5 ms·

Yeah, just about as scary as GE, Disney, Time Warner et al. pushing their left wing agendas via CNN, MSNBC/NBC and ABC. See, everyone can play this game in the

Yeah, just about as scary as GE, Disney, Time Warner et al. pushing their left wing agendas via CNN, MSNBC/NBC and ABC. See, everyone can play this game in the Postmodernist world.

mozumder 9y ago
OK but now you have to explain why pushing a "left wing agenda" is supposed to be scary. Was it voting rights? Is voting rights scary? Or perhaps universal health care? Is that scary? Or a public education? Wooow that's REALLY scary! Come on.. scare us! We liberals love a good scary story!
- Consultant32452 9y ago
  It's easy if you just blindly accept the axioms of one of the groups. You accept the axioms of left wingers, so it doesn't seem scary to you. I'm not a right winger but they could just as easily say: murdering millions of unborn children, robbing us of our right to defend ourselves, denying the right to freedom of association, infringing on our freedom of speech, infringing on our freedom of religion, etc. Those are all pretty scary.
  - mozumder 9y ago
    OK now you have to prove that Disney/CNN/etc. is pushing a pro-abortion agenda. Or that they're pushing government to limit your rights to free speech or religion. Where did Disney & CNN say government should limit your rights to free speech & religion?
    - Consultant32452 9y ago
      I am not a conservative so I'm voicing what I understand to be someone else's opinion. The major media companies including CNN heavily toed the government line that religious groups do not have the right to avoid paying for child murder on religious grounds. Government funded public universities regularly hassle, cancel, and provide insufficient security for conservative speakers. This is government funded censorship and the media has carefully avoided putting it in those terms because they support the position of censoring conservatives.
  - KirinDave 9y ago
    > robbing us of our right to defend ourselves Well, the problem with that narrative is that most of the center-left is quite happy to find a comprimise. It seems like arms dealers are too, actually. It's mostly the NRA unable to disengage its PR machine from collapsing the entire narrative to "you'll take our guns" vs "total gun freedom". So that itself is a good thing to bring up: it's impossible to disassemble with facts because it's already counterfactual. Similar things can be said of the freedom of association and freedom of religion arguments. They're currently fixed by a narrative of constant assault that most folks freely admit is poorly supported in their daily experience, but that they're convinced (by media groups coordinated by Sinclair) are just over the horizon coming from them. It's certainly fair to claim left wing media has bias. We should always be watchful for bias and unfairness in our media. It's just that right now, unless you believe in hidden child porn rings in pizza shops being shut down by a secret Trump task force (the Storm, a literal extension of pizzagate), potential influence from demons/lizard people in the democratic party (Alex Jones pushes this narrative), or a global Jewish coordinated conspiracy that reaches down to the level of each individual life on the planet, and that ever Muslim is part of a coordinated global conspiracy to "end whitness"... Well you get the picture. Unless you believe in the output of this machine coordinated to spread this disinformation (and I say machine because we've got people freely admitting part of it is theirs, e.g., Cambridge Analytica), facts and uncharitable readings are sufficient from the left wing media. A centrist or even a libertarian should have no problem picking their poison in the marketplace of ideas, unless they're genuinely bought into these increasingly absurd conspiracy theories that put 9/11-truther levels of weird to shame.
    - Consultant32452 9y ago
      * Noting I'm arguing someone else's position. * >Well, the problem with that narrative is that most of the center-left is quite happy to find a comprimise. It seems like arms dealers are too, actually. It's mostly the NRA unable to disengage its PR machine from collapsing the entire narrative to "you'll take our guns" vs "total gun freedom". You too are collapsing the narrative to "NRA is evil." The power that the NRA has is that it can mobilize countless voters who support what the NRA does. Pretending that the NRA is a rogue organization that doesn't represent a huge segment of the population is disingenuous. >A centrist or even a libertarian should have no problem picking their poison in the marketplace of ideas, unless they're genuinely bought into these increasingly absurd conspiracy theories that put 9/11-truther levels of weird to shame. Tell me again how Trump is a fascist and neo-Nazis are taking over the country. And further that Trump who bombed the shit out of a major Russian ally (Syria) is under the thumb of Russia because of pee-pee tape in the same breath that you make fun of Trump for being a germaphobe (part of why he eats so much fast food).
- andybak 9y ago
  Non-US citizen here. I just love how "left wing" is now defined in America. Disney is now left wing. Yep.
