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Is that supposed to show improvement or something? I think that's pathetic. The equivalent sedan of today, Fusion Hybrid, gets 45 mpg, a ~50% improvement from 2

Is that supposed to show improvement or something? I think that's pathetic. The equivalent sedan of today, Fusion Hybrid, gets 45 mpg, a ~50% improvement from 2000. Meanwhile the F-150 has eked out a 20% improvement because of fundamental issues with SUVs & Trucks being aerodynamically inefficient. This is a real loss for the environment and cutting greenhouse gases.

maxsilver 8y ago
Yep. In addition, a modern plug-in hybrid gets over 50mpg on gas alone and ~110mpge on electricity. (something like a Chevy Volt or Hyundai Ioniq or Toyota Prius or similar) You don't even have to go full electric -- If the average driver just switched to driving a plug-in hybrid and charged roughly nightly on a regular 120v US household outlet, you could erase ~75% of all emissions from personal vehicles nationwide, without changing anyone's commutes or driving patterns in any way. (Even if we still use dirty sources for the electricity during the switchover to renewable electricity) Or you could buy a 2018 F-150 pickup truck with the fuel economy of a 20 year old sedan -- a fuel economy so low it's actually slightly below fleet average for all existing US cars driven today...
- mmirate 8y ago
  Why wouldn't the increased electricity demands negate most of the environmental benefits of hybrids versus similarly-sized fuel-burning vehicles? The same work is being done to the vehicle cabin, no matter whether the fossil fuels are being burned at the vehicle or at the powerplant...
  - perl4ever 8y ago
    There are two reasons: (1) electricity can be, and often is, produced using methods such as hydro and nuclear that use less carbon and produce less pollution, and (2) pollution control on carbon-intensive sources can be more effective at a central location.
- perl4ever 8y ago
  I think it's somewhat of an exaggeration to say "a modern plug-in hybrid gets over 50 mpg" rather than "the Prius Prime gets around 50 mpg". The Honda Clarity and the Chevy Volt are more like 40 mpg, I believe. I'm not sure of the reasons, but both seem to have larger batteries than the Prius.
perl4ever 8y ago
I don't think that stated figures for Ford hybrids are representative. I rented a Fusion Hybrid and got more like mid 30s. Really, no better than a non-hybrid Altima. It's been widely reported in the automotive press that the Fusion and C-Max don't live up to their EPA figures. And my figure is based on the mpg computer - in every car I've ever calculated using actual gas put in vs the tripmeter, mileage is even less than the automatically calculated figure.

maxsilver 8y ago

Yep. In addition, a modern plug-in hybrid gets over 50mpg on gas alone and ~110mpge on electricity. (something like a Chevy Volt or Hyundai Ioniq or Toyota Prius or similar) You don't even have to go full electric -- If the average driver just switched to driving a plug-in hybrid and charged roughly nightly on a regular 120v US household outlet, you could erase ~75% of all emissions from personal vehicles nationwide, without changing anyone's commutes or driving patterns in any way. (Even if we still use dirty sources for the electricity during the switchover to renewable electricity) Or you could buy a 2018 F-150 pickup truck with the fuel economy of a 20 year old sedan -- a fuel economy so low it's actually slightly below fleet average for all existing US cars driven today...

mmirate 8y ago
Why wouldn't the increased electricity demands negate most of the environmental benefits of hybrids versus similarly-sized fuel-burning vehicles? The same work is being done to the vehicle cabin, no matter whether the fossil fuels are being burned at the vehicle or at the powerplant...
- perl4ever 8y ago
  There are two reasons: (1) electricity can be, and often is, produced using methods such as hydro and nuclear that use less carbon and produce less pollution, and (2) pollution control on carbon-intensive sources can be more effective at a central location.
perl4ever 8y ago
I think it's somewhat of an exaggeration to say "a modern plug-in hybrid gets over 50 mpg" rather than "the Prius Prime gets around 50 mpg". The Honda Clarity and the Chevy Volt are more like 40 mpg, I believe. I'm not sure of the reasons, but both seem to have larger batteries than the Prius.

perl4ever 8y ago

I don't think that stated figures for Ford hybrids are representative. I rented a Fusion Hybrid and got more like mid 30s. Really, no better than a non-hybrid Altima. It's been widely reported in the automotive press that the Fusion and C-Max don't live up to their EPA figures. And my figure is based on the mpg computer - in every car I've ever calculated using actual gas put in vs the tripmeter, mileage is even less than the automatically calculated figure.