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arent's you romanticizing the US a bit much? the country was built by slaves. "the US will self-select for the ambitious and the inspired and those who desire

arent's you romanticizing the US a bit much? the country was built by slaves. "the US will self-select for the ambitious and the inspired and those who desire freedom" this is just hogwash

alehul 9y ago
Sorry if you found it offensive. I'm definitely romanticizing the U.S. quite a bit. At the same time, that romanticization is inspiring (at least to me) and largely true today when you compare us to countries like China, where you have much less control over your future. Also, moving to a country that provides greater freedom and opportunity at the cost of less of a social net and lower taxes will almost definitely self-select for the ambitious. Slavery also continued in practice in China until at least 1949 [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_China
- pm90 9y ago
  Forced labor camps still exist in China, to this day https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laogai https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laogai
  - arcticbull 9y ago
    What do you call a US prison farm? [1] Even Wikipedia acknowledges that "the concepts of prison farm and labor camp overlap." Labor camps are even explicitly permitted by the 13th amendment "... which ended slavery, specifically perpetuated the concept of penal servitude – i.e., unfree labor as a punishment for a crime." [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_farm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_farm
    - pm90 9y ago
      There is a difference between political prisoners and criminals. There is a rule of law in the US which means you cannot arbitrarily imprison anyone; there is due process and a trial. That is missing from the Chinese Judicial System which makes it much more akin to Slave Labor.
- cambalache 9y ago
  You are just human. So that means in general you are xenophobic, nationalist, racist and operate on the unstated assumption that you and your fellow nationals are 100X more worthy than any foreigner.
- 3242342sadf 9y ago
  "moving to a country that provides greater freedom and opportunity at the cost of less of a social net and lower taxes will almost definitely self-select for the ambitious" That's flawed logic. 1. There is no study that stated less social net and lower taxes will definitely self-select for the ambitious. 2. US does not have the lowest tax in the world.
i_am_nomad 9y ago
The vast majority of physical and intellectual labor that “built” the United States was performed by free men. I’m not saying there wasn’t slavery, but your assertion is absurd.
- 3242342sadf 9y ago
  His assertion is absurd as much as OP's.
adrianN 9y ago
Are there any countries that don't have a bloddy past?
- 3242342sadf 9y ago
  You aren't refuting his point. His point was that OP was romanticizing his own country.
venomsnake 9y ago
> the country was built by slaves Only the agrarian south. The industry was in the North.

arent's you romanticizing the US a bit much? the country was built by slaves. "the US will self-select for the ambitious and the inspired and those who desire freedom" this is just hogwash

alehul 9y ago

Sorry if you found it offensive. I'm definitely romanticizing the U.S. quite a bit. At the same time, that romanticization is inspiring (at least to me) and largely true today when you compare us to countries like China, where you have much less control over your future. Also, moving to a country that provides greater freedom and opportunity at the cost of less of a social net and lower taxes will almost definitely self-select for the ambitious. Slavery also continued in practice in China until at least 1949 [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_China

pm90 9y ago
Forced labor camps still exist in China, to this day https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laogai https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laogai
- arcticbull 9y ago
  What do you call a US prison farm? [1] Even Wikipedia acknowledges that "the concepts of prison farm and labor camp overlap." Labor camps are even explicitly permitted by the 13th amendment "... which ended slavery, specifically perpetuated the concept of penal servitude – i.e., unfree labor as a punishment for a crime." [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_farm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_farm
  - pm90 9y ago
    There is a difference between political prisoners and criminals. There is a rule of law in the US which means you cannot arbitrarily imprison anyone; there is due process and a trial. That is missing from the Chinese Judicial System which makes it much more akin to Slave Labor.
cambalache 9y ago
You are just human. So that means in general you are xenophobic, nationalist, racist and operate on the unstated assumption that you and your fellow nationals are 100X more worthy than any foreigner.
3242342sadf 9y ago
"moving to a country that provides greater freedom and opportunity at the cost of less of a social net and lower taxes will almost definitely self-select for the ambitious" That's flawed logic. 1. There is no study that stated less social net and lower taxes will definitely self-select for the ambitious. 2. US does not have the lowest tax in the world.

i_am_nomad 9y ago

The vast majority of physical and intellectual labor that “built” the United States was performed by free men. I’m not saying there wasn’t slavery, but your assertion is absurd.

3242342sadf 9y ago
His assertion is absurd as much as OP's.

adrianN 9y ago

Are there any countries that don't have a bloddy past?

3242342sadf 9y ago
You aren't refuting his point. His point was that OP was romanticizing his own country.

venomsnake 9y ago

> the country was built by slaves Only the agrarian south. The industry was in the North.