7 ms·

I agree but there's probably a limit on that sentiment. If you start a family you are likely to become more risk adverse, this would increase again as you appr

by sleet 8y ago

I agree but there's probably a limit on that sentiment. If you start a family you are likely to become more risk adverse, this would increase again as you approach retirement.

drawkbox 8y ago
On the flipside, kids can add immense motivation and drive. Also you can dictate your schedule more to spend more time with kids/family if you work from home more. I went independent/entrepreneur full on when my son was starting high school, I wish I had done it earlier and done more projects/products for myself earlier.
watwut 8y ago
Maybe the young risk too much. In that case, being more risk averse could be statistical advantage. There seems to be persistent underlying assumption that more risk taking is always better, that is unlikely to be true. Optimal risk taking amount is not necessary "highest possible".
codazoda 8y ago
True, but ~45 may be a golden age again. By then your kids may be starting to becoming self sufficient, retirement is still 20 years off, and you've lived through a fair number of financial problems. Your retirement plans might be coming together and the world is starting to look more rosey. Plus, you find yourself feeling like you're nearing the end of your "youth"; you're aged but you still feel good. Perhaps you become less worried about the risk and you're well trained and ready to take on a complex challenge. I can dream.
- deepGem 8y ago
  I more or less left full time work when I was 39 to pursue startups. The reasoning was exactly on the lines of what you have described. It's been 2 years and the journey has been fraught with failures. One, it's become really hard for me to find a co-founder. Almost none of the guys in my friend circle are willing to take the risks associated with startups. I've attended a pre-accelerator to find a co-founders but haven't had any luck in finding the right person. Two, I'm just getting lazy because of the financial cushion. I mean, it's not much but still some sort of lethargy has set in since I don't have a pressing problem to solve. Until I get to the stage where things kick off, I bet this is going to be the norm. On one hand I have a financial cushion, on the other I know that the cushion won't mean much in the next 10 years. So, I'm constantly thinking about self sufficiency down the line. So, a combination of no cofounder + no exponential idea + procrastination = My life has become quite miserable. I mean, sure on the surface I project an image of it's all good, if you know what I mean.
  - CalRobert 8y ago
    Sorry to hear it, but thank you for sharing. It's likely people with your experience are less likely to share it than those who've been successful and I worry it gives a skewed view of the likelihood that a startup will make you happier. One question - have you only looked at "exponential ideas"? Maybe there's a small but reasonably profitable endeavour out there - a lifestyle business?
    - deepGem 8y ago
      "Maybe there's a small but reasonably profitable endeavour out there" I am actually thinking about just this. Let's see.
  - shaqbert 8y ago
    Sounds like you need a young gun co-founder to complement your expertise with the energy and enthusiasm of youth.
  - tixocloud 8y ago
    I'm curious to know what are the things you've been thinking about working on? I've experienced the challenge of finding a co-founder in my immediate circle but looking beyond that, there are plenty of potentials. I know a startup called Wagepoint that started with a co-founders from vastly different age groups.
    - Horrabin 8y ago
      Hmm, Wagepoint. I was involved in vetting the younger of the two to the older. They both had similar interests and the experience of the older complemented the energy and enthusiasm of the younger.
    - deepGem 8y ago
