4 ms·

This mighty Porsche 919 just broke the F1 lap record at Spa

33 points by justin66 9y ago

theluketaylor 9y ago
Tons of equipment not legal for F1, but there is no denying the 919 is an absurdly fast car. Porsche is getting very good at using electric motors to make fast cars into insanely fast cars. 918 is a terrifyingly fast car, 919 is one of the all-time great endurance cars, and adding a hybrid to the panamera has only made it quicker. Mission E could be a real monster with the lessons porsche learns in Formula E. One of the biggest ways you can tell tesla isn't a car guy car company is they don't have a Model S race series to beat their cars into the ground. Racing will find your poorly designed parts awfully quick. Fast 0-60 launches a couple times is impressive, but consistent hot laps on a track is much, much harder. Model S can do a couple hot laps before giving up. I fully expect the Mission E to have a lot less quit in it.
- justin66 9y ago
  > Tons of equipment not legal for F1 Of course, it has also got some equipment that isn't spec even for a WEC car. This is great because it's dangerous and expensive but 100% done for fun, and it also hints at what closed-wheel racing might look like if they really took the gloves off. There was another hint last year when Toyota set some records at Le Mans (fastest around the track since they added the chicanes and within a second or two of the absolute record set by a Porsche 917 in 1971). It won't happen but unlimited closed-wheel racing akin to the old Can-Am would really be something to see with today's technology.
  - gregpilling 9y ago
    I had this link open on my tabs as a coincidence. https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2016/02/05/fifty-years-later-theres-still-no-racing-like-the-original-can-am-series/ https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2016/02/05/fifty-years-later-t... There still is no racing like it. Crazy stuff.
    - wycx 9y ago
      including: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaparral_Cars#2J https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaparral_Cars#2J
- greglindahl 9y ago
  So you're saying that drag racing isn't racing? Also, that it's important for street cars to have the extra cooling needed to run on the track? OK. Er, so, what exactly is Model S missing for the average driver?
  - Latty 9y ago
    The post you are replying to was talking about a different model of the Model S to sell to enthusiasts who wanted more, not "for the average driver".
    - greglindahl 9y ago
      Yes, I got that. Tesla already sells a top model to drag racing enthusiasts who want more drag racing oompf. The point I was attempting to make was about the meaning of "racing". I see that I didn't get my point across.
      - theluketaylor 9y ago
        Drag racing is a different set of stress than wheel to wheel circuit racing, but even by the standards of drag racing Model S is fairly weak. It can handle a few launches before it needs to cool down and recharge.
- jhobag 9y ago
  arent the main issues with tracking ev's/teslas battery heat and brakes?
  - greglindahl 9y ago
    Tesla Model S/X don't have any cooling for the electric motor, because it's not needed for street driving. That's a significant issue for track driving, but not for drag racing.
  - davidgould 9y ago
    Brakes are an issue for almost any street car. Being heavy and fast makes it worse, but even something light and slow like a Miata will have brake issues on a track (not easy or cheap to solve either!) The model S shares its cooling with the inverter the motor and the axle. I'm not sure if that is the limitation or the battery. The model 3 is different and there is video of one lapping ten or so laps at Laguna Seca without heat issues. There is no inherent reason an electric car cannot be cooled enough to be a track car, the designer just has to make it a priority over say aerodynamic drag (and hence freeway range).
- Gravityloss 9y ago
  Tesla doesn't need PR or marketing though, they are production limited as far as I know?
  - KillerRabbitt 9y ago
    If Tesla is production limited, shouldn't they just raise their prices? Or am I missing something.
  - theluketaylor 9y ago
    Racing isn't just for PR. It's extreme abuse on every component. Automakers put their cars through intense testing before they hit showrooms. Racing just does it faster. And then when you crash (and you will crash) you find out how easy or hard it is to repair.
MR4D 9y ago
This is insanely fast...like one of those videos that are sped up to make the car look fast. If you’ve ever seen F1 in person, especially around the curves, then this video becomes mind boggling in how freaking fast this beast is. Porsche engineering in incredible. And yes, I know it’s not race legal, but holy cow, did you watch the video?!?!?
justin66 9y ago
Good article: https://arstechnica.com/cars/2018/04/faster-than-an-f1-car-porsche-is-breaking-records-with-the-919-hybrid/ https://arstechnica.com/cars/2018/04/faster-than-an-f1-car-p... To make this new feat even more impressive, Porsche set that time in weather barely warm enough for the tires to switch on—the ambient temperature was just 12 degrees Celsius (53.6 degrees Fahrenheit) compared to 17 degrees Celsius (62.6 degrees Fahrenheit) for the F1 event that took place in August.
JakDrako 9y ago
This year's F1 cars are faster than they were last year, when the lap record by Lewis Hamilton (in qualifying) was 1:42.553. Spa is a long circuit, it's not impossible that the F1s take back the record at the end of August. In the two races so far, the qualifying lap times were about 1s and .8s faster than last year. A similar improvement for Spa would break the 1.41.770 time of the 919. Either way, that Porsche is a fantastic monster of a car. I'd really love to see Porsche enter and compete in F1.
- justin66 9y ago
  I wouldn't want to see them sponsor a team. They probably don't have the money to commit to that and win. On the other hand, it'd be fairly exciting to see them supply a drivetrain to one or two of the mid-level teams. (even developing that would be stupidly expensive, however)

