9 ms·

Wizard for Mac – new kind of statistics program

125 points by deathtrader666 9y ago

salmonz 9y ago
The app should use mutually exclusive colors for the visualizations to communicate the right and intended information.
incongruity 9y ago
Generally speaking, IMHO, making the interface easier, in practice, doesn’t actually make using statistical methods correctly easier and that’s scary. SPSS is a classic example - and the social sciences have had a series of discredited papers over recent years due to poor application of statistical methods. Just because you can put a dataset in and get values out - even values that look significant, it doesn’t mean they are - did all of the assumptions and requirements of the methods/tests you used hold true/pass with your data? So, while I haven’t looked closely at this tool, all I saw was talk of the interface and the ease of getting results even if “you don’t know where to start”. That scares me. Especially when you start talking about applications in domains like medicine. That could be lives in the balance. Would we want civil engineers using tools like this to build bridges? Or people designing nuclear reactors? To me, this is worse, not better unless it somehow helps you actually understand when, why and how to correctly use these tools.
- jakobegger 9y ago
  Making tools easier to use frees up mental capacity for understanding what your are doing. Just because someone has spent a lot of time learning how to use a difficult tool doesn‘t mean they understand what they are doing any better.
  - daveFNbuck 9y ago
    Making tools easier to use also allows you to get to a statistical result without the help of an expert who knows how to properly interpret it. People will launch an A/B test and start checking p-values for 20 different variables within hours when they have easy tooling available.
- wanderfowl 9y ago
  Agreed. It's odd to charge money for this at all, given that there are such robust statistical tools for free (read: R). But on top of what you said, the fact that trial versions can't export p-values is tacit endorsement of the "p < 0.0x is all that matters" camp, further promoting toxic statistical thinking. Promoting ease of use of tools and simplification of harder problems is great, but this is a really, really dangerous thing to make easy and oversimplified. Nope nope nope nope nope.
  - wenc 9y ago
    To be fair, R isn't really that accessible to most social scientists. Heck, R isn't really that accessible to most programmers either. The tidyverse and R notebooks have definitely improved things by leaps and bounds, but R at its core is an unusual language. (I say this as a somewhat proficient R user) Its programmatic nature does aid in coming up with reproducible data analyses though. SPSS has, shall we say, a less than savory reputation. All this to say that there is a market for something much friendlier than R. R is used by pure statisticians, data scientists and the like, but most social scientists prefer Stata, which has pretty legit statistical routines as well as a point-and-click UI.
    - Fomite 9y ago
      I'm fairly fond of JMP, which in my mind manages to thread the gap between "Easy UI" and "Push buttons until you get a p-value" decently.
      - singingfish 9y ago
        Yeah I quite like JMP. JMP for the easy routine stuff. R for when shit gets real. I don't do much stats these days though, so not having a JMP license, I just reach straight for R on the rare occasions I need it.
    - catnaroek 9y ago
      > Heck, R isn't really that accessible to most programmers either. R is objectively a bad programming language. However, it is by no means inaccessible. I have no statistics background whatsoever, and I managed to learn enough R to be dangerous in a mere week. Other than the 1-based indexing and the utterly disgusting dynamic dispatch mechanism (you could simply not to use the latter), R is surprisingly pleasant to use. What I enjoyed the most is that vectors and matrices are first-class values, not objects that are referred to through pointers. It's probably copy-on-write under the hood, but I don't need to care. Hallelujah!
- Fomite 9y ago
  This. I tooled around with it a little bit using a data set I often use for teaching (from Klein and Moeschberger's survival analysis text) and it was remarkably easy to get an answer without any clue as to what was happening, and that's...not reassuring. As you note, getting an answer and getting the statistically correct answer aren't the same thing.
  - rywebb 9y ago
    Yes, sadly having lots of fancy sounding stats creates a smoke-screen of believability.
- Angostura 9y ago
  I’ll give you a counter example. I’m a barely stats-literate biology graduate. I recognise that’s misuse of stats is dangerous but would like to become more expert. If this program can help me by handling the mechanical bits in a elegant fashion, while leaving me to worry about the appropriate tests and methodologies, I’m all for it.
- kome 9y ago
  wow, this attitude is really patronizing and completely misled. The difficulty of learning the software doesn't says much about the quality of the ideas, of the research design, of data gathering and interpretation. Like it or not, SPSS made science much easier. And we should work in that direction. Not creating more complex tools for no reason. A software can and should also be a pedagogic tool, guiding people through...
  - incongruity 9y ago
    >Like it or not, SPSS made science much easier. No - it didn’t. Science isn’t running stats tools. It’s knowing what tools to use and using them properly so that you get valid answers. If you haven’t been paying attention, the social sciences have been plagued by an epidemic of failures of reproducibility - see: https://www.nature.com/news/over-half-of-psychology-studies-fail-reproducibility-test-1.18248 https://www.nature.com/news/over-half-of-psychology-studies-... for reference. Only 39% of studies were found to be replicable and much of the blame falls to poor methods and techniques like p-hacking. > And we should work in that direction. Yes, we should - but dumbing down interfaces in ways that don’t actually provide good guardrails/handholding to help with proper application is not making good science easier. > Not creating more complex tools for no reason. Nowhere have I or others suggested that. But a tool that makes it simple to get an answer is not the same as one that makes it simple to get a correct and valid answer. Science is a means to an end in many cases. Medicine, for example, is about better human lives. Shoddy research methods could do anything from giving false hope to actually endangering lives.
