6 ms·

Not worth the WWW? (Amongst many other things)

mjfl 9y ago
If you had the power to view into parallel universes and told me TBL would not have invented the integration of hypertext and the TCP system without the support of CERN I would begrudgingly give CERN funding until 1995.
- icebraining 9y ago
  But that's the thing: before 1995, you couldn't know that you had to keep funding the CERN to get the WWW. So you'd have cut it off before, and now you'd be arguing that you made the right call, because we wouldn't know that the WWW would have been a thing.
  - mjfl 9y ago
    But it is very unlikely that another parallel universe doesn't have TBL or someone else inventing WWW in another setting. I would argue that the invention of the web was dependent on TBL, not CERN.
    - icebraining 9y ago
      I'm not sure we would have computers at all if we followed your approach.
      - mjfl 9y ago
        I think you're trying to paint me as someone who is anti-science, I'm the opposite. I have extreme confidence in what our scientists can do, especially when you stop giving them easy money. Note that CERN also employs thousands of very smart particle physics PHDs who's median contribution to humanity is roughly equivalent to a giant land sloth's. I want to demand much more from them, and I'm also extremely confident that they can deliver.
        icebraining 9y ago
        No, I'm painting you as someone who has way too much faith in their own abilities to predict what can be achieved by pure research. You can only demand more if you're certain that more is achievable. I don't see what evidence you have that allows you to conclude that.
        Al-Khwarizmi 9y ago
        "I have extreme confidence in what our scientists can do, especially when you stop giving them easy money" Yeah, as a scientist there's nothing like underfunding when it comes to doing great things! Having to reduce the team letting people go, work with obsolete/scarce equipment, and spend the majority of the time writing grant proposals to beg for some money to move forward, are great boosts indeed. And surely the great advances of science have not been associated to large labs with huge resources, often related to the deep pockets of the military...

mjfl 9y ago

If you had the power to view into parallel universes and told me TBL would not have invented the integration of hypertext and the TCP system without the support of CERN I would begrudgingly give CERN funding until 1995.

icebraining 9y ago
But that's the thing: before 1995, you couldn't know that you had to keep funding the CERN to get the WWW. So you'd have cut it off before, and now you'd be arguing that you made the right call, because we wouldn't know that the WWW would have been a thing.
- mjfl 9y ago
  But it is very unlikely that another parallel universe doesn't have TBL or someone else inventing WWW in another setting. I would argue that the invention of the web was dependent on TBL, not CERN.
  - icebraining 9y ago
    I'm not sure we would have computers at all if we followed your approach.
    - mjfl 9y ago
      I think you're trying to paint me as someone who is anti-science, I'm the opposite. I have extreme confidence in what our scientists can do, especially when you stop giving them easy money. Note that CERN also employs thousands of very smart particle physics PHDs who's median contribution to humanity is roughly equivalent to a giant land sloth's. I want to demand much more from them, and I'm also extremely confident that they can deliver.
      - icebraining 9y ago
        No, I'm painting you as someone who has way too much faith in their own abilities to predict what can be achieved by pure research. You can only demand more if you're certain that more is achievable. I don't see what evidence you have that allows you to conclude that.
      - Al-Khwarizmi 9y ago
        "I have extreme confidence in what our scientists can do, especially when you stop giving them easy money" Yeah, as a scientist there's nothing like underfunding when it comes to doing great things! Having to reduce the team letting people go, work with obsolete/scarce equipment, and spend the majority of the time writing grant proposals to beg for some money to move forward, are great boosts indeed. And surely the great advances of science have not been associated to large labs with huge resources, often related to the deep pockets of the military...