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I'm not a fan of the clickbait title here. It trivializes depression. I think the only cure for depression is death. Too morbid? You manage depression with b

I'm not a fan of the clickbait title here. It trivializes depression. I think the only cure for depression is death. Too morbid? You manage depression with behavior and therapy. You can attempt to treat some of the symptoms with drugs. You can break out of a rut by trying new things. But curing depression... like once and for all? That's not realistic. "Sky diving helped me get out of a depressive episode," or "Skydiving helped me stave off having depressive episodes..." would be more accurate.

ephemeral8853 9y ago
“Stave off episodes” or “cure” is a modelling distinction. If the sense of depression doesn’t cloud over a life anymore, they both amount to the same thing. There’s nothing trivializing about that. It’s just an individual’s story of coping, recovery, and hope.
Razengan 9y ago
As someone with a sourceless depression for many years, I also used to think (and still do sometimes) that death/oblivion is the only "real" cure, and anything else is a temporary distraction from the problem. Lately I've been trying to see it from a different direction: What am I really looking for when I harbor suicidal thoughts? Escape, and more specifically: Freedom. It's not that I WANT to die; on the contrary, I want to live forever! There's too many things I want to do and see. I want to get off this planet and learn what's beyond. But I can't, and in the back of my mind I feel there's no point to anything. I like to create but nothing lasts forever. So I'd be content with just being able to explore and discover as much as I can, as long as I can. Skydiving definitely gives a sense of freedom, as well as some degree of control – I could choose to throw away my parachute and splat on the ground – but I suppose the rush of physical sensations might make one feel alive enough at the moment to not want to die just then..
sebcat 9y ago
Skydivers suffer from depression too. It would be interesting to know if skydivers as a group are more or less depressed than non skydivers or people who skydive less frequently. Are the effects the same for someone with +1000 jumps or is it the change in environment/trying new things that is the key to stave off an episode?
- rdlecler1 9y ago
  A confounding factor may be hobby and the social aspect.
- sjg007 9y ago
  It could be that they've adapted to the input. Basically the novelty of the dive has worn off. It'd be interesting to see if they still get the same adrenaline response every time.
  - nkoren 9y ago
    I did my ~30th jump with a guy who was approaching 20,000 jumps. He seemed to get just as high off of it as I did. Over time, the high changes -- from a feeling of "holy shit I'm alive!" to a much more sublime appreciation of the sensation of freedom while in freefall. You're not just dropping like a stone: every surface of your body becomes an aerodynamic control surface, and you feel like you can do anything (except, er, go up). That feeling of freedom never seems to diminish.
kolinko 9y ago
Depends on a source of depression - some people may have genetic issues with serotonin path (just like ADHD people have with dopamine, or diabetics with insulin). Fortunately anti-depressants help out with this. There is a nice book, "Listening to prozac", written by a psychiatrist who originally believed everything can be cured by therapy, but finally admitted that some people need to stay on anti-depressants for the whole life, since the source of their depression is neurologic.
ljm 9y ago
If you take a different perspective, the point isn't to see a one-time treatment that cures an illness, the same way you would with medication and surgery. In that sense death is a cure for anything and it's a total cop-out. I've made two attempts on my own life in the past decade and I'm incredibly grateful that I didn't get the realistic 'cure' I was looking for in those brief moments; in fact it could barely be considered a cure at all, especially if you believe in things such as karma and reincarnation (and this is true for many folk). Acceptance gives you the opportunity to enjoy your life while still being aware that there are times and situations where you really struggle and you've got to take care of yourself through them. You can take various steps to pull yourself out of the rabbit hole, even if only for a while, and get a better understanding of how you can manage your triggers or become more resilient to them. It might be a lifelong struggle, or you become resilient enough that you can deal with the dark moments really well or even sidestep them entirely by noticing certain feelings coming up. This means you still feel like a human being with a full spectrum of emotions without having them medicated or repressed out of existence. The key thing in stories like these is that often the person suffering the depression (or similar mental illness) is motivated to do something they would never have thought of before (or been too afraid of). It's not really staving anything off because if you reframe it, what you're seeing are these creative, beautiful and inspired acts to embrace life like they never did