- fnordsensei 9y ago
  This is a well known problem in cognitive systems engineering, which sometimes seem to promote design which might seem backwards to an interaction designer focused on creating for everyday consumption. You don't want to design the control room for a nuclear reactor like you design a webpage, because you can under no circumstances sacrifice correctness for ease. A lot of times, it's about making the wrong thing really hard to do, with multiple layers of fail-safes. The potential gain in productivity when designing for ease is vastly overshadowed by the risks associated with making an error. When we're not talking about nuclear reactors, but—for example—statistics, where consequences are abstract, it might get tempting to err on the side of ease. In fact, any domain you don't understand well enough well tempt you to design for ease over correctness. Ideally, the designer should understand the domain at hand well enough to create a design that makes it easy to be correct, and hard to make an error. There's a lot of stuff out there that has been neither designed for ease nor correctness, however, but which has a design arbitrarily dictated by the table layout of a database, or some other random technical constrain that has nothing to do with the problem domain.
  - incongruity 9y ago
    Thank you - I think you said much of what I was trying to say in a much better way.
- vatys 9y ago
  I use Wizard all the time. I'm not a data scientist, but I often need to make engineering decisions based on trends hidden in large datasets. Wizard makes it easy to find what I'm looking for. I'm generally using it for a first pass at data, and when I find the trend, outlier, correlation, etc, that I'm looking for, I'll then move on to a tool with more features like Tableau or JMP to really dig in. What is wrong with having a fast and easy to use tool which makes data analysis accessible? If people misuse their data or their tools, that's their fault.
  - incongruity 9y ago
    Excuse a brief bit of hyperbole, but what’s your stance on gun control? How do you feel about seatbelt and helmet laws? All of those things and more exist for the protection of the users and/or general public - but many people hold the attitude that it should be up to the user to do or not so it right. We have a history of banning or socially stigmatizing dangerous products and practices - see 3 wheel ATVs and lawn darts, for easy examples. Similarly, and less extreme, standards and best practices exist exactly because it’s often pragmatically dangerous to expect the end user of a product to be an expert enough to avoid hidden or infrequent but high risk dangers, much less very common and high risk dangers. (See examples everywhere from medicine to aviation or the national elictrical code). Making it easier to shoot yourself in the foot isn’t a virtue on its own...
vermooten 9y ago
no screenshots?
- anonfunction 9y ago
  Was thinking same thing, there is a link to a video at the bottom though.
  - fzil 9y ago
    and the video is blurry in 480p (maybe because it was uploaded 6 years ago?)
    - wenc 9y ago
      I came across this program about 6 years ago, and the webpage hasn't changed. I have a suspicion that the program may not have been updated since, but it's hard to tell.
      - devin 9y ago
        No, it has received frequent updates.
Nullabillity 9y ago
> PS- Wizard is only available for Mac, but if you’re reading this on a PC, consider this: for the price of high-end statistics software, you can buy Wizard and still have enough money left over for a top-of-the-line MacBook Air or MacBook Pro. Amazing, isn’t it? Wow, that's a great way to kill off any sympathy for him. Especially given that he's apparently had 4-5 years to dig himself out of that hole.
- crooked-v 9y ago
  It's not about "sympathy". It's about pointing out that similarly-targeted apps like Analytica can cost $1000+ per license.
  - wanderfowl 9y ago
    But just think, for the price of this app, you could buy a nice dinner for two and an infinite number of copies of R.
  - Nullabillity 9y ago
    $200 for this + $1000 for the cheapest macbook > your $1000 analytica license. And that's before considering that you're now stuck lugging around an extra paperweight everywhere, or that R is available for free.
    - goatlover 9y ago
      > or that R is available for free. Along with Python and Julia.
- khr 9y ago
  It's especially strange since there are good free multi-platform statistics programs. There's R (as other commenters have pointed out) and JASP (https://jasp-stats.org/ https://jasp-stats.org/) which has a similar point-and-click interface for those who are used to SPSS.
haZard_OS 9y ago
Robust statistical analyses require knowledge, judgement, and increasingly, specialist expertise. To market a product as a way to jettison the statistician is so shortsighted as to be intellectual malpractice. Forgive me if I seem overly aggressive but I have grown weary of my and my colleagues' profession being side-lined and belittled. Politicians, administrators, and even some other scientists see statistics as merely a badge to be placed atop their own work for validation. Well, ladies and gentlemen, statistics is more than that. It is an empirical science in its own right. Of course, it doesn't always take a statistician to do the necessary statistical work. I am no physicist yet I can certainly apply the Clausius Clapeyron equation as needed. Likewise, I expect many (perhaps most) scientists to be able to apply an ANOVA or simple regression as the need arises. HOWEVER, the lack of intellectual humility on the part of so many non-statisticians when applying statistical tools to their own work is maddening.
