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Stock answers, all of them are expected in any given interview. Want to stand out? Say you are actually interested in earning money for your work, a truly nove

by a_imho 9y ago

Stock answers, all of them are expected in any given interview. Want to stand out? Say you are actually interested in earning money for your work, a truly novel idea nowadays.

drblast 9y ago
"Sorry, we don't do that here."
trevyn 9y ago
I completely agree that good software engineers are able to provide value significantly above the standard salary ranges for the profession. That said, I’m pretty pragmatic about it — I don’t want “a job”, but I respect that there is a price for which I would do the work. In the past, I’ve been direct and honest that the price is about $2M/yr + significant equity. Sends a message, and gets the wrong recruiters off your back. :) But — if you are applying for jobs for which there are common salary ranges, you are signalling that you’re likely willing to work for something in that general range. I think part of the larger situation is that the leaders of many small businesses (including many startups) don’t know how to effectively apply good engineers.
- toomuchtodo 9y ago
  Effective managers are in short supply compared to the number of founders running startups with no experience. I suppose this is because if you’re an effective manager, why would you lower your comp by working at a startup instead of at a larger established business that can properly compensate you for your valuable skill set (while anyone with some combination of an idea and some cash can be a founder).
- fwdpropaganda 9y ago
  Ever had anyone offer you $2M/yr?
- a_imho 9y ago
  I'm not really complaining about salaries though, just the fact that unsurprisingly honesty is not on anyone's list. Let's be frank, people want to pay their bills and suits are worried about bottom lines.
WJW 9y ago
Most employers are not actually all that interested in what _you want_, but in what _you can provide them_. If necessary, they will pay for that. A great many applicants that come by our company have as motivation "to develop myself" and similar. That won't get many employers excited. If you come by and tell us: "I have a great idea to make/save you X euro/month (and are credible)", that would make employers much more likely to hire you. Imagine if a grocer told you: I want you to buy this cucumber because it would make me feel great about my sales skills. Would you buy the cucumber just to do the grocer a favor? Now compare that to a grocer who tells you: "These cucumbers are delicious, healthy and will make you feel great about yourself for eating healthy food." IMO, the second grocer is much more likely to sell a lot of cucumbers, because he focuses on what his customers want instead of what he himself wants. The same is true for selling your labor.
- skookumchuck 9y ago
  In answer to "where do you see yourself in 5 years" question, I once told a potential employer that I would be CEO of his company. I didn't get an offer :-)
  - GoToRO 9y ago
    I know somebody who did the same, and he ended up being the boss of a plant. Not the CEO, but still a lot of responsibility. And not from the start, he worked on all factory machines first and slowly he was given more responsibilities. It all depends on what they are looking for. This company looked for a local to replace the expats. It was a match.
- itronitron 9y ago
  the best answer is just to repeat back the position description or the company mission to whoever is asking
- tnhaoeh34thoe9 9y ago
  Likewise, most applicants are not interested in what _the company wants_, but in what _the company can provide them_. They are going to be working a minimum of 8 hours a day 5 days a week for your company. This is why the applicant pool is so awful. Companies don't care what candidates want, candidates don't care what companies want.
fwdpropaganda 9y ago
> Say you are actually interested in earning money for your work, a truly novel idea nowadays. Last month I was ruled out at screening stage because I "focused too much on money" (that was the recruiter's feedback to me from the company's HR). They wanted to pay £35k for a developer who also can build statistical models. In London.
- crdoconnor 9y ago
  They're on a road to disappointment.
  - walshemj 9y ago
    Yes as I am in the market at the moment and that sort of role in London your looking at 50k at that rate your be lucky to get a newbie grad.
  - dabockster 9y ago
    They're on a road to outsourcing.
- a_imho 9y ago
  I don't mean saying that will help with your application, but that is probably on the list 'things you rarely hear during interviews'. I also don't think good boy points help that much either, I'm subscribed to the idea we tend to hire people similar to us, effectively turning hiring into a numbers game without much influence over over that bias. Indeed, once a technically challenged HR included a whole spreadsheet of applicants in her reply, which basically confirmed her company rejects applicants for arbitrarily stupid reasons, so one might as well focus on the money.
  - fwdpropaganda 9y ago
    > Indeed, once a technically challenged HR included a whole spreadsheet of applicants in her reply, which basically confirmed her company rejects applicants for arbitrarily stupid reasons Is this an imaginary situation, or did it actually happen? If the latter, link?
mwfunk 9y ago
I have a foolproof technique that everyone is welcome to use: I don't apply for positions that I know will pay less than what I think I'm worth. Otherwise, if the interviews go well and I'm happy with them and they're happy with me and they want to move forward and make me offer, and the offer seems to low, I ask them to increases it. If they don't, I don't take the position. If they do: voila, mission accomplished! Crazy, I know, but this one crazy trick really seems to do it.