      I started working on recording meetings and converting the recordings to meeting minutes with actionable items. Not a trivial task. My idea was to build an iPhone app with ML in the cloud. I did some initial market survey and found no takers for this idea. I spoke to startups, mid-enterprises and even law firms. I got one positive response from a VC who said this could be useful in tracking the meetings he has with founders as most of them go untracked but I was not too convinced (perhaps I was wrong). So dropped that idea and tried on some ideas around computer vision, prompted by the problems some of the customers were elucidating to while validating the above idea. "We don't really care about meetings but can you use machine learning to monitor people ? I am not a big fan of surveillance. After this I have drifted quite a bit around the last year or so. Current situation - no direction. Just having a side thought on doing something around high definition maps. Looked for a job to fill up some savings, but boy the interviewing phenomenon is nuts. I haven't interviewed in like 15 years. So got back to doing leetcode and Hackerrank.
- jcadam 8y ago
  I'm 37 and absolutely cannot imagine myself working for the man for another 30+ years. I can't seem to last more than 2-3 years at any one job before becoming bored out of my skull. My present position, which I've been at for ~6 months, already has me mired deep in ennui (It was utterly unchallenging from day 1 - but the pay is great). I want nothing more than to quit and strike out on my own, but financial obligations (kids, mortgage, etc.) are holding me back. My wife doesn't understand why I make a comfortable six-figure salary but am so discontented with my career. Maybe I feel like I'm running out of time?
  - chasedehan 8y ago
    +1 I could have written this exact same thing.
jknoepfler 8y ago
I can certainly concede that achieving "ramen profitability" while living off savings is substantially less exciting while trying to pay down a mortgage and save up for one's childrens' college tuition.
- sanderjd 8y ago
  > while trying to pay down a mortgage I don't really get this. I just recently bought a house. Paying down my mortgage is just a bit more expensive than renting my apartment was. Leases are a year long, I think I could sell my house within that period of time, and we wouldn't need to ask our landlord's permission. Why is a mortgage strictly worse for living off of savings?
  - jstandard 8y ago
    > Paying down my mortgage is just a bit more expensive than renting my apartment was. Unless you already have a substantial nest egg or took out an expensive mortgage, your life savings were substantially reduced by the down payment. In addition to a more expensive monthly payment there are property taxes, maintenance costs ($ and time), HOA fees, and other burdens depending on your region and property type.
  - tytytytytytytyt 8y ago
    What do you do if the neighborhood or market changes and you really can't sell your house after a year? > Paying down my mortgage is just a bit more expensive than renting my apartment was. That might depend on where you are and other factors. > Why is a mortgage strictly worse for living off of savings? Maybe it's not and people are just hedging their bets?
  - Swizec 8y ago
    > Why is a mortgage strictly worse for living off of savings? It’s not strictly worse but I assume it feels like a bigger commitment with more disastrous consequences should anything go wrong? Foreclose on your house, your biggest asset is gone. That thing you worked for for so long. Get kicked out of rented place. Eh, wasn’t yours anyway. Find smaller one or in a worse location, which you can afford. Either way in my case buying is strictly worse because I can’t afford the down payment so there’s really just one option. Well, one comfortable option. I could always go homeless I guess. Would save me a lot per month ...
ojbyrne 8y ago
Not everybody starts a family. In fact, in terms of the “traditional family,” it’s not even a majority anymore. http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2015/12/17/1-the-american-family-today/ http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2015/12/17/1-the-american-fam...