- mbell 9y ago
  I'm having a hard time understanding how statistics could be considered an empirical science, and really what bearing that term has on statistics at all. Can you explain?
  - closed 9y ago
    Not OP, but I would say that when statistics acts like a subfield of mathematics, then it is an art. However, if we consider judging whether a statistical method will be useful for the world as a part of statistics, then that part sometimes is an empirical science. That is, the statement "I should use X technique because it performs Y% well" is sometimes an an empirical statement.
  - cozzyd 9y ago
    One simple example is that the power of a statistical test is usually modeled using mock experiments.
cwyers 9y ago
> Trial versions never expire. They do not report p-values, and cannot save or export. Requires OS X 10.10 or later. Maybe this makes the trial versions better?
ACow_Adonis 9y ago
Apart from being literally the opposite of where I think statistics should be headed (i.e. I see the notion of "removal of 'complicated statistics knowledge'" to be more dangerous than helpful), I also had some practical feedback from watching the 12 minute intro video. -Firstly, how does the visualization know the respective population or sample size from which the summary statistics and intervals are to be drawn? - The demo used a pie chart to try to display summary stats and confidence intervals from the general social survey. Aside from professional statisticians general dislike of pie charts, you cannot plot confidence intervals in this way into a pie chart just by inserting 'more white space between the slices'. There's only 100% of the area of the circle that you've got to play with, so any attempt to increase the 'white space' between the slices necessarily warps the real estate remaining to represent each actual slice. - Honestly, I see this tool likely to be used by people who participate in the practice of p-hacking, whether deliberately or not. The ability to throw lots of simple models quickly at lots of data mindlessly reporting some notion of statistical significance is dangerous. I'm assuming your stats are not (cannot) be adjusted in any fashion to implicate what you're really doing by using an automated model-building/reporting regime in this way (potentially running heaps of models on heaps of data until you find one that appears 'significant' based on a statistical test designed under the assumption that this is NOT what you're doing). No where did i see any application of train/test, sample/resample type methods to try to control for over-fitting in the prediction application or truly estimate how predictive/replicable such a technique would be in the real world. While I appreciate the work done required to put something like this together (a lot of it looks like a gui interface to my own exploratory functions/scripts in R, for example), i genuinely believe this approach is more dangerous/likely to lead to false conclusions than helpful.
- incongruity 9y ago
  I agree, in this case, you’re right on (and I have another comment saying as much) but couldn’t there be a UI that guides you safely through some of those dangers? I have yet to see anything close to one but I could imagine a system that would at least ask a few questions that would quickly disqualify a dataset or intended analysis for some use cases. Imagine, if you will, turbo-tax for (basic) statistical analyses. As I said elsewhere, a simple interface doesn’t necessarily mean a correct outcome - In short, most stats software is solving the wrong problem. Many (especially this one) make it easy to get an answer, right or wrong. I’d rather see them make it hard to get a wrong answer - or, perhaps, hard to get an answer when you’re using it wrong.
leemailll 9y ago
I don't understand this program. It states it is a statistics program but on the front page only test stated is " Shapiro-Wilk". I don't know how many here are familiar with statistics, but that is basically the hello-world thing for statistic tests. Also the pricing puts this program directly at the range of Graphpad's Prism, which is widely-used in academic fields other than the field of statistics, and quite intuitive. Making good-looking figures nowadays is not a selling point anymore. If one's willing to script rather than clicking-the-mouse, Prism, Igor Pro, Origin Pro, Matlab (pricing from low to high) all can produce great figures and solid statistical test for people out of the statistics field. But nothing these days beats R for versatile of statistical tests.
stephen123 9y ago
I video if it in action would be really helpful. Just reading the landing page its hard to know how im supposed to use it. "Just click and explore" isnt very convincing.
- nxrabl 9y ago
  They link to a demo video near the bottom of the page: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcA9YG9yJgs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcA9YG9yJgs
devin 9y ago
I own a copy of Wizard and have found it valuable on numerous occasions from digging around databases to tinkering with models. It handles non-trivial amounts of data with relative ease, allows you to do joins in the UI, has nice graphical representations that can change based on the type of the column. The list goes on. It does quite a lot of stuff. Everyone I show this software to goes: "Whoa, what is this?" I would recommend checking it out before dismissing it.
- vatys 9y ago
