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> but we'd rise again in less than a thousand years. Would we though? I am not so sure starting from scratch is going to possible. For example, all the easy o

> but we'd rise again in less than a thousand years. Would we though? I am not so sure starting from scratch is going to possible. For example, all the easy oil is gone. All the easy mining, is gone. We can get at it because we have the technology. If 99% of the human species was wiped out, yes we would continue to exist, but I would not expect many great civilisations to flourish again

ajross 8y ago
The bit about energy sources is true, though a little spun. It's true that oil is gone. Coal is still plentiful, even at the surface. And the "hole" in industrial development where we depended on oil specifically has been less than 100 years or so, and already seems to be reaching its end. It's not impossible to imagine a future society skipping liquid fuels (and most of aviation) and still making its way to the renewable revolution. > All the easy mining, is gone. This bit is wrong, though. You can literally walk through a demolition site and pick up rebar and aluminum by the ton. Access to a single ancient reactor would give you the equivalent of decades of mining from any single uranium site. All our city building has had the effect of concentrating easily exploitable "ore" resources, not depleting them.
- senorjazz 8y ago
  I was probably over generalising (and I really have no idea about this tbh). But I would still think a lot of the easy mining is gone. >Access to a single ancient reactor would give you the equivalent of decades of mining from any single uranium site What could is uranium to destroyed civilisation where all previous knowledge has been lost? I don't think future post civilisation peoples are going to be reconstructing a nuclear reactor from wood. >You can literally walk through a demolition site and pick up rebar and aluminum by the ton Post civilisation people are not going to have much use for demolished materials. Yes with modern technology we could reuse it. But how will they use it? I've seen a build demolished in the third world. People came and got the pieces of rebar true, hammered the concrete off it, but only to sell, not to use. I don't really think in a post civ world it would be of much use > It's not impossible to imagine a future society skipping liquid fuels (and most of aviation) and still making its way to the renewable revolution. Impossible? Perhaps not, but still very very unlikely. For decades after the event, survival will be all encompassing. Knowledge will pretty much have disappeared. You talk about skipping liquid fuels and aviation and going straight to renewables. First people will need to invent electricity again - everything will need to be "invented" again from a much weaker starting point. I just don't see it happening. Much more probable it is the end of human civilisations / humans as the dominant species on this planet
  - ajross 8y ago
    > But I would still think a lot of the easy mining is gone. Again, you have completely lost me. Can you explain again why you think it's easier to dig up and smelt natural iron ores (or copper, or whatever) than it is to find an old rusty engine block or electric motor and just use that? Civilization needs metal to develop, in this example, not "mining". And ours has already done the mining!
  - meric 8y ago
    We don't need mining - The metal in junk yards and recycling centres are a lot easier to access than building a mine in the middle of nowhere going underground 50 to 100 metres. The only reason we do mine and need new metal is because metal from junkyards and recycling centres are needed as well, and all existing metal is already being used. If most humans die off then the existing metal are available for reuse. And it's as easy as heating it up past melting point and molding it into the right shape; There might be ways to do that optimally but in the case where plentiful resources are available compared to human capital, it should suffice. The oil is gone, but coal is still easy to access. We can bootstrap off a second coal industrial revolution. And every person who've been through high school knows the principles involved in generating power from coal, though might be lacking in the actual techniques. > but only to sell, not to use You've proved there's buyers who would find a use for it.
    - senorjazz 8y ago
      > You've proved there's buyers who would find a use for it. You seem to be falling into the romantic view of post apocalyptic event. The world doesn't stay the same as it is now, just with the people gone. There is no one to buy your scrap metal. There is no more organisation, there is no more nothing. > And every person who've been through high school knows the principles involved in generating power from coal No they don't. They may know coal can be involved, but they have no idea how to take coal and make electricity. I assume you are a technical person working in a technical role. Go to your local supermarket and ask the person at the till for the basic principles involved.
      - 8y ago
eloff 8y ago
The knowledge won't all die with us. And we will be quick to reverse engineer and reinvent things again. We don't need oil, we've got coal, hydro, wind, and solar (both concentrated solar and solar panels), and we have biofuels. With most humans dead, arable land won't be in short supply.

