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While I don’t disagree, I wonder how much harm we should allow our own citizens to endure in terms of the abuse of their data while we wait for someone else’s e

by p49k 9y ago

While I don’t disagree, I wonder how much harm we should allow our own citizens to endure in terms of the abuse of their data while we wait for someone else’s experiment to conclude.

briandear 9y ago
Could you point me to some examples of actual harm that people have endured for abuses of their data? Preferably not just single-instance anecdotes, but actual data on the harm that is occurring? Theoretically “protecting” people is good, but protecting them from what specifically? Health records are already covered by HIPAA, so other than health, what needs more protections? For example, collecting MixPanel or Google Analytics data from a blog — what’s the actual risk of that data? Very interested in real examples and not just hypothetical fears.. What problem is the EU law solving? Have people on Europe been suffering harms until now?
- jimnotgym 9y ago
  > Google Analytics data from a blog This is not covered by GDPR, it is a fair use and anonymous. HIPAA is not a widespread standard outside of the US People have lost out due to credit card details having been stolen. PCI compliance is a contract between merchant and bank, and not statute law, and therefore we have seen colossal breaches (like Talk Talk ISP) that are hard to punish. The cost of these breaches currently falls on other merchants who have to lose out to fraudulent car use. Next big co that looses thousands of cards, I really hope they get the top fines, as it is other companies that have to pick up the bill for their actions.
_red 9y ago
>I wonder how much harm we should allow our own citizens to endure in terms of the abuse Those same citizens that voluntarily agreed to the EULA? Do you also support the 'War On Drugs' on the same premise?
- icebraining 9y ago
  If the GDPR was a War on Drugs, it would be one in which neither the users or the small time dealers/employees have anything to fear, only the gang leaders/shareholders. I'd support that War on Drugs.
- jimnotgym 9y ago
  You can't opt out of the law in a EULA (under UK and AFAIK European law) Much of what is in GDPR was already illegal under the 1995 regulation, just hard to enforce on US companies
- stordoff 9y ago
  Seems like somewhat of a false equivalence to me. People (largely) know the risks of drugs, and are knowingly taking the drugs. Data is often gathered unknowingly, or used for unknown purposes, and people don't know the risks/potential uses of that data. It also doesn't remove the ability to agree to the use of data (it just must be actual consent to the purposes of use), so it's more akin to a War on Drugs that targets the supply of impure substances, but allows the supply where the user knows exactly what they are getting.

by p49k 9y ago

While I don’t disagree, I wonder how much harm we should allow our own citizens to endure in terms of the abuse of their data while we wait for someone else’s experiment to conclude.

briandear 9y ago

Could you point me to some examples of actual harm that people have endured for abuses of their data? Preferably not just single-instance anecdotes, but actual data on the harm that is occurring? Theoretically “protecting” people is good, but protecting them from what specifically? Health records are already covered by HIPAA, so other than health, what needs more protections? For example, collecting MixPanel or Google Analytics data from a blog — what’s the actual risk of that data? Very interested in real examples and not just hypothetical fears.. What problem is the EU law solving? Have people on Europe been suffering harms until now?

jimnotgym 9y ago
> Google Analytics data from a blog This is not covered by GDPR, it is a fair use and anonymous. HIPAA is not a widespread standard outside of the US People have lost out due to credit card details having been stolen. PCI compliance is a contract between merchant and bank, and not statute law, and therefore we have seen colossal breaches (like Talk Talk ISP) that are hard to punish. The cost of these breaches currently falls on other merchants who have to lose out to fraudulent car use. Next big co that looses thousands of cards, I really hope they get the top fines, as it is other companies that have to pick up the bill for their actions.

_red 9y ago

>I wonder how much harm we should allow our own citizens to endure in terms of the abuse Those same citizens that voluntarily agreed to the EULA? Do you also support the 'War On Drugs' on the same premise?

icebraining 9y ago
If the GDPR was a War on Drugs, it would be one in which neither the users or the small time dealers/employees have anything to fear, only the gang leaders/shareholders. I'd support that War on Drugs.
jimnotgym 9y ago
You can't opt out of the law in a EULA (under UK and AFAIK European law) Much of what is in GDPR was already illegal under the 1995 regulation, just hard to enforce on US companies
stordoff 9y ago
Seems like somewhat of a false equivalence to me. People (largely) know the risks of drugs, and are knowingly taking the drugs. Data is often gathered unknowingly, or used for unknown purposes, and people don't know the risks/potential uses of that data. It also doesn't remove the ability to agree to the use of data (it just must be actual consent to the purposes of use), so it's more akin to a War on Drugs that targets the supply of impure substances, but allows the supply where the user knows exactly what they are getting.