  I use Wizard all the time at work for analyzing manufacturing data to quickly check for trends and correlations. I find it better, easier, and faster than the internal tools purpose-built for the same task. I also prefer Wizard over JMP, Tableau, or any R/numpy/gnuplot methods, specifically for one-off tasks and analyzing new issues. I’m not going to write a script or configure complex software for a quick check. Wizard is perfect for that. It’s also super fast at scanning through really enormous CSV files, then generating plots for every parameter. Every coworker who sees me using it for these tasks wants to know what it is, or how I send out relevant plots so quickly when new datasets are available. It’s really a fantastic tool for quick work. There seems to be a lot of negativity in this comments section about misuse of statistics. I think people are missing the point. Easy tools make data analysis more accessible, but misuse of data is the fault of the user, not the tool.
  - mnky9800n 9y ago
    I some how cannot read these positive comments without believing that they are AstroTurf.
devin 9y ago
Since other comments on this thread have complained about missing screenshots. Some can be found here: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/wizard-statistics-analysis/id495152161?mt=12 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/wizard-statistics-analysis/i...
abakker 9y ago
SPSS user here, I run a bunch of surveys in Qualtrics and SurveyMonkey, and frequently use their export to SPSS file functionality. Often, I have questions that take the format of "for each of the following categories please rank them between strongly disagree and Strongly agree". The way these questions end up in the SPSS files are typically as different variables for each row, and a 1,2,3,4, or 5 as the measurement along with the labels. Frequently, I want to pivot those types of questions by a variable like Region or Number of Employees (categorical), and then see the resultant tables. This is never fun, and inevitably takes a lot of time. As others have said, statistics is a careful business that doesn't necessarily warrant ease of access to all mathematical functions BUT, handling what SPSS calls "Multiple Response Sets" better would be a godsend, just for the data prep and visualization step. I still ultimately fall back on recoding these or leveraging the MRS functional in SPSS to get this done (sometimes this is better than just using pivot tables in excel). It would be great to be able to specify this kind of thing in this program, since without it, you can't really use/trust the computed percentages in some question configurations. Take a real look at the SPSS Tables feature, the Multiple Response Sets, and then visualization of them, and consider how that data is actually coded in SPSS files (the common export of survey tools) and maybe you can improve on that feature (It shouldn't be hard, MRS is a pretty bad setup, but it gets the job done).
tambourine_man 9y ago
Please check your home page on 4” devices. Headline is clipped.
trevvr 9y ago
Wizard is an awesome tool for initial investigation and initial slicing and dicing of incoming data. For trying out ideas and seeing if what you're "seeing" in the data might be worthy of further investigation and hypothesis testing. It isn't R, SPSS or Minitab. It's brilliant at what it does and I love it. I've been using it for 3 / 4 years and wouldn't swap it for any other tool.
ljw1001 9y ago
I don't understand the hostility to this application. Progress comes from trying different ways to do things. I tried this program a few years back, and thought it was ok. It is easier to use than JMP, which some others have mentioned, though not as powerful. There is nothing about easy-to-use that precludes understanding, and certainly nothing about difficult-to-use that promotes it. They are largely orthogonal. Using R doesn't make you a statistician, any more than using C++ makes you a software engineer. If anything, a simple interface can reduce the number of ways you can shoot yourself, and leaves more time to focus on the problem. Being easy-to-use may be the difference between some analysis and no analysis, or at best, analysis by spreadsheet. And finally, this is Hacker News. The author wrote this software and makes some money off it. Great. Isn't that what this place is all about?
- csomar 9y ago
  I can see a 1.000 ways I can use this app. R is cool and stuff but it is very hard to get any chart if you don't know the language. And it might take a while to write down any code. This is much simpler. You just input the data and it gives you charts right away.
csomar 9y ago
There is a video link at the very bottom of the page. It'll take some hazard to fall onto it. I'm not going to download a program and figure out how to use it. Why not have the video at the top. Maybe pop right on my face. Actually, these are moments when I'd not mind a popup that takes focus out of a page.
trengrj 9y ago
I'd recommend some screenshots or the video before you get to pricing. Some of the graphics need to be improved. It would also be great to see why this is better than tradition BI tools (Tableau etc) and what your unique value proposition is.
rounce 9y ago
Just had a quick skim of the site and saw no screenshots just a load of marketese. Next I head to the HN comments: some preach FUD, others are stauch defenders. It seems very few speak from experience of actually using this application. It seems a lot of the discussion stems from the poor marketing than anything else.
untangle 9y ago
If you are willing to defer dismissing this tool out of hand as a p-value generator, you can get a better feel for how the author (Evan Miller) thinks about stats from his web site [1] and a presentation he gave [2]. I think you'll find that "Wizard" is not the product of whimsy. [1] http://www.evanmiller.org/ http://www.evanmiller.org/ [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzJMFxj7GRI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzJMFxj7GRI
mnky9800n 9y ago
Is this close sourced? I'm not using a statistics package I don't trust or that I can take apart to see what's wrong when it's returning weird results.
- dman 9y ago
  How much are you willing to pay to use something like this? Would you still pay if it was open source?
  - mnky9800n 9y ago
    I use python and R for all of my research. Why would I pay for anything when those tools allow me to do these tasks for free?

