils down to "wow you're dumb, can't you read?", and then they're gone for good. Someone brings up on a HN post that SO is elitist and the original asker, who now has some experience under their belt, confirms "yep, it was a horrible toxic place". > Helping them learn how to most effectively find answers to their questions may help you save time and aggravation later on. I totally agree. Helping people diagnose their issues and teaching them how to write good questions is fantastic. It can be done with a better tone than what's currently happening.