ajross 8y ago

The bit about energy sources is true, though a little spun. It's true that oil is gone. Coal is still plentiful, even at the surface. And the "hole" in industrial development where we depended on oil specifically has been less than 100 years or so, and already seems to be reaching its end. It's not impossible to imagine a future society skipping liquid fuels (and most of aviation) and still making its way to the renewable revolution. > All the easy mining, is gone. This bit is wrong, though. You can literally walk through a demolition site and pick up rebar and aluminum by the ton. Access to a single ancient reactor would give you the equivalent of decades of mining from any single uranium site. All our city building has had the effect of concentrating easily exploitable "ore" resources, not depleting them.

senorjazz 8y ago
I was probably over generalising (and I really have no idea about this tbh). But I would still think a lot of the easy mining is gone. >Access to a single ancient reactor would give you the equivalent of decades of mining from any single uranium site What could is uranium to destroyed civilisation where all previous knowledge has been lost? I don't think future post civilisation peoples are going to be reconstructing a nuclear reactor from wood. >You can literally walk through a demolition site and pick up rebar and aluminum by the ton Post civilisation people are not going to have much use for demolished materials. Yes with modern technology we could reuse it. But how will they use it? I've seen a build demolished in the third world. People came and got the pieces of rebar true, hammered the concrete off it, but only to sell, not to use. I don't really think in a post civ world it would be of much use > It's not impossible to imagine a future society skipping liquid fuels (and most of aviation) and still making its way to the renewable revolution. Impossible? Perhaps not, but still very very unlikely. For decades after the event, survival will be all encompassing. Knowledge will pretty much have disappeared. You talk about skipping liquid fuels and aviation and going straight to renewables. First people will need to invent electricity again - everything will need to be "invented" again from a much weaker starting point. I just don't see it happening. Much more probable it is the end of human civilisations / humans as the dominant species on this planet
- ajross 8y ago
  > But I would still think a lot of the easy mining is gone. Again, you have completely lost me. Can you explain again why you think it's easier to dig up and smelt natural iron ores (or copper, or whatever) than it is to find an old rusty engine block or electric motor and just use that? Civilization needs metal to develop, in this example, not "mining". And ours has already done the mining!
- meric 8y ago
  We don't need mining - The metal in junk yards and recycling centres are a lot easier to access than building a mine in the middle of nowhere going underground 50 to 100 metres. The only reason we do mine and need new metal is because metal from junkyards and recycling centres are needed as well, and all existing metal is already being used. If most humans die off then the existing metal are available for reuse. And it's as easy as heating it up past melting point and molding it into the right shape; There might be ways to do that optimally but in the case where plentiful resources are available compared to human capital, it should suffice. The oil is gone, but coal is still easy to access. We can bootstrap off a second coal industrial revolution. And every person who've been through high school knows the principles involved in generating power from coal, though might be lacking in the actual techniques. > but only to sell, not to use You've proved there's buyers who would find a use for it.
  - senorjazz 8y ago
    > You've proved there's buyers who would find a use for it. You seem to be falling into the romantic view of post apocalyptic event. The world doesn't stay the same as it is now, just with the people gone. There is no one to buy your scrap metal. There is no more organisation, there is no more nothing. > And every person who've been through high school knows the principles involved in generating power from coal No they don't. They may know coal can be involved, but they have no idea how to take coal and make electricity. I assume you are a technical person working in a technical role. Go to your local supermarket and ask the person at the till for the basic principles involved.
    - 8y ago

eloff 8y ago

The knowledge won't all die with us. And we will be quick to reverse engineer and reinvent things again. We don't need oil, we've got coal, hydro, wind, and solar (both concentrated solar and solar panels), and we have biofuels. With most humans dead, arable land won't be in short supply.