The app should use mutually exclusive colors for the visualizations to communicate the right and intended information.

Generally speaking, IMHO, making the interface easier, in practice, doesn’t actually make using statistical methods correctly easier and that’s scary. SPSS is a classic example - and the social sciences have had a series of discredited papers over recent years due to poor application of statistical methods. Just because you can put a dataset in and get values out - even values that look significant, it doesn’t mean they are - did all of the assumptions and requirements of the methods/tests you used hold true/pass with your data? So, while I haven’t looked closely at this tool, all I saw was talk of the interface and the ease of getting results even if “you don’t know where to start”. That scares me. Especially when you start talking about applications in domains like medicine. That could be lives in the balance. Would we want civil engineers using tools like this to build bridges? Or people designing nuclear reactors? To me, this is worse, not better unless it somehow helps you actually understand when, why and how to correctly use these tools.

jakobegger 9y ago
Making tools easier to use frees up mental capacity for understanding what your are doing. Just because someone has spent a lot of time learning how to use a difficult tool doesn‘t mean they understand what they are doing any better.
- daveFNbuck 9y ago
  Making tools easier to use also allows you to get to a statistical result without the help of an expert who knows how to properly interpret it. People will launch an A/B test and start checking p-values for 20 different variables within hours when they have easy tooling available.
wanderfowl 9y ago
Agreed. It's odd to charge money for this at all, given that there are such robust statistical tools for free (read: R). But on top of what you said, the fact that trial versions can't export p-values is tacit endorsement of the "p < 0.0x is all that matters" camp, further promoting toxic statistical thinking. Promoting ease of use of tools and simplification of harder problems is great, but this is a really, really dangerous thing to make easy and oversimplified. Nope nope nope nope nope.
- wenc 9y ago
  To be fair, R isn't really that accessible to most social scientists. Heck, R isn't really that accessible to most programmers either. The tidyverse and R notebooks have definitely improved things by leaps and bounds, but R at its core is an unusual language. (I say this as a somewhat proficient R user) Its programmatic nature does aid in coming up with reproducible data analyses though. SPSS has, shall we say, a less than savory reputation. All this to say that there is a market for something much friendlier than R. R is used by pure statisticians, data scientists and the like, but most social scientists prefer Stata, which has pretty legit statistical routines as well as a point-and-click UI.
  - Fomite 9y ago
    I'm fairly fond of JMP, which in my mind manages to thread the gap between "Easy UI" and "Push buttons until you get a p-value" decently.
    - singingfish 9y ago
      Yeah I quite like JMP. JMP for the easy routine stuff. R for when shit gets real. I don't do much stats these days though, so not having a JMP license, I just reach straight for R on the rare occasions I need it.
  - catnaroek 9y ago
    > Heck, R isn't really that accessible to most programmers either. R is objectively a bad programming language. However, it is by no means inaccessible. I have no statistics background whatsoever, and I managed to learn enough R to be dangerous in a mere week. Other than the 1-based indexing and the utterly disgusting dynamic dispatch mechanism (you could simply not to use the latter), R is surprisingly pleasant to use. What I enjoyed the most is that vectors and matrices are first-class values, not objects that are referred to through pointers. It's probably copy-on-write under the hood, but I don't need to care. Hallelujah!
Fomite 9y ago
This. I tooled around with it a little bit using a data set I often use for teaching (from Klein and Moeschberger's survival analysis text) and it was remarkably easy to get an answer without any clue as to what was happening, and that's...not reassuring. As you note, getting an answer and getting the statistically correct answer aren't the same thing.
- rywebb 9y ago
  Yes, sadly having lots of fancy sounding stats creates a smoke-screen of believability.
Angostura 9y ago
I’ll give you a counter example. I’m a barely stats-literate biology graduate. I recognise that’s misuse of stats is dangerous but would like to become more expert. If this program can help me by handling the mechanical bits in a elegant fashion, while leaving me to worry about the appropriate tests and methodologies, I’m all for it.
kome 9y ago
wow, this attitude is really patronizing and completely misled. The difficulty of learning the software doesn't says much about the quality of the ideas, of the research design, of data gathering and interpretation. Like it or not, SPSS made science much easier. And we should work in that direction. Not creating more complex tools for no reason. A software can and should also be a pedagogic tool, guiding people through...
- incongruity 9y ago
  >Like it or not, SPSS made science much easier. No - it didn’t. Science isn’t running stats tools. It’s knowing what tools to use and using them properly so that you get valid answers. If you haven’t been paying attention, the social sciences have been plagued by an epidemic of failures of reproducibility - see: https://www.nature.com/news/over-half-of-psychology-studies-fail-reproducibility-test-1.18248 https://www.nature.com/news/over-half-of-psychology-studies-... for reference. Only 39% of studies were found to be replicable and much of the blame falls to poor methods and techniques like p-hacking. > And we should work in that direction. Yes, we should - but dumbing down interfaces in ways that don’t actually provide good guardrails/handholding to help with proper application is not making good science easier. > Not creating more complex tools for no reason. Nowhere have I or others suggested that. But a tool that makes it simple to get an answer is not the same as one that makes it simple to get a correct and valid answer. Science is a means to an end in many cases. Medicine, for example, is about better human lives. Shoddy research methods could do anything from giving false hope to actually endangering lives.
fnordsensei 9y ago
This is a well known problem in cognitive systems engineering, which sometimes seem to promote design which might seem backwards to an interaction designer focused on creating for everyday consumption. You don't want to design the control room for a nuclear reactor like you design a webpage, because you can under no circumstances sacrifice correctness for ease. A lot of times, it's about making the wrong thing really hard to do, with multiple layers of fail-safes. The potential gain in productivity when designing for ease is vastly overshadowed by the risks associated with making an error. When we're not talking about nuclear reactors, but—for example—statistics, where consequences are abstract, it might get tempting to err on the side of ease. In fact, any domain you don't understand well enough well tempt you to design for ease over correctness. Ideally, the designer should understand the domain at hand well enough to create a design that makes it easy to be correct, and hard to make an error. There's a lot of stuff out there that has been neither designed for ease nor correctness, however, but which has a design arbitrarily dictated by the table layout of a database, or some other random technical constrain that has nothing to do with the problem domain.
- incongruity 9y ago
  Thank you - I think you said much of what I was trying to say in a much better way.
vatys 9y ago
I use Wizard all the time. I'm not a data scientist, but I often need to make engineering decisions based on trends hidden in large datasets. Wizard makes it easy to find what I'm looking for. I'm generally using it for a first pass at data, and when I find the trend, outlier, correlation, etc, that I'm looking for, I'll then move on to a tool with more features like Tableau or JMP to really dig in. What is wrong with having a fast and easy to use tool which makes data analysis accessible? If people misuse their data or their tools, that's their fault.
- incongruity 9y ago
  Excuse a brief bit of hyperbole, but what’s your stance on gun control? How do you feel about seatbelt and helmet laws? All of those things and more exist for the protection of the users and/or general public - but many people hold the attitude that it should be up to the user to do or not so it right. We have a history of banning or socially stigmatizing dangerous products and practices - see 3 wheel ATVs and lawn darts, for easy examples. Similarly, and less extreme, standards and best practices exist exactly because it’s often pragmatically dangerous to expect the end user of a product to be an expert enough to avoid hidden or infrequent but high risk dangers, much less very common and high risk dangers. (See examples everywhere from medicine to aviation or the national elictrical code). Making it easier to shoot yourself in the foot isn’t a virtue on its own...

