3 ms·

I have seen quite a few of the same in Chicago as well. It is always hand-wringing over there being internet forums where johns review services, and a lot of as

by Fins 9y ago

I have seen quite a few of the same in Chicago as well. It is always hand-wringing over there being internet forums where johns review services, and a lot of assumptions that anyone engaged in prostitution obviously must be trafficked, or forced, or coerced, because surely nobody could ever possibly do it willingly.

tyingq 9y ago
Sure. Not discounting there are girls that do this work willingly. Just that the Asian spas, for the most part, aren't in that category. They are a special case that does indicate traffickers exist and are prolific in the US. And they are likely not the only case. I believe there's a Russian/Ukrainian equivalent as well. Here's a pretty convincing story that Chicago (since you called it out) has this issue as well: https://medium.com/@markguarino10/a-victim-centric-approach-to-fighting-sex-trafficking-in-chicago-a547c26314a3 https://medium.com/@markguarino10/a-victim-centric-approach-... And it doesn't sound "difficult" to find or validate. You would have to believe there are women that want to live 24/7 in these strip mall dungeons on purpose, sleeping on massage tables, paying off inflated debts, to deny the trafficking angle.
- Fins 9y ago
  Having lived there, I'll take hagiographies of Tom Dart with as many grains of salt as stories of a bright and promising young politician Rod Blagojevich. After all, he had been going against anything sex-related long before he had thought up the trafficking angle. You do realize that for any foreigner/legal resident caught giving happy endings in a parlor the options are either deportation (or at beast "moral turpitude" that makes naturalization basically impossible), or claiming to be a trafficking victim? Validating how many of them actually are is far more difficult than that.
  - tyingq 9y ago
    It seems more clear to me. Who chooses to live, eat, and sleep in a small strip mall sublet, sharing a room and one bathroom with 10+ other people of their own volition? Leaving the place almost never? What they say is less telling than how they live.
    - Fins 9y ago
      I could point you at pretty much every Mexican construction worker in SV (or Chicago) who bunk 10 to a room, doing hard physical work for less money.
      - tyingq 9y ago
        Sure. Voluntary hard labor vs involuntary institutional daily rape followed by bunking where it happens until you're too old to sell. Maybe the customer doesn't know the provider didn't want this lifestyle, but it's still an unwilling participant situation. They are both unfortunate, but not the same.
        Fins 9y ago
        Of course it is, when it happens. Ity's the prevalence of it happening that is disputable, given both the dearth of verifiable prosecutions and strong incentives for any sex worker to claim trafficking victim status.

by Fins 9y ago

tyingq 9y ago

Sure. Not discounting there are girls that do this work willingly. Just that the Asian spas, for the most part, aren't in that category. They are a special case that does indicate traffickers exist and are prolific in the US. And they are likely not the only case. I believe there's a Russian/Ukrainian equivalent as well. Here's a pretty convincing story that Chicago (since you called it out) has this issue as well: https://medium.com/@markguarino10/a-victim-centric-approach-to-fighting-sex-trafficking-in-chicago-a547c26314a3 https://medium.com/@markguarino10/a-victim-centric-approach-... And it doesn't sound "difficult" to find or validate. You would have to believe there are women that want to live 24/7 in these strip mall dungeons on purpose, sleeping on massage tables, paying off inflated debts, to deny the trafficking angle.

Fins 9y ago
Having lived there, I'll take hagiographies of Tom Dart with as many grains of salt as stories of a bright and promising young politician Rod Blagojevich. After all, he had been going against anything sex-related long before he had thought up the trafficking angle. You do realize that for any foreigner/legal resident caught giving happy endings in a parlor the options are either deportation (or at beast "moral turpitude" that makes naturalization basically impossible), or claiming to be a trafficking victim? Validating how many of them actually are is far more difficult than that.
- tyingq 9y ago
  It seems more clear to me. Who chooses to live, eat, and sleep in a small strip mall sublet, sharing a room and one bathroom with 10+ other people of their own volition? Leaving the place almost never? What they say is less telling than how they live.
  - Fins 9y ago
    I could point you at pretty much every Mexican construction worker in SV (or Chicago) who bunk 10 to a room, doing hard physical work for less money.
    - tyingq 9y ago
      Sure. Voluntary hard labor vs involuntary institutional daily rape followed by bunking where it happens until you're too old to sell. Maybe the customer doesn't know the provider didn't want this lifestyle, but it's still an unwilling participant situation. They are both unfortunate, but not the same.
      - Fins 9y ago
        Of course it is, when it happens. Ity's the prevalence of it happening that is disputable, given both the dearth of verifiable prosecutions and strong incentives for any sex worker to claim trafficking victim status.