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anybody have any input if this is feasible for apps like Signal? How would this be technically feasible? - have a backdoored version on Google Play / App Stor

anybody have any input if this is feasible for apps like Signal? How would this be technically feasible? - have a backdoored version on Google Play / App Store? - MITM the SMS registration? - Force WhisperSystems to run a different binary? - Jam communications if they can't intercept?

Arbalest 9y ago
More likely that it can't become a large corporate entity with corporate presence, I would imagine. They can't realistically stop encryption without becoming Iran, but they can sure slow its popularity. Most likely they're trying make people who do use unbreakable encryption stand out, so they don't have as many people to monitor. Edit: As an Australian myself, this does worry me. But I plan to keep using strong encryption as a protest.
- acct1771 9y ago
  > They can't realistically stop encryption without becoming Iran What's to stop them? > I plan to keep using strong encryption as a protest And when the people with guns come?
  - Arbalest 9y ago
    If it takes innocents to demonstrate it has gone to far, then I will be the proof. Either that or we already all know it has become Iran and I won't be hanging around.
incompatible 9y ago
I'm not sure I want to give the Australian government ideas, but I doubt I'll come up with anything original, and I can't resist imagining how I'd do it if I was the authoritarian type. They obviously can't touch foreign organizations and services directly, so they have to influence what happens in Australia. They could force ISPs to block the IP addresses of the services. They could also make it illegal for people in Australia to have a device that can't be unlocked by the authorities, and make it illegal to install encrypted communication apps. That way, if they get a wiretap and discover that they can't decrypt the communications, they can simply arrest and charge the person for that. Edit: I doubt the Australian government could actually get away with this approach. Encrypted apps have gone mainstream and too many people would be upset if they were banned. Hopefully the Labor Party would oppose such a bill and it wouldn't make it through the Senate (no guarantees).
- Mayzie 9y ago
  > Hopefully the Labor Party would oppose such a bill and it wouldn't make it through the Senate (no guarantees). Oh, please. They don't understand technology or its impacts, just like the current government. All they hear is that encryption prevents law enforcement from doing what they want. It'll go through the Senate.
- BLKNSLVR 9y ago
  Unfortunately a lot of the crazy talk about backdooring encryption in Australia is bipartisan because whichever party disagrees with it will be made to look "weak on crime / terrorism / paedophilia" and don't want to take that hit-in-the-polls. If the punishments for using illegal encrypted services are less than the punishments for whatever crime is being committed, this won't work. BUT, if the punishments for simply using encrypted services, that we've already been using "safely" for years, are in the same ballpark as serious crime / terrorism / paedophilia then there's the potential for a lot of collateral damage that will make the passage of such laws difficult. If such laws do get passed, there could be a lot of stand-by-their-principles IT types (like me) serving long sentences for texting their partners asking whether milk should be purchased on the way home.
- jazoom 9y ago
  Luckily for us they're probably not competent enough to enforce it.
  - incompatible 9y ago
    I can't imagine the politicians themselves to be competent enough to even understand the problem and write the legislation. But maybe they employ people who can. The technical details of the "encryption with backdoors" would be left to the companies that have enough presence in Australia that they need to conform to it. The enforcement against criminals using encryption would be as simple as the police finding that they can't decrypt the contents of a wire tap because the app isn't backdoored.
    - jazoom 9y ago

Arbalest 9y ago

More likely that it can't become a large corporate entity with corporate presence, I would imagine. They can't realistically stop encryption without becoming Iran, but they can sure slow its popularity. Most likely they're trying make people who do use unbreakable encryption stand out, so they don't have as many people to monitor. Edit: As an Australian myself, this does worry me. But I plan to keep using strong encryption as a protest.

acct1771 9y ago
> They can't realistically stop encryption without becoming Iran What's to stop them? > I plan to keep using strong encryption as a protest And when the people with guns come?
- Arbalest 9y ago
  If it takes innocents to demonstrate it has gone to far, then I will be the proof. Either that or we already all know it has become Iran and I won't be hanging around.

incompatible 9y ago

I'm not sure I want to give the Australian government ideas, but I doubt I'll come up with anything original, and I can't resist imagining how I'd do it if I was the authoritarian type. They obviously can't touch foreign organizations and services directly, so they have to influence what happens in Australia. They could force ISPs to block the IP addresses of the services. They could also make it illegal for people in Australia to have a device that can't be unlocked by the authorities, and make it illegal to install encrypted communication apps. That way, if they get a wiretap and discover that they can't decrypt the communications, they can simply arrest and charge the person for that. Edit: I doubt the Australian government could actually get away with this approach. Encrypted apps have gone mainstream and too many people would be upset if they were banned. Hopefully the Labor Party would oppose such a bill and it wouldn't make it through the Senate (no guarantees).

Mayzie 9y ago
> Hopefully the Labor Party would oppose such a bill and it wouldn't make it through the Senate (no guarantees). Oh, please. They don't understand technology or its impacts, just like the current government. All they hear is that encryption prevents law enforcement from doing what they want. It'll go through the Senate.
BLKNSLVR 9y ago
Unfortunately a lot of the crazy talk about backdooring encryption in Australia is bipartisan because whichever party disagrees with it will be made to look "weak on crime / terrorism / paedophilia" and don't want to take that hit-in-the-polls. If the punishments for using illegal encrypted services are less than the punishments for whatever crime is being committed, this won't work. BUT, if the punishments for simply using encrypted services, that we've already been using "safely" for years, are in the same ballpark as serious crime / terrorism / paedophilia then there's the potential for a lot of collateral damage that will make the passage of such laws difficult. If such laws do get passed, there could be a lot of stand-by-their-principles IT types (like me) serving long sentences for texting their partners asking whether milk should be purchased on the way home.
jazoom 9y ago
Luckily for us they're probably not competent enough to enforce it.
- incompatible 9y ago
  I can't imagine the politicians themselves to be competent enough to even understand the problem and write the legislation. But maybe they employ people who can. The technical details of the "encryption with backdoors" would be left to the companies that have enough presence in Australia that they need to conform to it. The enforcement against criminals using encryption would be as simple as the police finding that they can't decrypt the contents of a wire tap because the app isn't backdoored.
  - jazoom 9y ago