vermooten 9y ago

no screenshots?

anonfunction 9y ago
Was thinking same thing, there is a link to a video at the bottom though.
- fzil 9y ago
  and the video is blurry in 480p (maybe because it was uploaded 6 years ago?)
  - wenc 9y ago
    I came across this program about 6 years ago, and the webpage hasn't changed. I have a suspicion that the program may not have been updated since, but it's hard to tell.
    - devin 9y ago
      No, it has received frequent updates.

Nullabillity 9y ago

> PS- Wizard is only available for Mac, but if you’re reading this on a PC, consider this: for the price of high-end statistics software, you can buy Wizard and still have enough money left over for a top-of-the-line MacBook Air or MacBook Pro. Amazing, isn’t it? Wow, that's a great way to kill off any sympathy for him. Especially given that he's apparently had 4-5 years to dig himself out of that hole.

crooked-v 9y ago
It's not about "sympathy". It's about pointing out that similarly-targeted apps like Analytica can cost $1000+ per license.
- wanderfowl 9y ago
  But just think, for the price of this app, you could buy a nice dinner for two and an infinite number of copies of R.
- Nullabillity 9y ago
  $200 for this + $1000 for the cheapest macbook > your $1000 analytica license. And that's before considering that you're now stuck lugging around an extra paperweight everywhere, or that R is available for free.
  - goatlover 9y ago
    > or that R is available for free. Along with Python and Julia.
khr 9y ago
It's especially strange since there are good free multi-platform statistics programs. There's R (as other commenters have pointed out) and JASP (https://jasp-stats.org/ https://jasp-stats.org/) which has a similar point-and-click interface for those who are used to SPSS.

haZard_OS 9y ago

Robust statistical analyses require knowledge, judgement, and increasingly, specialist expertise. To market a product as a way to jettison the statistician is so shortsighted as to be intellectual malpractice. Forgive me if I seem overly aggressive but I have grown weary of my and my colleagues' profession being side-lined and belittled. Politicians, administrators, and even some other scientists see statistics as merely a badge to be placed atop their own work for validation. Well, ladies and gentlemen, statistics is more than that. It is an empirical science in its own right. Of course, it doesn't always take a statistician to do the necessary statistical work. I am no physicist yet I can certainly apply the Clausius Clapeyron equation as needed. Likewise, I expect many (perhaps most) scientists to be able to apply an ANOVA or simple regression as the need arises. HOWEVER, the lack of intellectual humility on the part of so many non-statisticians when applying statistical tools to their own work is maddening.

