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I just had a vision of all major OS projects providing developer containers for their projects. Like, you could just pull the latest Firefox dev container and r

I just had a vision of all major OS projects providing developer containers for their projects. Like, you could just pull the latest Firefox dev container and run a single command to have a running debuggable app. I know one of the major pains we have when on-boarding new people is the whole dance to get to that first working build / first meaningful change. I can imagine this being significantly more simple if a working dev environment was shipped as a container.

moosingin3space 9y ago
Gnome is moving in this direction by using Flatpak + Gnome Builder. They're also running CI inside the Flatpak environment.
jacksmith21006 9y ago
Exactly what Google has done with ChromeOS 67. You can run GNU/Linux applications as containers. But extra safe as a container on a separate kernel through a VM using KVM. Versus they did Android as a container on the same Linux kernel as ChromeOS. But locked to only an Android container.
- reggieband 9y ago
  You mention "run GNU/Linux applications as containers" but is that a full dev environment? As in, I can open a cpp file or whatever, make a change, run a single command and I can see my changes?
  - jacksmith21006 9y ago
    Yes a full dev environment as of ChromeOS 67. How you want to use is your choice. But it looks like Google will package GNU/Linux applications as containers that you can just run. You can use what they have enabled in other ways as I am already doing on a PB with ChromeOS 67.
- 77ko 9y ago
  > You can run GNU/Linux applications as containers. Do you need to run gnu/linux apps inside containers or can they just run inside the VM running on top of chromeos?
bryanlarsen 9y ago
Many OS projects do this with Vagrant.
AnIdiotOnTheNet 9y ago
You know, there once was a time when we did everything in folders and didn't need the overhead of containerization just to keep well behaved things from stepping all over each other and breaking everything. Like all progress in computing we've reinvented the wheel, but now with a few additional layers of abstraction and the consequential performance degradation.
- Phrodo_00 9y ago
  > keep well behaved things from stepping all over each other and breaking everything Containers help with keeping bad behaviors from stepping all over each other.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 9y ago
    Yes, that's their value. You shouldn't need to use them for your development environment or normal every day software. Unless of course you're saying that most software in the GNU/Linux world is badly behaved, which I'd kind of agree with.
  - sigjuice 9y ago
    Containers also decrease the likelihood of bad behaviors getting fixed.
- fauigerzigerk 9y ago
  >there once was a time when we did everything in folders Not on Unix though. "Stepping all over each other" sounds like the guiding design principle behind Unix's folder structure and dynamic library loading aproach. Docker's isolation is far more than just isolation of files and folders. It's more like J2EE for Linux :)
- saagarjha 9y ago
  > You know, there once was a time when we did everything in folders and didn't need the overhead of containerization just to keep well behaved things from stepping all over each other and breaking everything. Those were the days…when we didn't have stupid watchdogs like memory protection and preemptive scheduling, and we all shared resources nicely and fairly, all the time. There were never crashes because someone touched memory that they weren't supposed to, or hangs because someone decided they were more important than all the other processes. No siree.
slim 9y ago
You mean you want a statically linked binary?
josephfrazier 9y ago
> Like, you could just pull the latest Firefox dev container and run a single command to have a running debuggable app. https://janitor.technology/ https://janitor.technology/ is attempting to provide a web-based version of this. Haven't yet used it myself, but it sounds promising.
- exikyut 9y ago
  I somehow highly doubt they're building all of Firefox in that demo video... heheh

moosingin3space 9y ago

Gnome is moving in this direction by using Flatpak + Gnome Builder. They're also running CI inside the Flatpak environment.

jacksmith21006 9y ago

Exactly what Google has done with ChromeOS 67. You can run GNU/Linux applications as containers. But extra safe as a container on a separate kernel through a VM using KVM. Versus they did Android as a container on the same Linux kernel as ChromeOS. But locked to only an Android container.

reggieband 9y ago
You mention "run GNU/Linux applications as containers" but is that a full dev environment? As in, I can open a cpp file or whatever, make a change, run a single command and I can see my changes?
- jacksmith21006 9y ago
  Yes a full dev environment as of ChromeOS 67. How you want to use is your choice. But it looks like Google will package GNU/Linux applications as containers that you can just run. You can use what they have enabled in other ways as I am already doing on a PB with ChromeOS 67.
77ko 9y ago
> You can run GNU/Linux applications as containers. Do you need to run gnu/linux apps inside containers or can they just run inside the VM running on top of chromeos?

bryanlarsen 9y ago

Many OS projects do this with Vagrant.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 9y ago

You know, there once was a time when we did everything in folders and didn't need the overhead of containerization just to keep well behaved things from stepping all over each other and breaking everything. Like all progress in computing we've reinvented the wheel, but now with a few additional layers of abstraction and the consequential performance degradation.

Phrodo_00 9y ago
> keep well behaved things from stepping all over each other and breaking everything Containers help with keeping bad behaviors from stepping all over each other.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 9y ago
  Yes, that's their value. You shouldn't need to use them for your development environment or normal every day software. Unless of course you're saying that most software in the GNU/Linux world is badly behaved, which I'd kind of agree with.
- sigjuice 9y ago
  Containers also decrease the likelihood of bad behaviors getting fixed.
fauigerzigerk 9y ago
>there once was a time when we did everything in folders Not on Unix though. "Stepping all over each other" sounds like the guiding design principle behind Unix's folder structure and dynamic library loading aproach. Docker's isolation is far more than just isolation of files and folders. It's more like J2EE for Linux :)
saagarjha 9y ago
> You know, there once was a time when we did everything in folders and didn't need the overhead of containerization just to keep well behaved things from stepping all over each other and breaking everything. Those were the days…when we didn't have stupid watchdogs like memory protection and preemptive scheduling, and we all shared resources nicely and fairly, all the time. There were never crashes because someone touched memory that they weren't supposed to, or hangs because someone decided they were more important than all the other processes. No siree.

slim 9y ago

You mean you want a statically linked binary?

josephfrazier 9y ago

> Like, you could just pull the latest Firefox dev container and run a single command to have a running debuggable app. https://janitor.technology/ https://janitor.technology/ is attempting to provide a web-based version of this. Haven't yet used it myself, but it sounds promising.

exikyut 9y ago
I somehow highly doubt they're building all of Firefox in that demo video... heheh