7 ms·

Ask HN: After earning how much money are you planning to retire?

9 points by Arthanari 8y ago

onion2k 8y ago
I strongly suspect I'll never earn enough retire.
muzani 8y ago
I don't plan to retire. I had a nice half year break after selling my company. It's not that great. Productive engineer = happy engineer. I'd like to be a kind of tech monk. Someone who goes around on the bare minimum needed to survive, be away from the distractions of society, and polish my skills day after day. Every now and then I'd leave my monastery to rescue a half billion dollar project somewhere or to take down an evil tech giant with open source. Then I use my loot to continue another few years of peace and solitude.
- jackgolding 8y ago
  I have had 2 involuntary 3 month breaks between jobs and even though I was strapped for cash I really hated how much my mood fell apart without having the structure of work. I told myself I want to move away from having so much of my life's meaning defined by what work I do (while it's software for any enterprise anyway.) I'm at the stage now where I'm hoping to take off at least a month for travel next year. Are there any learnings you had from your half a year break like this?
  - muzani 8y ago
    It wasn't great. There's a lot of anxiety watching my bank account go down with no plan at all. Resting seems even more unproductive, it resulted in a lot of bad habits forming. I find I am much happier working 14 hours/day than resting 24 hours. I did have an extremely productive remote work era during that period for a side project, but unfortunately the team fell apart.
    - dennisgorelik 8y ago
      > it resulted in a lot of bad habits forming What kind of bad habits did "resting" form?
      - muzani 8y ago
        Well things like needing more rest. I ended up "resting" 3 weekdays a week. Or things like taking 3 hours to prepare for the work day, via meditation, clearing up my workspace, getting exercise, and so on. I wouldn't say it's laziness, but having too much time makes you bad at time management.
dpeck 8y ago
https://kopywritingkourse.com/fuck-you-money-calculator/ https://kopywritingkourse.com/fuck-you-money-calculator/
potta_coffee 8y ago
I'm barely making it so retirement is not likely going to happen for me.
- cerberusss 8y ago
  Aren't you worried about that?
  - potta_coffee 8y ago
    Yes, I'm terrified.
- marcc 8y ago
  Why are you barely making it?
  - potta_coffee 8y ago
    I'm not good at selling myself, I don't live in a tech-hub city, and I'm probably mediocre at my job. I feel good about the work I do and do have strengths but I'm not proving to be a competitive candidate for the work I want. I'm spending my free time acquiring better skills so hopefully this will change for me.
    - luxpir 8y ago
      Regarding mediocre: https://lwn.net/Articles/641779/ https://lwn.net/Articles/641779/ The take-away from the post (and vid, linked at bottom) is that most people should be mediocre. It's not a bad thing. Take pride in having reached that far. As for the selling issue; you're aware of it, so that's obviously a good thing. Next is to put together some kind of promo that you can live with. A portfolio site, some blogging about what you've learned etc. Sure you'll get decent opportunities if you keep skilling up and making folks aware of your current abilities. Regarding non-hub city: remote work an option? Biggest local companies? EDIT: Just saw you've seen the post linked to above already. And you're probably more experienced than I'd understood from your comment. I'm tempted to say you might only be bad at selling yourself because you self-deprecate too much. But that's another assumption!
cerberusss 8y ago
When I have saved and invested around 500k in euros, this will generate about 20k euros per year. My mortgage will be paid as well, so it will be enough to live on. I'll be 55 by then.
- onion2k 8y ago
  You've forgotten about inflation.
  - fjsolwmv 8y ago
    4% real gains includes inflation
    - onion2k 8y ago
      Here in the UK inflation was 18% in 1980. It's been over 10% several times since then. 4% assumes things will carry on as they have been for the past couple of decades. There's no reason to believe that.
      - deanmoriarty 8y ago
        But if you don't hold too much cash/fixed income securities and actually hold equity investments (e.g. real estate, stocks), then why would inflation be a concern? All those investments should easily keep up with inflation by their very nature, or am I wrong?
baccredited 8y ago
5.6MM based on spending 18,668/mo = 224K/yr 25 x 224k = 5.6MM assumptions: - withdraw 4% per yr - earn avg 7%+ per yr - inflation 3% Money will last forever and I will die with bigger balance than day I retire. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-sim... ps. I will hit this number in 47 months. Here's how I know: https://lab.madfientist.com/ https://lab.madfientist.com/
- IpV8 8y ago
  Wow thats a ton!!! I suppose you must live in a higher cost of living area than me.
  - baccredited 8y ago
    Haha - family of 4. Expensive travel hobbies. Too much house. "Fatfire" https://www.physicianonfire.com/fatfire/ https://www.physicianonfire.com/fatfire/
  - fjsolwmv 8y ago
    Higher cost of living personality, not area.
- dsacco 8y ago
  FYI, that link requires a login. Is it supposed to be public?
  - baccredited 8y ago
    Sorry - if you sign up this site will allow you to input your monthly savings, spending, and net worth. Then it will estimate the amount of time before you achieve Financial Independence. It is free. I'm a big fan. https://lab.madfientist.com/pages/help https://lab.madfientist.com/pages/help
    - shostack 8y ago
SirLJ 8y ago
Just work on your passive income generation, few hundred thousands per year would be enough for most people.... Once you have your FY money, you'll see that retirement is overrated... and I have a lot of hobbies + plans to travel with my wife when the kids are out of the house (hopefully in the next few years), but besides all that, every year I am postponing my retirement, because I just cannot leave the team I am managing... so maybe next year :-)
elliottinvent 8y ago
For me, I think the answer is very different depending on whether you've got a job with set hours and location (which we should all get away from) or whether you're more flexible and maybe running your own business. I've run my own businesses since leaving school and although I expect to slow down as I get older, I don't ever want to retire. I just want my role to evolve and spend more of my work time doing the (work related) things I enjoy most. I've always thought that business owners who look forward to retirement need a new business.