mbell 9y ago
I'm having a hard time understanding how statistics could be considered an empirical science, and really what bearing that term has on statistics at all. Can you explain?
- closed 9y ago
  Not OP, but I would say that when statistics acts like a subfield of mathematics, then it is an art. However, if we consider judging whether a statistical method will be useful for the world as a part of statistics, then that part sometimes is an empirical science. That is, the statement "I should use X technique because it performs Y% well" is sometimes an an empirical statement.
- cozzyd 9y ago
  One simple example is that the power of a statistical test is usually modeled using mock experiments.

cwyers 9y ago

> Trial versions never expire. They do not report p-values, and cannot save or export. Requires OS X 10.10 or later. Maybe this makes the trial versions better?

ACow_Adonis 9y ago

Apart from being literally the opposite of where I think statistics should be headed (i.e. I see the notion of "removal of 'complicated statistics knowledge'" to be more dangerous than helpful), I also had some practical feedback from watching the 12 minute intro video. -Firstly, how does the visualization know the respective population or sample size from which the summary statistics and intervals are to be drawn? - The demo used a pie chart to try to display summary stats and confidence intervals from the general social survey. Aside from professional statisticians general dislike of pie charts, you cannot plot confidence intervals in this way into a pie chart just by inserting 'more white space between the slices'. There's only 100% of the area of the circle that you've got to play with, so any attempt to increase the 'white space' between the slices necessarily warps the real estate remaining to represent each actual slice. - Honestly, I see this tool likely to be used by people who participate in the practice of p-hacking, whether deliberately or not. The ability to throw lots of simple models quickly at lots of data mindlessly reporting some notion of statistical significance is dangerous. I'm assuming your stats are not (cannot) be adjusted in any fashion to implicate what you're really doing by using an automated model-building/reporting regime in this way (potentially running heaps of models on heaps of data until you find one that appears 'significant' based on a statistical test designed under the assumption that this is NOT what you're doing). No where did i see any application of train/test, sample/resample type methods to try to control for over-fitting in the prediction application or truly estimate how predictive/replicable such a technique would be in the real world. While I appreciate the work done required to put something like this together (a lot of it looks like a gui interface to my own exploratory functions/scripts in R, for example), i genuinely believe this approach is more dangerous/likely to lead to false conclusions than helpful.

incongruity 9y ago
I agree, in this case, you’re right on (and I have another comment saying as much) but couldn’t there be a UI that guides you safely through some of those dangers? I have yet to see anything close to one but I could imagine a system that would at least ask a few questions that would quickly disqualify a dataset or intended analysis for some use cases. Imagine, if you will, turbo-tax for (basic) statistical analyses. As I said elsewhere, a simple interface doesn’t necessarily mean a correct outcome - In short, most stats software is solving the wrong problem. Many (especially this one) make it easy to get an answer, right or wrong. I’d rather see them make it hard to get a wrong answer - or, perhaps, hard to get an answer when you’re using it wrong.

leemailll 9y ago

I don't understand this program. It states it is a statistics program but on the front page only test stated is " Shapiro-Wilk". I don't know how many here are familiar with statistics, but that is basically the hello-world thing for statistic tests. Also the pricing puts this program directly at the range of Graphpad's Prism, which is widely-used in academic fields other than the field of statistics, and quite intuitive. Making good-looking figures nowadays is not a selling point anymore. If one's willing to script rather than clicking-the-mouse, Prism, Igor Pro, Origin Pro, Matlab (pricing from low to high) all can produce great figures and solid statistical test for people out of the statistics field. But nothing these days beats R for versatile of statistical tests.

stephen123 9y ago

I video if it in action would be really helpful. Just reading the landing page its hard to know how im supposed to use it. "Just click and explore" isnt very convincing.

nxrabl 9y ago
They link to a demo video near the bottom of the page: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcA9YG9yJgs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcA9YG9yJgs

devin 9y ago

I own a copy of Wizard and have found it valuable on numerous occasions from digging around databases to tinkering with models. It handles non-trivial amounts of data with relative ease, allows you to do joins in the UI, has nice graphical representations that can change based on the type of the column. The list goes on. It does quite a lot of stuff. Everyone I show this software to goes: "Whoa, what is this?" I would recommend checking it out before dismissing it.

