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I'm talking about active level 2 systems, which the Autopilot is an example of. A level 2 system has to be monitored 100% of the time, because it can not be tr

by skgoa 9y ago

I'm talking about active level 2 systems, which the Autopilot is an example of. A level 2 system has to be monitored 100% of the time, because it can not be trusted to warn the driver and fall back to manual automatically in every situation. A level 3 system is robust enough to make this guarantee, which means that the driver can take his/her hands off the wheel until prompted to take back control. Autopilot is a level 2 system, because you can not take your hands of the wheel of a Tesla and expect to not die. In fact the car itself will tell you to put your hands back on the wheel after a short while. After the fatal crashes started getting into the media, Tesla themselves have stated that it's only a level 2 system. Their CEO's weird claims of Autopilot being able to handle 90% of all driving tasks, there being a coast-to-coast Autopilot demonstration run in 2017 etc. are just marketing BS.

icc97 9y ago
Yep, fair enough, I was wrong Autopilot is level 2. However I still disagree with your original comment: > Sorry, but this is the exact wrong conclusion to make from the available data. Partially automated cars have been driven by average people on the public roads since 2006, when the Mercedes S class got active steering and ACC. There is no data that says that these systems, which are available on cars as affordable as e.g. a VW Polo, lead to more crashes. In fact the only data I have seen suggests that they reduce crashes and driver fatigue significantly. Firstly, I don't see any examples of VW Polo claiming to have a steering assist, even the most recent 2017 edition [1] only has level 1 features [0]. Steering assist only came to the Mecedes S-Class in 2014 [2]. What I (and the parent comment you initially replied to) was tying to claim was that where as Level 1 features [0] (cruise control, automatic braking, and lane keeping) are great, level 2 (and level 3 according to Google/Waymo) is risky because humans cannot be trusted to be alert and ready to take over. [0]: www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/Automated_Vehicles_Policy.pdf [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Polo#Sixth_generation_(2017-Present) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Polo#Sixth_generati... [2]: https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1080502_2014-mercedes-benz-s-class-autonomous-steering-tested https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1080502_2014-mercedes-be...

by skgoa 9y ago

icc97 9y ago

Yep, fair enough, I was wrong Autopilot is level 2. However I still disagree with your original comment: > Sorry, but this is the exact wrong conclusion to make from the available data. Partially automated cars have been driven by average people on the public roads since 2006, when the Mercedes S class got active steering and ACC. There is no data that says that these systems, which are available on cars as affordable as e.g. a VW Polo, lead to more crashes. In fact the only data I have seen suggests that they reduce crashes and driver fatigue significantly. Firstly, I don't see any examples of VW Polo claiming to have a steering assist, even the most recent 2017 edition [1] only has level 1 features [0]. Steering assist only came to the Mecedes S-Class in 2014 [2]. What I (and the parent comment you initially replied to) was tying to claim was that where as Level 1 features [0] (cruise control, automatic braking, and lane keeping) are great, level 2 (and level 3 according to Google/Waymo) is risky because humans cannot be trusted to be alert and ready to take over. [0]: www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/Automated_Vehicles_Policy.pdf [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Polo#Sixth_generation_(2017-Present) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Polo#Sixth_generati... [2]: https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1080502_2014-mercedes-benz-s-class-autonomous-steering-tested https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1080502_2014-mercedes-be...