9 points by Arthanari 8y ago

I strongly suspect I'll never earn enough retire.

I don't plan to retire. I had a nice half year break after selling my company. It's not that great. Productive engineer = happy engineer. I'd like to be a kind of tech monk. Someone who goes around on the bare minimum needed to survive, be away from the distractions of society, and polish my skills day after day. Every now and then I'd leave my monastery to rescue a half billion dollar project somewhere or to take down an evil tech giant with open source. Then I use my loot to continue another few years of peace and solitude.

jackgolding 8y ago
I have had 2 involuntary 3 month breaks between jobs and even though I was strapped for cash I really hated how much my mood fell apart without having the structure of work. I told myself I want to move away from having so much of my life's meaning defined by what work I do (while it's software for any enterprise anyway.) I'm at the stage now where I'm hoping to take off at least a month for travel next year. Are there any learnings you had from your half a year break like this?
- muzani 8y ago
  It wasn't great. There's a lot of anxiety watching my bank account go down with no plan at all. Resting seems even more unproductive, it resulted in a lot of bad habits forming. I find I am much happier working 14 hours/day than resting 24 hours. I did have an extremely productive remote work era during that period for a side project, but unfortunately the team fell apart.
  - dennisgorelik 8y ago
    > it resulted in a lot of bad habits forming What kind of bad habits did "resting" form?
    - muzani 8y ago
      Well things like needing more rest. I ended up "resting" 3 weekdays a week. Or things like taking 3 hours to prepare for the work day, via meditation, clearing up my workspace, getting exercise, and so on. I wouldn't say it's laziness, but having too much time makes you bad at time management.

dpeck 8y ago

https://kopywritingkourse.com/fuck-you-money-calculator/ https://kopywritingkourse.com/fuck-you-money-calculator/

potta_coffee 8y ago

I'm barely making it so retirement is not likely going to happen for me.