by sleet 8y ago

I agree but there's probably a limit on that sentiment. If you start a family you are likely to become more risk adverse, this would increase again as you approach retirement.

drawkbox 8y ago

On the flipside, kids can add immense motivation and drive. Also you can dictate your schedule more to spend more time with kids/family if you work from home more. I went independent/entrepreneur full on when my son was starting high school, I wish I had done it earlier and done more projects/products for myself earlier.

watwut 8y ago

Maybe the young risk too much. In that case, being more risk averse could be statistical advantage. There seems to be persistent underlying assumption that more risk taking is always better, that is unlikely to be true. Optimal risk taking amount is not necessary "highest possible".

codazoda 8y ago

True, but ~45 may be a golden age again. By then your kids may be starting to becoming self sufficient, retirement is still 20 years off, and you've lived through a fair number of financial problems. Your retirement plans might be coming together and the world is starting to look more rosey. Plus, you find yourself feeling like you're nearing the end of your "youth"; you're aged but you still feel good. Perhaps you become less worried about the risk and you're well trained and ready to take on a complex challenge. I can dream.

deepGem 8y ago
I more or less left full time work when I was 39 to pursue startups. The reasoning was exactly on the lines of what you have described. It's been 2 years and the journey has been fraught with failures. One, it's become really hard for me to find a co-founder. Almost none of the guys in my friend circle are willing to take the risks associated with startups. I've attended a pre-accelerator to find a co-founders but haven't had any luck in finding the right person. Two, I'm just getting lazy because of the financial cushion. I mean, it's not much but still some sort of lethargy has set in since I don't have a pressing problem to solve. Until I get to the stage where things kick off, I bet this is going to be the norm. On one hand I have a financial cushion, on the other I know that the cushion won't mean much in the next 10 years. So, I'm constantly thinking about self sufficiency down the line. So, a combination of no cofounder + no exponential idea + procrastination = My life has become quite miserable. I mean, sure on the surface I project an image of it's all good, if you know what I mean.
- CalRobert 8y ago
  Sorry to hear it, but thank you for sharing. It's likely people with your experience are less likely to share it than those who've been successful and I worry it gives a skewed view of the likelihood that a startup will make you happier. One question - have you only looked at "exponential ideas"? Maybe there's a small but reasonably profitable endeavour out there - a lifestyle business?
  - deepGem 8y ago
    "Maybe there's a small but reasonably profitable endeavour out there" I am actually thinking about just this. Let's see.
- shaqbert 8y ago
  Sounds like you need a young gun co-founder to complement your expertise with the energy and enthusiasm of youth.
- tixocloud 8y ago
  I'm curious to know what are the things you've been thinking about working on? I've experienced the challenge of finding a co-founder in my immediate circle but looking beyond that, there are plenty of potentials. I know a startup called Wagepoint that started with a co-founders from vastly different age groups.
  - Horrabin 8y ago
    Hmm, Wagepoint. I was involved in vetting the younger of the two to the older. They both had similar interests and the experience of the older complemented the energy and enthusiasm of the younger.
  - deepGem 8y ago
    I started working on recording meetings and converting the recordings to meeting minutes with actionable items. Not a trivial task. My idea was to build an iPhone app with ML in the cloud. I did some initial market survey and found no takers for this idea. I spoke to startups, mid-enterprises and even law firms. I got one positive response from a VC who said this could be useful in tracking the meetings he has with founders as most of them go untracked but I was not too convinced (perhaps I was wrong). So dropped that idea and tried on some ideas around computer vision, prompted by the problems some of the customers were elucidating to while validating the above idea. "We don't really care about meetings but can you use machine learning to monitor people ? I am not a big fan of surveillance. After this I have drifted quite a bit around the last year or so. Current situation - no direction. Just having a side thought on doing something around high definition maps. Looked for a job to fill up some savings, but boy the interviewing phenomenon is nuts. I haven't interviewed in like 15 years. So got back to doing leetcode and Hackerrank.
jcadam 8y ago
I'm 37 and absolutely cannot imagine myself working for the man for another 30+ years. I can't seem to last more than 2-3 years at any one job before becoming bored out of my skull. My present position, which I've been at for ~6 months, already has me mired deep in ennui (It was utterly unchallenging from day 1 - but the pay is great). I want nothing more than to quit and strike out on my own, but financial obligations (kids, mortgage, etc.) are holding me back. My wife doesn't understand why I make a comfortable six-figure salary but am so discontented with my career. Maybe I feel like I'm running out of time?
- chasedehan 8y ago
  +1 I could have written this exact same thing.

jknoepfler 8y ago

I can certainly concede that achieving "ramen profitability" while living off savings is substantially less exciting while trying to pay down a mortgage and save up for one's childrens' college tuition.

sanderjd 8y ago
> while trying to pay down a mortgage I don't really get this. I just recently bought a house. Paying down my mortgage is just a bit more expensive than renting my apartment was. Leases are a year long, I think I could sell my house within that period of time, and we wouldn't need to ask our landlord's permission. Why is a mortgage strictly worse for living off of savings?
- jstandard 8y ago
  > Paying down my mortgage is just a bit more expensive than renting my apartment was. Unless you already have a substantial nest egg or took out an expensive mortgage, your life savings were substantially reduced by the down payment. In addition to a more expensive monthly payment there are property taxes, maintenance costs ($ and time), HOA fees, and other burdens depending on your region and property type.
- tytytytytytytyt 8y ago
  What do you do if the neighborhood or market changes and you really can't sell your house after a year? > Paying down my mortgage is just a bit more expensive than renting my apartment was. That might depend on where you are and other factors. > Why is a mortgage strictly worse for living off of savings? Maybe it's not and people are just hedging their bets?
- Swizec 8y ago
  > Why is a mortgage strictly worse for living off of savings? It’s not strictly worse but I assume it feels like a bigger commitment with more disastrous consequences should anything go wrong? Foreclose on your house, your biggest asset is gone. That thing you worked for for so long. Get kicked out of rented place. Eh, wasn’t yours anyway. Find smaller one or in a worse location, which you can afford. Either way in my case buying is strictly worse because I can’t afford the down payment so there’s really just one option. Well, one comfortable option. I could always go homeless I guess. Would save me a lot per month ...

ojbyrne 8y ago

Not everybody starts a family. In fact, in terms of the “traditional family,” it’s not even a majority anymore. http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2015/12/17/1-the-american-family-today/ http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2015/12/17/1-the-american-fam...