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> Like it on not, science and research is what powers humanity flourishing Not all science and research though. That's the whole point of my argument - we shou

by mjfl 9y ago

> Like it on not, science and research is what powers humanity flourishing Not all science and research though. That's the whole point of my argument - we should direct funds towards projects that actually have tangible benefit to humanity in the future. I will eat my shoe if any application of neutrinos comes about in the next 50 years. Transistors? Great - those weren't invented by accident, and John Bardeen certainly deserves his two Nobel Prizes.

GlennS 9y ago
Isn't there already an application of neutrinos: to detect nuclear material (so weapons inspection and so on)?
ben_w 9y ago
Remote monitoring nuclear reactors for signs of weapons development: http://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1742-6596/593/1/012004/pdf http://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1742-6596/593/1/01... Communication through any obstacles, including (in principle) the entire diameter of the planet: https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.2847 https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.2847
- mjfl 9y ago
  Considering we have already have cheap things to detect nuclear proliferation, such as seismic detectors that have proven effective w/ North Korea and how expensive a neutrino detection system would be to build, I don't see any marginal benefit to humanity there. Considering the fact that you would need to build a beamline for any transmission of a neutrino message and a 5 ton detector to receive it (unlikely to be reduced since it's so hard to stop neutrinos) I'll stick with my > 50 year timeline for neutrino message passing being used in any practical sense. Maybe they could put it in a nuclear sub, but the design process would take 50 years, thanks to similar incentives built into the military industrial complex.
  - ben_w 9y ago
    Seismic can only detect an explosion. Neutrino can detect the construction. If the threat comes from someone who has reactors and already knows how to make bombs, seismic is too late. A 5 ton detector isn’t particularly implausible in a whole range of scenarios. Eat up. :)
    - mjfl 9y ago
      Still waiting...
      - FridgeSeal 9y ago
        Someone literally just provided you with an explanation of a possible application, you can't just dismiss their comment because you don't like it.
FridgeSeal 9y ago
And how will we know what science is going to be useful and "profitable" until we do it? I'm not even going to dive into the huge discussion that is "why profit driven science is an objectively terrible idea".

by mjfl 9y ago

GlennS 9y ago

Isn't there already an application of neutrinos: to detect nuclear material (so weapons inspection and so on)?

ben_w 9y ago

Remote monitoring nuclear reactors for signs of weapons development: http://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1742-6596/593/1/012004/pdf http://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1742-6596/593/1/01... Communication through any obstacles, including (in principle) the entire diameter of the planet: https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.2847 https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.2847

mjfl 9y ago
Considering we have already have cheap things to detect nuclear proliferation, such as seismic detectors that have proven effective w/ North Korea and how expensive a neutrino detection system would be to build, I don't see any marginal benefit to humanity there. Considering the fact that you would need to build a beamline for any transmission of a neutrino message and a 5 ton detector to receive it (unlikely to be reduced since it's so hard to stop neutrinos) I'll stick with my > 50 year timeline for neutrino message passing being used in any practical sense. Maybe they could put it in a nuclear sub, but the design process would take 50 years, thanks to similar incentives built into the military industrial complex.
- ben_w 9y ago
  Seismic can only detect an explosion. Neutrino can detect the construction. If the threat comes from someone who has reactors and already knows how to make bombs, seismic is too late. A 5 ton detector isn’t particularly implausible in a whole range of scenarios. Eat up. :)
  - mjfl 9y ago
    Still waiting...
    - FridgeSeal 9y ago
      Someone literally just provided you with an explanation of a possible application, you can't just dismiss their comment because you don't like it.

FridgeSeal 9y ago

And how will we know what science is going to be useful and "profitable" until we do it? I'm not even going to dive into the huge discussion that is "why profit driven science is an objectively terrible idea".