by a_imho 9y ago

Stock answers, all of them are expected in any given interview. Want to stand out? Say you are actually interested in earning money for your work, a truly novel idea nowadays.

drblast 9y ago

"Sorry, we don't do that here."

trevyn 9y ago

I completely agree that good software engineers are able to provide value significantly above the standard salary ranges for the profession. That said, I’m pretty pragmatic about it — I don’t want “a job”, but I respect that there is a price for which I would do the work. In the past, I’ve been direct and honest that the price is about $2M/yr + significant equity. Sends a message, and gets the wrong recruiters off your back. :) But — if you are applying for jobs for which there are common salary ranges, you are signalling that you’re likely willing to work for something in that general range. I think part of the larger situation is that the leaders of many small businesses (including many startups) don’t know how to effectively apply good engineers.

toomuchtodo 9y ago
Effective managers are in short supply compared to the number of founders running startups with no experience. I suppose this is because if you’re an effective manager, why would you lower your comp by working at a startup instead of at a larger established business that can properly compensate you for your valuable skill set (while anyone with some combination of an idea and some cash can be a founder).
fwdpropaganda 9y ago
Ever had anyone offer you $2M/yr?
a_imho 9y ago
I'm not really complaining about salaries though, just the fact that unsurprisingly honesty is not on anyone's list. Let's be frank, people want to pay their bills and suits are worried about bottom lines.

WJW 9y ago

Most employers are not actually all that interested in what _you want_, but in what _you can provide them_. If necessary, they will pay for that. A great many applicants that come by our company have as motivation "to develop myself" and similar. That won't get many employers excited. If you come by and tell us: "I have a great idea to make/save you X euro/month (and are credible)", that would make employers much more likely to hire you. Imagine if a grocer told you: I want you to buy this cucumber because it would make me feel great about my sales skills. Would you buy the cucumber just to do the grocer a favor? Now compare that to a grocer who tells you: "These cucumbers are delicious, healthy and will make you feel great about yourself for eating healthy food." IMO, the second grocer is much more likely to sell a lot of cucumbers, because he focuses on what his customers want instead of what he himself wants. The same is true for selling your labor.

skookumchuck 9y ago
In answer to "where do you see yourself in 5 years" question, I once told a potential employer that I would be CEO of his company. I didn't get an offer :-)
- GoToRO 9y ago
  I know somebody who did the same, and he ended up being the boss of a plant. Not the CEO, but still a lot of responsibility. And not from the start, he worked on all factory machines first and slowly he was given more responsibilities. It all depends on what they are looking for. This company looked for a local to replace the expats. It was a match.
itronitron 9y ago
the best answer is just to repeat back the position description or the company mission to whoever is asking
tnhaoeh34thoe9 9y ago
Likewise, most applicants are not interested in what _the company wants_, but in what _the company can provide them_. They are going to be working a minimum of 8 hours a day 5 days a week for your company. This is why the applicant pool is so awful. Companies don't care what candidates want, candidates don't care what companies want.

fwdpropaganda 9y ago

> Say you are actually interested in earning money for your work, a truly novel idea nowadays. Last month I was ruled out at screening stage because I "focused too much on money" (that was the recruiter's feedback to me from the company's HR). They wanted to pay £35k for a developer who also can build statistical models. In London.

crdoconnor 9y ago
They're on a road to disappointment.
- walshemj 9y ago
  Yes as I am in the market at the moment and that sort of role in London your looking at 50k at that rate your be lucky to get a newbie grad.
- dabockster 9y ago
  They're on a road to outsourcing.
a_imho 9y ago
I don't mean saying that will help with your application, but that is probably on the list 'things you rarely hear during interviews'. I also don't think good boy points help that much either, I'm subscribed to the idea we tend to hire people similar to us, effectively turning hiring into a numbers game without much influence over over that bias. Indeed, once a technically challenged HR included a whole spreadsheet of applicants in her reply, which basically confirmed her company rejects applicants for arbitrarily stupid reasons, so one might as well focus on the money.
- fwdpropaganda 9y ago
  > Indeed, once a technically challenged HR included a whole spreadsheet of applicants in her reply, which basically confirmed her company rejects applicants for arbitrarily stupid reasons Is this an imaginary situation, or did it actually happen? If the latter, link?

mwfunk 9y ago

I have a foolproof technique that everyone is welcome to use: I don't apply for positions that I know will pay less than what I think I'm worth. Otherwise, if the interviews go well and I'm happy with them and they're happy with me and they want to move forward and make me offer, and the offer seems to low, I ask them to increases it. If they don't, I don't take the position. If they do: voila, mission accomplished! Crazy, I know, but this one crazy trick really seems to do it.