before. Travelling, skydiving, adventure, art, music, going to the cinema alone, meditating, volunteering... These remedies are otherwise known as 'being alive' and they're an incredible reaction to the often temporary desire to shuffle off the mortal coil. And what's better is that you can very easily enrich the lives of others as well as your own in the process, no matter what darkness is lurking deep inside you. If, with your depression or your mental trauma, you manage to live a full life anyway, then wasn't that as good as a cure, if not better? It's even better than managing it. This is just how it feels for me anyway; I've been dealing with complex PTSD for a long time and, in the most twisted way, I can say that my life became far more enriched through my efforts to work through that. In that sense I think seeing death as the only cure is an insane trivialization of the matter.
- rotexo 9y ago
  With you 100% on acceptance. Just to add to the record: in my experience, medication (at its best) hasn’t numbed me, more that it gives me a window to recognize what I’m feeling, which has helped me to continue pursuing the things that I value. YMMV, of course.
ada1981 9y ago
Psychedelics can cure depression. When you release the root cause of this stuff it often resolves for life.
- danlugo92 9y ago
  Could you explain a bit what you mean by "release the root cause"?
  - ada1981 9y ago
    Very often this stuff is caused by developmental or shock trauma of some kind. One way of describing it is this folks aren't in a contracted or defended state due to the current context of their lives. Psychedelics (used responsibly) can help to face the emotions (and past experiences) that the psyche has been holding back and supressing (thus depression). There are numerous access points to shift these patterns, but psychedelics and non-ordinary states work (like Breathwork) have proven to be very effective in my life and in the lives of many I know and work with.
djsumdog 9y ago
> I think the only cure for depression is death. Too morbid? Not at all. Twice in my life I've been on anti-depressants, and both times I hated them. One was when I was in middle school; more against my will. My parents wanted me to stop washing my hands (I had/still have Obsessive Compulsive Disorder; washed my hands several times an hour some days). My dad just wanted a pill to fix me I think. The one therapist that suggested group/family therapy was the one we never went back to. I tried against for a short time in University and it was worse. Sure initially you're smiling more (enough that other people noticed more than I did), but the side effects were harsh; more so when I was a kid. I'd want to sleep all the time and had zero energy. I couldn't masturbate. I started feeling numb; and I remembered that same feeling I had as a kid: If I felt like I needed to wash my hands to go work on something; on the meds (various SSRIs specifically), I would just stay in front of the TV instead of doing something constructive I enjoyed. I recently lost a high school friend to suicide. He had been struggling for over a decade. It was hard to get him to hang out; was like pulling teeth. He'd been gone from my life for a long time. I'm sad I didn't get more chances to hang out with him. But I also know that he's at peace now. The trouble today is that we like to treat all depression as a problem with the self. We use a combination of drugs and therapy that tries to help deal with negative thought patterns. But those approaches ignore the very true reality that life is hard! Life kinda sucks. I work in a cube all day making shit software. We walk by homeless people every day who are a product of bad circumstances and bad decisions, of which we could have easily been in other circumstances. So much of what we buy and consumes hurts people on the other side of the planet. You mention how you think this article on Skydiving trivializes depression, but maybe not so much. This person did something and changed the external. When I was really depressed, I got a holiday work visa and took off for Australia. I lived there for a year, two and a half in New Zealand and then backpacked for 11 months. I tried to get some support to sustain myself, but I always seem to end up back in a cube. Yet during those times that I changed my external, I really felt like I was leaving that dark place I had been in most of my life. The fact is, the only thing that made a meaningful impact on my depression was to find ways to change the external .. and that's really hard for people who are really depressed, because every step in that direction takes an incredible amount of energy. In a lot of ways I'm just lucky, because I somehow always am able to force myself to do what needs to be done (finish my degree, finish selling all my stuff and packing the rest, etc. etc.) I don't know. I'm half and half on this. I see your point, but I also think there are serious problems with the way we try to approach mental illness in the world today.

ephemeral8853 9y ago

“Stave off episodes” or “cure” is a modelling distinction. If the sense of depression doesn’t cloud over a life anymore, they both amount to the same thing. There’s nothing trivializing about that. It’s just an individual’s story of coping, recovery, and hope.