vatys 9y ago
I use Wizard all the time at work for analyzing manufacturing data to quickly check for trends and correlations. I find it better, easier, and faster than the internal tools purpose-built for the same task. I also prefer Wizard over JMP, Tableau, or any R/numpy/gnuplot methods, specifically for one-off tasks and analyzing new issues. I’m not going to write a script or configure complex software for a quick check. Wizard is perfect for that. It’s also super fast at scanning through really enormous CSV files, then generating plots for every parameter. Every coworker who sees me using it for these tasks wants to know what it is, or how I send out relevant plots so quickly when new datasets are available. It’s really a fantastic tool for quick work. There seems to be a lot of negativity in this comments section about misuse of statistics. I think people are missing the point. Easy tools make data analysis more accessible, but misuse of data is the fault of the user, not the tool.
- mnky9800n 9y ago
  I some how cannot read these positive comments without believing that they are AstroTurf.

devin 9y ago

Since other comments on this thread have complained about missing screenshots. Some can be found here: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/wizard-statistics-analysis/id495152161?mt=12 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/wizard-statistics-analysis/i...

abakker 9y ago

SPSS user here, I run a bunch of surveys in Qualtrics and SurveyMonkey, and frequently use their export to SPSS file functionality. Often, I have questions that take the format of "for each of the following categories please rank them between strongly disagree and Strongly agree". The way these questions end up in the SPSS files are typically as different variables for each row, and a 1,2,3,4, or 5 as the measurement along with the labels. Frequently, I want to pivot those types of questions by a variable like Region or Number of Employees (categorical), and then see the resultant tables. This is never fun, and inevitably takes a lot of time. As others have said, statistics is a careful business that doesn't necessarily warrant ease of access to all mathematical functions BUT, handling what SPSS calls "Multiple Response Sets" better would be a godsend, just for the data prep and visualization step. I still ultimately fall back on recoding these or leveraging the MRS functional in SPSS to get this done (sometimes this is better than just using pivot tables in excel). It would be great to be able to specify this kind of thing in this program, since without it, you can't really use/trust the computed percentages in some question configurations. Take a real look at the SPSS Tables feature, the Multiple Response Sets, and then visualization of them, and consider how that data is actually coded in SPSS files (the common export of survey tools) and maybe you can improve on that feature (It shouldn't be hard, MRS is a pretty bad setup, but it gets the job done).

tambourine_man 9y ago

Please check your home page on 4” devices. Headline is clipped.

trevvr 9y ago

Wizard is an awesome tool for initial investigation and initial slicing and dicing of incoming data. For trying out ideas and seeing if what you're "seeing" in the data might be worthy of further investigation and hypothesis testing. It isn't R, SPSS or Minitab. It's brilliant at what it does and I love it. I've been using it for 3 / 4 years and wouldn't swap it for any other tool.

ljw1001 9y ago

I don't understand the hostility to this application. Progress comes from trying different ways to do things. I tried this program a few years back, and thought it was ok. It is easier to use than JMP, which some others have mentioned, though not as powerful. There is nothing about easy-to-use that precludes understanding, and certainly nothing about difficult-to-use that promotes it. They are largely orthogonal. Using R doesn't make you a statistician, any more than using C++ makes you a software engineer. If anything, a simple interface can reduce the number of ways you can shoot yourself, and leaves more time to focus on the problem. Being easy-to-use may be the difference between some analysis and no analysis, or at best, analysis by spreadsheet. And finally, this is Hacker News. The author wrote this software and makes some money off it. Great. Isn't that what this place is all about?

csomar 9y ago
I can see a 1.000 ways I can use this app. R is cool and stuff but it is very hard to get any chart if you don't know the language. And it might take a while to write down any code. This is much simpler. You just input the data and it gives you charts right away.

csomar 9y ago

There is a video link at the very bottom of the page. It'll take some hazard to fall onto it. I'm not going to download a program and figure out how to use it. Why not have the video at the top. Maybe pop right on my face. Actually, these are moments when I'd not mind a popup that takes focus out of a page.

trengrj 9y ago

I'd recommend some screenshots or the video before you get to pricing. Some of the graphics need to be improved. It would also be great to see why this is better than tradition BI tools (Tableau etc) and what your unique value proposition is.

rounce 9y ago

Just had a quick skim of the site and saw no screenshots just a load of marketese. Next I head to the HN comments: some preach FUD, others are stauch defenders. It seems very few speak from experience of actually using this application. It seems a lot of the discussion stems from the poor marketing than anything else.

untangle 9y ago

If you are willing to defer dismissing this tool out of hand as a p-value generator, you can get a better feel for how the author (Evan Miller) thinks about stats from his web site [1] and a presentation he gave [2]. I think you'll find that "Wizard" is not the product of whimsy. [1] http://www.evanmiller.org/ http://www.evanmiller.org/ [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzJMFxj7GRI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzJMFxj7GRI

mnky9800n 9y ago

Is this close sourced? I'm not using a statistics package I don't trust or that I can take apart to see what's wrong when it's returning weird results.

dman 9y ago
How much are you willing to pay to use something like this? Would you still pay if it was open source?
- mnky9800n 9y ago
  I use python and R for all of my research. Why would I pay for anything when those tools allow me to do these tasks for free?