33 points by justin66 9y ago

Tons of equipment not legal for F1, but there is no denying the 919 is an absurdly fast car. Porsche is getting very good at using electric motors to make fast cars into insanely fast cars. 918 is a terrifyingly fast car, 919 is one of the all-time great endurance cars, and adding a hybrid to the panamera has only made it quicker. Mission E could be a real monster with the lessons porsche learns in Formula E. One of the biggest ways you can tell tesla isn't a car guy car company is they don't have a Model S race series to beat their cars into the ground. Racing will find your poorly designed parts awfully quick. Fast 0-60 launches a couple times is impressive, but consistent hot laps on a track is much, much harder. Model S can do a couple hot laps before giving up. I fully expect the Mission E to have a lot less quit in it.

justin66 9y ago
> Tons of equipment not legal for F1 Of course, it has also got some equipment that isn't spec even for a WEC car. This is great because it's dangerous and expensive but 100% done for fun, and it also hints at what closed-wheel racing might look like if they really took the gloves off. There was another hint last year when Toyota set some records at Le Mans (fastest around the track since they added the chicanes and within a second or two of the absolute record set by a Porsche 917 in 1971). It won't happen but unlimited closed-wheel racing akin to the old Can-Am would really be something to see with today's technology.
- gregpilling 9y ago
  I had this link open on my tabs as a coincidence. https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2016/02/05/fifty-years-later-theres-still-no-racing-like-the-original-can-am-series/ https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2016/02/05/fifty-years-later-t... There still is no racing like it. Crazy stuff.
  - wycx 9y ago
    including: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaparral_Cars#2J https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaparral_Cars#2J
greglindahl 9y ago
So you're saying that drag racing isn't racing? Also, that it's important for street cars to have the extra cooling needed to run on the track? OK. Er, so, what exactly is Model S missing for the average driver?
- Latty 9y ago
  The post you are replying to was talking about a different model of the Model S to sell to enthusiasts who wanted more, not "for the average driver".
  - greglindahl 9y ago
    Yes, I got that. Tesla already sells a top model to drag racing enthusiasts who want more drag racing oompf. The point I was attempting to make was about the meaning of "racing". I see that I didn't get my point across.
    - theluketaylor 9y ago
      Drag racing is a different set of stress than wheel to wheel circuit racing, but even by the standards of drag racing Model S is fairly weak. It can handle a few launches before it needs to cool down and recharge.
jhobag 9y ago
arent the main issues with tracking ev's/teslas battery heat and brakes?
- greglindahl 9y ago
  Tesla Model S/X don't have any cooling for the electric motor, because it's not needed for street driving. That's a significant issue for track driving, but not for drag racing.
- davidgould 9y ago
  Brakes are an issue for almost any street car. Being heavy and fast makes it worse, but even something light and slow like a Miata will have brake issues on a track (not easy or cheap to solve either!) The model S shares its cooling with the inverter the motor and the axle. I'm not sure if that is the limitation or the battery. The model 3 is different and there is video of one lapping ten or so laps at Laguna Seca without heat issues. There is no inherent reason an electric car cannot be cooled enough to be a track car, the designer just has to make it a priority over say aerodynamic drag (and hence freeway range).
Gravityloss 9y ago
Tesla doesn't need PR or marketing though, they are production limited as far as I know?
- KillerRabbitt 9y ago
  If Tesla is production limited, shouldn't they just raise their prices? Or am I missing something.
- theluketaylor 9y ago
  Racing isn't just for PR. It's extreme abuse on every component. Automakers put their cars through intense testing before they hit showrooms. Racing just does it faster. And then when you crash (and you will crash) you find out how easy or hard it is to repair.

MR4D 9y ago

This is insanely fast...like one of those videos that are sped up to make the car look fast. If you’ve ever seen F1 in person, especially around the curves, then this video becomes mind boggling in how freaking fast this beast is. Porsche engineering in incredible. And yes, I know it’s not race legal, but holy cow, did you watch the video?!?!?

justin66 9y ago

Good article: https://arstechnica.com/cars/2018/04/faster-than-an-f1-car-porsche-is-breaking-records-with-the-919-hybrid/ https://arstechnica.com/cars/2018/04/faster-than-an-f1-car-p... To make this new feat even more impressive, Porsche set that time in weather barely warm enough for the tires to switch on—the ambient temperature was just 12 degrees Celsius (53.6 degrees Fahrenheit) compared to 17 degrees Celsius (62.6 degrees Fahrenheit) for the F1 event that took place in August.

JakDrako 9y ago

This year's F1 cars are faster than they were last year, when the lap record by Lewis Hamilton (in qualifying) was 1:42.553. Spa is a long circuit, it's not impossible that the F1s take back the record at the end of August. In the two races so far, the qualifying lap times were about 1s and .8s faster than last year. A similar improvement for Spa would break the 1.41.770 time of the 919. Either way, that Porsche is a fantastic monster of a car. I'd really love to see Porsche enter and compete in F1.

justin66 9y ago
I wouldn't want to see them sponsor a team. They probably don't have the money to commit to that and win. On the other hand, it'd be fairly exciting to see them supply a drivetrain to one or two of the mid-level teams. (even developing that would be stupidly expensive, however)