Razengan 9y ago

As someone with a sourceless depression for many years, I also used to think (and still do sometimes) that death/oblivion is the only "real" cure, and anything else is a temporary distraction from the problem. Lately I've been trying to see it from a different direction: What am I really looking for when I harbor suicidal thoughts? Escape, and more specifically: Freedom. It's not that I WANT to die; on the contrary, I want to live forever! There's too many things I want to do and see. I want to get off this planet and learn what's beyond. But I can't, and in the back of my mind I feel there's no point to anything. I like to create but nothing lasts forever. So I'd be content with just being able to explore and discover as much as I can, as long as I can. Skydiving definitely gives a sense of freedom, as well as some degree of control – I could choose to throw away my parachute and splat on the ground – but I suppose the rush of physical sensations might make one feel alive enough at the moment to not want to die just then..

sebcat 9y ago

Skydivers suffer from depression too. It would be interesting to know if skydivers as a group are more or less depressed than non skydivers or people who skydive less frequently. Are the effects the same for someone with +1000 jumps or is it the change in environment/trying new things that is the key to stave off an episode?

rdlecler1 9y ago
A confounding factor may be hobby and the social aspect.
sjg007 9y ago
It could be that they've adapted to the input. Basically the novelty of the dive has worn off. It'd be interesting to see if they still get the same adrenaline response every time.
- nkoren 9y ago
  I did my ~30th jump with a guy who was approaching 20,000 jumps. He seemed to get just as high off of it as I did. Over time, the high changes -- from a feeling of "holy shit I'm alive!" to a much more sublime appreciation of the sensation of freedom while in freefall. You're not just dropping like a stone: every surface of your body becomes an aerodynamic control surface, and you feel like you can do anything (except, er, go up). That feeling of freedom never seems to diminish.

kolinko 9y ago

Depends on a source of depression - some people may have genetic issues with serotonin path (just like ADHD people have with dopamine, or diabetics with insulin). Fortunately anti-depressants help out with this. There is a nice book, "Listening to prozac", written by a psychiatrist who originally believed everything can be cured by therapy, but finally admitted that some people need to stay on anti-depressants for the whole life, since the source of their depression is neurologic.

ljm 9y ago

If you take a different perspective, the point isn't to see a one-time treatment that cures an illness, the same way you would with medication and surgery. In that sense death is a cure for anything and it's a total cop-out. I've made two attempts on my own life in the past decade and I'm incredibly grateful that I didn't get the realistic 'cure' I was looking for in those brief moments; in fact it could barely be considered a cure at all, especially if you believe in things such as karma and reincarnation (and this is true for many folk). Acceptance gives you the opportunity to enjoy your life while still being aware that there are times and situations where you really struggle and you've got to take care of yourself through them. You can take various steps to pull yourself out of the rabbit hole, even if only for a while, and get a better understanding of how you can manage your triggers or become more resilient to them. It might be a lifelong struggle, or you become resilient enough that you can deal with the dark moments really well or even sidestep them entirely by noticing certain feelings coming up. This means you still feel like a human being with a full spectrum of emotions without having them medicated or repressed out of existence. The key thing in stories like these is that often the person suffering the depression (or similar mental illness) is motivated to do something they would never have thought of before (or been too afraid of). It's not really staving anything off because if you reframe it, what you're seeing are these creative, beautiful and inspired acts to embrace life like they never did before. Travelling, skydiving, adventure, art, music, going to the cinema alone, meditating, volunteering... These remedies are otherwise known as 'being alive' and they're an incredible reaction to the often temporary desire to shuffle off the mortal coil. And what's better is that you can very easily enrich the lives of others as well as your own in the process, no matter what darkness is lurking deep inside you. If, with your depression or your mental trauma, you manage to live a full life anyway, then wasn't that as good as a cure, if not better? It's even better than managing it. This is just how it feels for me anyway; I've been dealing with complex PTSD for a long time and, in the most twisted way, I can say that my life became far more enriched through my efforts to work through that. In that sense I think seeing death as the only cure is an insane trivialization of the matter.

