4 ms·

>Average turn-over for the newcomers: 3 months, the legal time to leave your job in France. Can someone explain the meaning of this? I think something got lost

>Average turn-over for the newcomers: 3 months, the legal time to leave your job in France. Can someone explain the meaning of this? I think something got lost in translation.

sodapopcan 9y ago
I took it as you aren’t allowed to quit until you’ve been somewhere for three months.
- 66o 9y ago
  Actually it depends. When you're on probation period in France you can quit as well as be fired on the spot or within 2 weeks depending how long you've been hired for (don't remember the exact timeframe). Then after your probation period is over (it can last from 4 to 7 months) there is 3 month notice period on both (employer and employee) sides.
neuromantik8086 9y ago
You have to work for 3 months before you can quit an employer in France. It's not "at-will". At least that's how I interpreted it, and given France's stronger labor laws I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case.
- baud147258 9y ago
  No, it's the length necessary before the process is finished. You give your resignation and the contract is terminated 3 months later.
- hadrien01 9y ago
  That's exactly how it's done, except in Alsace-Moselle (the German part of France during a few wars) where it's two weeks when the employee wants to leave and two to four months (depending on job-specific labour laws – convention collective – and seniority) when the employee is fired.
mpweiher 9y ago
That would be the notice period. Germany is similar, it tends to be 6 weeks to the end of the quarter, and it generally applies to both employee and employer. Though it often isn't quite as applicable to the employee...what are they going to do if you don't show up, fire you?
- baud147258 9y ago
  > what are they going to do if you don't show up, fire you? They would fire you for grave offense (I'm not sure what the right word in English would be). But even firing or giving one's notice is long here, around three months.
  - Robin_Message 9y ago
    Gross misconduct or insubordination is the wording usually used in UK contracts (IANAL, YMMV, etc)
- toomanybeersies 9y ago
  At least in New Zealand, if you abandon your job, the employer can bill you for any costs incurred, e.g. if they had to get a worker from a temp agency, you'd have to pay for the worker, or at least pay for the extra costs of a temp worker.
  - Mandatum 9y ago
    That's incorrect unless you're a company contracting to an organisation, in which case you signed a contract saying you're going to stay and do X for period of time, and if they have to stop and scramble because you left without the contracting being breached - you're liable. Which is fair and universal. Employees on the other hand have NEVER been docked pay in New Zealand and you are in NO way legally obligated to turn up for work. The only case you'd experience penalties is if you're a doctor, nurse, teacher and the like where you're likely to receive license/registration repercussions from a governmental board.
    - 9y ago
peterkelly 9y ago
Couldn't someone just turn up at 9:01am?
wazoox 9y ago
When you're a "cadre" (most engineers are), you can leave or be fired on the spot for 3 months (now 4), renewable once (so then at most 6 months, now 8 months) without any notice, no need for a good reason, it's just over, bye bye, here's your cardboard box and get out, US style. So in this case, what could happen? either you're a competent engineer, got just hired and sent to this circle of hell, you'd probably leave the next day, no regrets; or you're radically incompetent and you just stick to this job and salary, until 2 months and 29 days later the manager just fires you because you're no good (and he can). Rinse, repeat.
- baud147258 9y ago
  This period is only after the start of the job. (it did not seem clear from your comment) Also I did not know the maximum duration of trial period has changed, thank for the info.

>Average turn-over for the newcomers: 3 months, the legal time to leave your job in France. Can someone explain the meaning of this? I think something got lost in translation.

sodapopcan 9y ago

I took it as you aren’t allowed to quit until you’ve been somewhere for three months.

66o 9y ago
Actually it depends. When you're on probation period in France you can quit as well as be fired on the spot or within 2 weeks depending how long you've been hired for (don't remember the exact timeframe). Then after your probation period is over (it can last from 4 to 7 months) there is 3 month notice period on both (employer and employee) sides.

neuromantik8086 9y ago

You have to work for 3 months before you can quit an employer in France. It's not "at-will". At least that's how I interpreted it, and given France's stronger labor laws I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case.

baud147258 9y ago
No, it's the length necessary before the process is finished. You give your resignation and the contract is terminated 3 months later.
hadrien01 9y ago
That's exactly how it's done, except in Alsace-Moselle (the German part of France during a few wars) where it's two weeks when the employee wants to leave and two to four months (depending on job-specific labour laws – convention collective – and seniority) when the employee is fired.

mpweiher 9y ago

That would be the notice period. Germany is similar, it tends to be 6 weeks to the end of the quarter, and it generally applies to both employee and employer. Though it often isn't quite as applicable to the employee...what are they going to do if you don't show up, fire you?

baud147258 9y ago
> what are they going to do if you don't show up, fire you? They would fire you for grave offense (I'm not sure what the right word in English would be). But even firing or giving one's notice is long here, around three months.
- Robin_Message 9y ago
  Gross misconduct or insubordination is the wording usually used in UK contracts (IANAL, YMMV, etc)
toomanybeersies 9y ago
At least in New Zealand, if you abandon your job, the employer can bill you for any costs incurred, e.g. if they had to get a worker from a temp agency, you'd have to pay for the worker, or at least pay for the extra costs of a temp worker.
- Mandatum 9y ago
  That's incorrect unless you're a company contracting to an organisation, in which case you signed a contract saying you're going to stay and do X for period of time, and if they have to stop and scramble because you left without the contracting being breached - you're liable. Which is fair and universal. Employees on the other hand have NEVER been docked pay in New Zealand and you are in NO way legally obligated to turn up for work. The only case you'd experience penalties is if you're a doctor, nurse, teacher and the like where you're likely to receive license/registration repercussions from a governmental board.
  - 9y ago

peterkelly 9y ago

Couldn't someone just turn up at 9:01am?

wazoox 9y ago

When you're a "cadre" (most engineers are), you can leave or be fired on the spot for 3 months (now 4), renewable once (so then at most 6 months, now 8 months) without any notice, no need for a good reason, it's just over, bye bye, here's your cardboard box and get out, US style. So in this case, what could happen? either you're a competent engineer, got just hired and sent to this circle of hell, you'd probably leave the next day, no regrets; or you're radically incompetent and you just stick to this job and salary, until 2 months and 29 days later the manager just fires you because you're no good (and he can). Rinse, repeat.

baud147258 9y ago
This period is only after the start of the job. (it did not seem clear from your comment) Also I did not know the maximum duration of trial period has changed, thank for the info.