cerberusss 8y ago
Aren't you worried about that?
- potta_coffee 8y ago
  Yes, I'm terrified.
marcc 8y ago
Why are you barely making it?
- potta_coffee 8y ago
  I'm not good at selling myself, I don't live in a tech-hub city, and I'm probably mediocre at my job. I feel good about the work I do and do have strengths but I'm not proving to be a competitive candidate for the work I want. I'm spending my free time acquiring better skills so hopefully this will change for me.
  - luxpir 8y ago
    Regarding mediocre: https://lwn.net/Articles/641779/ https://lwn.net/Articles/641779/ The take-away from the post (and vid, linked at bottom) is that most people should be mediocre. It's not a bad thing. Take pride in having reached that far. As for the selling issue; you're aware of it, so that's obviously a good thing. Next is to put together some kind of promo that you can live with. A portfolio site, some blogging about what you've learned etc. Sure you'll get decent opportunities if you keep skilling up and making folks aware of your current abilities. Regarding non-hub city: remote work an option? Biggest local companies? EDIT: Just saw you've seen the post linked to above already. And you're probably more experienced than I'd understood from your comment. I'm tempted to say you might only be bad at selling yourself because you self-deprecate too much. But that's another assumption!

cerberusss 8y ago

When I have saved and invested around 500k in euros, this will generate about 20k euros per year. My mortgage will be paid as well, so it will be enough to live on. I'll be 55 by then.

onion2k 8y ago
You've forgotten about inflation.
- fjsolwmv 8y ago
  4% real gains includes inflation
  - onion2k 8y ago
    Here in the UK inflation was 18% in 1980. It's been over 10% several times since then. 4% assumes things will carry on as they have been for the past couple of decades. There's no reason to believe that.
    - deanmoriarty 8y ago
      But if you don't hold too much cash/fixed income securities and actually hold equity investments (e.g. real estate, stocks), then why would inflation be a concern? All those investments should easily keep up with inflation by their very nature, or am I wrong?

baccredited 8y ago

5.6MM based on spending 18,668/mo = 224K/yr 25 x 224k = 5.6MM assumptions: - withdraw 4% per yr - earn avg 7%+ per yr - inflation 3% Money will last forever and I will die with bigger balance than day I retire. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-sim... ps. I will hit this number in 47 months. Here's how I know: https://lab.madfientist.com/ https://lab.madfientist.com/

IpV8 8y ago
Wow thats a ton!!! I suppose you must live in a higher cost of living area than me.
- baccredited 8y ago
  Haha - family of 4. Expensive travel hobbies. Too much house. "Fatfire" https://www.physicianonfire.com/fatfire/ https://www.physicianonfire.com/fatfire/
- fjsolwmv 8y ago
  Higher cost of living personality, not area.
dsacco 8y ago
FYI, that link requires a login. Is it supposed to be public?
- baccredited 8y ago
  Sorry - if you sign up this site will allow you to input your monthly savings, spending, and net worth. Then it will estimate the amount of time before you achieve Financial Independence. It is free. I'm a big fan. https://lab.madfientist.com/pages/help https://lab.madfientist.com/pages/help
  - shostack 8y ago

SirLJ 8y ago

Just work on your passive income generation, few hundred thousands per year would be enough for most people.... Once you have your FY money, you'll see that retirement is overrated... and I have a lot of hobbies + plans to travel with my wife when the kids are out of the house (hopefully in the next few years), but besides all that, every year I am postponing my retirement, because I just cannot leave the team I am managing... so maybe next year :-)

elliottinvent 8y ago

For me, I think the answer is very different depending on whether you've got a job with set hours and location (which we should all get away from) or whether you're more flexible and maybe running your own business. I've run my own businesses since leaving school and although I expect to slow down as I get older, I don't ever want to retire. I just want my role to evolve and spend more of my work time doing the (work related) things I enjoy most. I've always thought that business owners who look forward to retirement need a new business.