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The language itself is simple[1] but the environment and tools aren't. Smalltalk is a world in itself which is both its strength and weakness. https://learnxin

The language itself is simple[1] but the environment and tools aren't. Smalltalk is a world in itself which is both its strength and weakness. https://learnxinyminutes.com/docs/smalltalk/ https://learnxinyminutes.com/docs/smalltalk/

JepZ 9y ago
I am well aware of that as I had my own trouble learning Smalltalk. Yet in hindsight I like the clean design of the language. Nevertheless, I find the argument on their website kinda odd and a bit confusing. I mean, I see a lot of Smalltalk advocates claiming the language is so simple to learn and at the same time I see a lot of programmers having trouble learning it. Maybe it is just wrong to call it 'very easy to learn' just because the syntax is simple.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- FractalLP 9y ago
  The difficulty for me isn't the syntax, so much as not knowing how to use the tools. Examples are extreme like other niche languages. You get either hello world or writing a web server. I'd like to see someone build a YouTube channel with a lot of very small applications that show adding methods, classes,debugging, and deployment.
  - JepZ 9y ago
    I don't know about Pharo, but I have seen very few IDEs which make it as easy as Smalltalk environments (e.g. VisualWorks) to do what you asked for as they provide you with GUI a for all that stuff. Pharo is probably no different. I think the first important step, is to understand the different columns of the 'System Browser'. From a quick search that video playlist might help you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xF4fnGaE2w&list=PLqbtQ7OkSta0ULYAd7Qdxof851ybh-_m_ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xF4fnGaE2w&list=PLqbtQ7OkSt...
- philippeback 9y ago
  Dabbling is easy. Doing serious work is demanding. But so is serious work in any environment.
- ben-coman 9y ago
  I think non-programmers probably learn Smalltalk easier, assuming its natural. Long time programmers maybe have the frustration of unlearning habits. "The only languages worth learning are those that change the way you think about programming."

JepZ 9y ago

I am well aware of that as I had my own trouble learning Smalltalk. Yet in hindsight I like the clean design of the language. Nevertheless, I find the argument on their website kinda odd and a bit confusing. I mean, I see a lot of Smalltalk advocates claiming the language is so simple to learn and at the same time I see a lot of programmers having trouble learning it. Maybe it is just wrong to call it 'very easy to learn' just because the syntax is simple.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
FractalLP 9y ago
The difficulty for me isn't the syntax, so much as not knowing how to use the tools. Examples are extreme like other niche languages. You get either hello world or writing a web server. I'd like to see someone build a YouTube channel with a lot of very small applications that show adding methods, classes,debugging, and deployment.
- JepZ 9y ago
  I don't know about Pharo, but I have seen very few IDEs which make it as easy as Smalltalk environments (e.g. VisualWorks) to do what you asked for as they provide you with GUI a for all that stuff. Pharo is probably no different. I think the first important step, is to understand the different columns of the 'System Browser'. From a quick search that video playlist might help you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xF4fnGaE2w&list=PLqbtQ7OkSta0ULYAd7Qdxof851ybh-_m_ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xF4fnGaE2w&list=PLqbtQ7OkSt...
philippeback 9y ago
Dabbling is easy. Doing serious work is demanding. But so is serious work in any environment.
ben-coman 9y ago
I think non-programmers probably learn Smalltalk easier, assuming its natural. Long time programmers maybe have the frustration of unlearning habits. "The only languages worth learning are those that change the way you think about programming."