rotexo 9y ago
With you 100% on acceptance. Just to add to the record: in my experience, medication (at its best) hasn’t numbed me, more that it gives me a window to recognize what I’m feeling, which has helped me to continue pursuing the things that I value. YMMV, of course.

ada1981 9y ago

Psychedelics can cure depression. When you release the root cause of this stuff it often resolves for life.

danlugo92 9y ago
Could you explain a bit what you mean by "release the root cause"?
- ada1981 9y ago
  Very often this stuff is caused by developmental or shock trauma of some kind. One way of describing it is this folks aren't in a contracted or defended state due to the current context of their lives. Psychedelics (used responsibly) can help to face the emotions (and past experiences) that the psyche has been holding back and supressing (thus depression). There are numerous access points to shift these patterns, but psychedelics and non-ordinary states work (like Breathwork) have proven to be very effective in my life and in the lives of many I know and work with.

djsumdog 9y ago

> I think the only cure for depression is death. Too morbid? Not at all. Twice in my life I've been on anti-depressants, and both times I hated them. One was when I was in middle school; more against my will. My parents wanted me to stop washing my hands (I had/still have Obsessive Compulsive Disorder; washed my hands several times an hour some days). My dad just wanted a pill to fix me I think. The one therapist that suggested group/family therapy was the one we never went back to. I tried against for a short time in University and it was worse. Sure initially you're smiling more (enough that other people noticed more than I did), but the side effects were harsh; more so when I was a kid. I'd want to sleep all the time and had zero energy. I couldn't masturbate. I started feeling numb; and I remembered that same feeling I had as a kid: If I felt like I needed to wash my hands to go work on something; on the meds (various SSRIs specifically), I would just stay in front of the TV instead of doing something constructive I enjoyed. I recently lost a high school friend to suicide. He had been struggling for over a decade. It was hard to get him to hang out; was like pulling teeth. He'd been gone from my life for a long time. I'm sad I didn't get more chances to hang out with him. But I also know that he's at peace now. The trouble today is that we like to treat all depression as a problem with the self. We use a combination of drugs and therapy that tries to help deal with negative thought patterns. But those approaches ignore the very true reality that life is hard! Life kinda sucks. I work in a cube all day making shit software. We walk by homeless people every day who are a product of bad circumstances and bad decisions, of which we could have easily been in other circumstances. So much of what we buy and consumes hurts people on the other side of the planet. You mention how you think this article on Skydiving trivializes depression, but maybe not so much. This person did something and changed the external. When I was really depressed, I got a holiday work visa and took off for Australia. I lived there for a year, two and a half in New Zealand and then backpacked for 11 months. I tried to get some support to sustain myself, but I always seem to end up back in a cube. Yet during those times that I changed my external, I really felt like I was leaving that dark place I had been in most of my life. The fact is, the only thing that made a meaningful impact on my depression was to find ways to change the external .. and that's really hard for people who are really depressed, because every step in that direction takes an incredible amount of energy. In a lot of ways I'm just lucky, because I somehow always am able to force myself to do what needs to be done (finish my degree, finish selling all my stuff and packing the rest, etc. etc.) I don't know. I'm half and half on this. I see your point, but I also think there are serious problems with the way we try to approach mental illness in the world today.