4 ms·

All tech companies need to re-think manufacturing in China, it was always a risky proposition, but not, you'll really be handing your IP over to the Chinese Gov

All tech companies need to re-think manufacturing in China, it was always a risky proposition, but not, you'll really be handing your IP over to the Chinese Government, and they'll be collecting IP from every company. It's time for tech manufacturing to move.

pm90 9y ago
Where will it move to? Tech manufacturing is till pretty labor intensive, at least for the consumer electronics that I believe we are talking about. India probably has better IP laws on paper, but they're hardly ever enforced. The only real alternative seems to be that we reach such a level of automation that these factories can be viable in the West. Still, China's integration into the supply chain of global manufacturing is breathtaking. Not saying it can't be done, but it would take some amount of determination, deliberation and a lot of Capital and skilled labor force.
- Shivetya 9y ago
  Africa, even China has been moving that way.
  - justicezyx 9y ago
    Look who's already there 2 decades ago and enjoying more influence than anyone else...
  - pm90 9y ago
    Are you saying that African nations have laws that protect American IP? I think you're sorely mistaken. China has been moving to Africa mostly for influence building and securing supplies of raw materials. It is a brilliant strategy, and I would argue that as long and they're helping improve the quality of life, an overall good thing. China is NOT opening up high-tech manufacturing plants in Africa. In fact most of the infrastructure in Africa is sourced from Chinese Companies (e.g. railway coaches)
- kchoudhu 9y ago
  Come to South Asia -- Bangladesh, India, Pakistan. Weak institutions and governments concerned solely with infighting mean that your IP is probably safe from marauding governments. All your clothes are already made there, why not your electronics?
  - antoniuschan99 9y ago
    I noticed some electronics components I order are coming from Thailand. Stem is strong in those regions and China's workforce are demanding higher skills jobs. While factories are moving towards automation because of rising wages.
  - selimthegrim 9y ago
    Terrible vocational education system. Everyone wants to do a BCom or BTech and be a manager.
    - contingencies 9y ago
      Also: Unreliable power supply and internet. Corrupt customs officials. Petty crime.
- coldacid 9y ago
  Maybe we as consumers in the west just need to suck up the higher costs for our tech stuff to be manufactured back here in the Americas and Europe. Sure it won't be pleasant for our wallets, but it'd be worth it.
  - pm90 9y ago
    Actually the hollowing out of the middle class means that American consumers are more price sensitive than they would be if they had larger incomes...
- foepys 9y ago
  I fear it might even be too late. Tech-hotspots like Shenzhen are so highly specialized on producing any kind of tech extremely fast, that the Western world cannot replicate that without massive costs that would instantly double all hardware prices. The kind of expertise needed to create those manufacturing powerhouses might not even be in Western hands anymore. Nowadays, if you are a hardware start-up that needs specialized components, you don't start in the EU or NA - you go to Shenzhen to get your prototypes cheap and super fast. Often within two days from design to working prototype.
  - skookumchuck 9y ago
    Nationalizing the tech sector will have a negative impact on its growth and innovation.
  - antoniuschan99 9y ago
    It's actually not totally true. There are tons of pcb fabs in NA. But it's a lot cheaper in China. R&D costs are just more expensive here or it takes longer vs in Shenzen. 3d printing has also drastically reduced time to production as you can iterate the design during development.
    - foepys 9y ago
      Tesla has just found out that producing 100 cars a week is absolutely different than producing 5,000 cars a week. The same applies to every other product. A few PCB fans will not have the expertise to build factories that output millions of PCBs a month.
      - pm90 9y ago
        This is interesting. Is the problem here a lack of skilled labor force to do so? I'm wondering what prevents the US from having vocational programs to teach American workers those skills and kickstart that kind of manufacturing again.

pm90 9y ago

Where will it move to? Tech manufacturing is till pretty labor intensive, at least for the consumer electronics that I believe we are talking about. India probably has better IP laws on paper, but they're hardly ever enforced. The only real alternative seems to be that we reach such a level of automation that these factories can be viable in the West. Still, China's integration into the supply chain of global manufacturing is breathtaking. Not saying it can't be done, but it would take some amount of determination, deliberation and a lot of Capital and skilled labor force.

Shivetya 9y ago
Africa, even China has been moving that way.
- justicezyx 9y ago
  Look who's already there 2 decades ago and enjoying more influence than anyone else...
- pm90 9y ago
  Are you saying that African nations have laws that protect American IP? I think you're sorely mistaken. China has been moving to Africa mostly for influence building and securing supplies of raw materials. It is a brilliant strategy, and I would argue that as long and they're helping improve the quality of life, an overall good thing. China is NOT opening up high-tech manufacturing plants in Africa. In fact most of the infrastructure in Africa is sourced from Chinese Companies (e.g. railway coaches)
kchoudhu 9y ago
Come to South Asia -- Bangladesh, India, Pakistan. Weak institutions and governments concerned solely with infighting mean that your IP is probably safe from marauding governments. All your clothes are already made there, why not your electronics?
- antoniuschan99 9y ago
  I noticed some electronics components I order are coming from Thailand. Stem is strong in those regions and China's workforce are demanding higher skills jobs. While factories are moving towards automation because of rising wages.
- selimthegrim 9y ago
  Terrible vocational education system. Everyone wants to do a BCom or BTech and be a manager.
  - contingencies 9y ago
    Also: Unreliable power supply and internet. Corrupt customs officials. Petty crime.
coldacid 9y ago
Maybe we as consumers in the west just need to suck up the higher costs for our tech stuff to be manufactured back here in the Americas and Europe. Sure it won't be pleasant for our wallets, but it'd be worth it.
- pm90 9y ago
  Actually the hollowing out of the middle class means that American consumers are more price sensitive than they would be if they had larger incomes...
foepys 9y ago
I fear it might even be too late. Tech-hotspots like Shenzhen are so highly specialized on producing any kind of tech extremely fast, that the Western world cannot replicate that without massive costs that would instantly double all hardware prices. The kind of expertise needed to create those manufacturing powerhouses might not even be in Western hands anymore. Nowadays, if you are a hardware start-up that needs specialized components, you don't start in the EU or NA - you go to Shenzhen to get your prototypes cheap and super fast. Often within two days from design to working prototype.
- skookumchuck 9y ago
  Nationalizing the tech sector will have a negative impact on its growth and innovation.
- antoniuschan99 9y ago
  It's actually not totally true. There are tons of pcb fabs in NA. But it's a lot cheaper in China. R&D costs are just more expensive here or it takes longer vs in Shenzen. 3d printing has also drastically reduced time to production as you can iterate the design during development.
  - foepys 9y ago
    Tesla has just found out that producing 100 cars a week is absolutely different than producing 5,000 cars a week. The same applies to every other product. A few PCB fans will not have the expertise to build factories that output millions of PCBs a month.
    - pm90 9y ago
      This is interesting. Is the problem here a lack of skilled labor force to do so? I'm wondering what prevents the US from having vocational programs to teach American workers those skills and kickstart that kind of manufacturing again.