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In my experience 60-70k is considered to be a 'high' salary in Boise. Like, someone outside of tech who is making is 60k considers themselves to be upper midd
by Naritai 8y ago
In my experience 60-70k is considered to be a 'high' salary in Boise. Like, someone outside of tech who is making is 60k considers themselves to be upper middle class. I know people who relocated from Boise to Bay area, and were given 30-40% salary boosts for cost of living. Of course, at the time real estate was so cheap in Boise, it was commonly noted that it actually costs much more than 30-40% more to live in the Bay area than it does in Boise, but that's what was offered.
- StudentStuff 8y agoHuh? A plumber or electrician can earn more than that even in rural areas, I wouldn't consider $60k to be upper middle class.
- throwawayjava 8y agoSome definitions of upper middle class start as low as "$62k per earner AND a household income above $100,000". So a huasband and wife who each make $62k would be "upper middle class". Of course, these definitions are silly and depend on tons of things. A teacher making $60k with difficult-to-lose jobs and a great pension might be better off than a construction worker making $80k. The latter will have a shorter career at that salary, is more exposed to cycles, and will have a tougher time planning for retirement (assuming, of course, the teacher's pension is well-run). A teacher making $40k with no dependents and no desire to reproduce is practically upper middle class compared to a software engineer making twice that but who's a single mother with 4 kids. And a teacher making $60k in rural midwest is basically in a different economic class than a teacher making $60k in a coastal city... > plumber or electrician can earn more than that even in rural areas Sure. Class isn't just about income; it's also about value systems and educational attainment. Which is definitely classist! But then, we are literally discussing class...
- Naritai 8y agoThanks. I know it's a tough definition, I just meant that someone making 60k is Boise is going to be at least as satisfied with his/her life as someone making ~100k in Silicon Valley...
- CydeWeys 8y agoHuh? Why do you define upper middle class so as to exclude the trades? Trades are frequently lucrative enough to place tradespeople in the income percentile required to reach upper middle class, especially if you own your own business, as many tradespeople do.
- throwawayjava 8y agoMost class definitions are classist.
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- tptacek 8y ago"Upper middle class" has a definition in sociology that basically excludes the trades; it's the "managers and professional" class.
- mcguire 8y agoAnd it is not too unusual to find "trade" households making more than professionals.
- closeparen 8y agoClass and income are related but distinct. People with advanced degrees and high-autonomy white collar jobs ("upper middle class") are a distinct sociological cohort from people in the trades. You may think this is bullshit, but class has some decent explanatory power for otherwise-puzzling observations, like how the children of the first cohort defy their own economic incentives to avoid the behaviors of the second. It offends modern liberal sensibilities to treat class hierarchy as normative ("classism"), but most acknowledge its existence and utility as a descriptive concept, one which is a lot more nuanced than bands on the income spectrum.
- dredmorbius 8y ago
- Naritai 8y agoThe key factor that you seem to be ignoring is ratio of the income to cost of living in that area. For the purposes of this I'll define upper middle class as 'can afford a house, a reasonably nice car, and can afford to go to pretty much any restaurant in town for special occasions'. Sure you can argue about details but that may well be true for a successful tradesman, especially one who runs his or her own business.