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What about using Signal? Will they do something else then using the Signal protocol? If so, this might be either pretty expensive or could go wrong.

barbs 9y ago
I thought about that too...if their concern is that they want the server to remain on French soil could they not spin up an instance of their own Signal server? https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Server https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Server
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
VMG 9y ago
"Surveillance Risk" means that there is a risk that somebody other than the French government can do surveillance. > If so, this might be either pretty expensive or could go wrong. Keep in mind that they also wasted millions on building a "Google Competitor": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaero https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaero For the people receiving the money it didn't go wrong though.
pmlnr 9y ago
Signal doesn't work with desktop _only_ (without ever touching a smartphone). Matrix and XMPP does.
- Vinnl 9y ago
  I've seen (at least in a dev build) support for activating an account on desktop, i.e. you enter a confirmation code sent via SMS to a phone number you chose. That phone number needn't necessarily only be accessible through a smartphone, I'd presume.
alt678 9y ago
Afaik they would still need Google Services, based in the US obviously, to run Signal. There's technically an APK on the Signal website without Gapps, but it's not officially supported by the development team. On their issue tracker they "leave it to the open source folks", i.e. ignore serious bugs like massive battery life degradation and Signal silently not updating for hours.
- StudentStuff 9y ago
  Thing is, you either get massive battery life degradation or your messages won't get through, there isn't much of a choice there unless you use push messaging. Google Cloud Messaging allows Signal's servers to send a "Hey, wake up and connect to us!" message to your phone, and every other app uses GCM for this as Google has spent a ton of time trying to optimize both reachability and battery life with GCM. Maybe something will come along to supplant this, but for now push messaging is how we deal with terrible state table problems at the cell network operator level without wrecking battery life.
  - lorenzhs 9y ago
    Not only that, Google apparently has agreements with mobile network operators to ensure that their long-lived connections don't get closed after a few seconds or minutes of inactivity. Some mobile ISPs close idle connections after as little as ten seconds, so unless you're in a position to negotiate with just about every major mobile network operator worldwide, you can't really offer the same level of service.
    - StudentStuff 9y ago
      Apple likely has similar agreements too. I'm hoping that IPv6 will help alleviate many of these issues, as while your address may change as you move between towns, the state table needing to be maintained will be much less complex.

barbs 9y ago

I thought about that too...if their concern is that they want the server to remain on French soil could they not spin up an instance of their own Signal server? https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Server https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Server

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

VMG 9y ago

"Surveillance Risk" means that there is a risk that somebody other than the French government can do surveillance. > If so, this might be either pretty expensive or could go wrong. Keep in mind that they also wasted millions on building a "Google Competitor": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaero https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaero For the people receiving the money it didn't go wrong though.

pmlnr 9y ago

Signal doesn't work with desktop _only_ (without ever touching a smartphone). Matrix and XMPP does.

Vinnl 9y ago
I've seen (at least in a dev build) support for activating an account on desktop, i.e. you enter a confirmation code sent via SMS to a phone number you chose. That phone number needn't necessarily only be accessible through a smartphone, I'd presume.

alt678 9y ago

Afaik they would still need Google Services, based in the US obviously, to run Signal. There's technically an APK on the Signal website without Gapps, but it's not officially supported by the development team. On their issue tracker they "leave it to the open source folks", i.e. ignore serious bugs like massive battery life degradation and Signal silently not updating for hours.

StudentStuff 9y ago
Thing is, you either get massive battery life degradation or your messages won't get through, there isn't much of a choice there unless you use push messaging. Google Cloud Messaging allows Signal's servers to send a "Hey, wake up and connect to us!" message to your phone, and every other app uses GCM for this as Google has spent a ton of time trying to optimize both reachability and battery life with GCM. Maybe something will come along to supplant this, but for now push messaging is how we deal with terrible state table problems at the cell network operator level without wrecking battery life.
- lorenzhs 9y ago
  Not only that, Google apparently has agreements with mobile network operators to ensure that their long-lived connections don't get closed after a few seconds or minutes of inactivity. Some mobile ISPs close idle connections after as little as ten seconds, so unless you're in a position to negotiate with just about every major mobile network operator worldwide, you can't really offer the same level of service.
  - StudentStuff 9y ago
    Apple likely has similar agreements too. I'm hoping that IPv6 will help alleviate many of these issues, as while your address may change as you move between towns, the state table needing to be maintained will be much less complex.