- prolikewhoa 9y ago
  It's unbelievable how narrow the overton window is, and people think it's larger than it really is. There is very little separating Democrats and Republicans in 2018, at least from party officials (I believe the population is further left than represented). Voting rights, universal healthcare, public education is not a concern of any "left" wing media any longer; that ended a long time ago. "Left" wing media also helped push us into the Iraq War, helping to set the stage for American approval.
  - mozumder 9y ago
    It's gotten a lot larger this election cycle, though. Trump really enabled the liberal base, enough so that you hear talk about repealing the 2nd amendment.
    - prolikewhoa 9y ago
      I think it has gotten larger in reality like you said, but our Media doesn't display it even in the slightest because none of it is free from corporate interests.
jandrese 9y ago
GE, Disney, and Time Warner are left wing now? Did they radically change over the weekend and I didn't notice?
- 0x445442 9y ago
  So you honestly don't think MSNBC/NBC, ABC and CNN are left-wing? As for the corporations which own them... Globalism vs. Nationalism, it's really what 2016 was about.
394852034 9y ago
Something you are forgetting, which is what will lead all this to blow up one way or another since the savages have gone LARPing as civilized people, is that these post-modern, Marxist cancerous virus in disguise, types looooove changing the rules of the game as it suits them, mid game, but they start screeching and yelling and throwing tantrums the second someone also changes rules mid game to counter their rigging and cheating and lying and deception, but they do so even when you just call them out as the cheating, lying, self-harming, mentally deranged psychopaths they are. I don't know when it will happen and how long the caldron will boil until it boils over, but we are in an extremely dangerous time now with the civilized world dealing with the absolute worst enemy humans can face, unrealized internal treasonous saboteurs that are undermining and poisoning and polluting the civilized world to undermine it and make it collapse under its own weight. We don't even realize it, like most hegemons throughout history, that the western, civilized, white world is in a world war, a new technology war a war of the information and emotional manipulation age that is an outcropping and expansion of psychological warfare. If America, let alone Europe and the western valued societies in general, do not wake up soon, they will simply collapse once the facade and defensive walls simply cannot even hold themselves up and will collapse under their own wight as their foundations have been thoroughly undermined.
WhompingWindows 9y ago
Ignoring the fact that there are far more than left/right in the real world, I take issue with the equivalency you're making between Right and Left in the USA. While both sides have many pet issues and wedge issues that are divisive and bad for democracy, the right is denying scientific truth and actively contradicting its extreme budget-hawkishness under the previous president. While the left is bought quite a bit, the right is even more bought by the Kochs, big business, and wealthy donors. Look at the only accomplishment of the right coalition: a major tax cut that expires quickly for everyone except the rich, who receive a massive win in perpetuity. If you look globally, we don't have a Right/Left in the USA, we have an EXTREME right in power and a moderate left in minority. The GOP is the only party in the world whose stance is that climate change is a hoax. We withdrew from the Paris accord while Syria and North Korea have joined it. That is despicably anti-scientific. If you compare Obama's middle of the road left-ism to Trump's extreme right stances, its quite shocking. There can be no false equivalence between the R and L in this country, one is evidently far more extreme.
- throwaway7312 9y ago
  It's extraordinarily worrying to me that the American Left uses 'science' as a shield for its ideological positions and the adherents of its ideology lap it up and repeat it. I don't care so much about the ideological positions. What I care about is the constant, systemic undermining of science. Take your comment, for instance. You throw about the notion of 'scientific truth', as if this is even a thing. Science does not deal in truth. Truth is for the priests and the philosophers. This 'Temple of Science' American Leftists have attempted to create, where all beliefs of the American Left (like climate change, organic food, socialism, tabula rasa, and Boasian anthropology) are enshrined as 'Science', unassailable to criticism (criticizing them means you are 'not educated' or 'don't understand science') regardless the flimsiness of the papers published to support those positions, makes science a partisan field. The American Right has been trained to hate and distrust science. They hate it. They think scientists are all frauds. Why? Because 'scientists', they are told, again and again, support all these Leftist ideological bents that are not science, and that those on the Right know, at some level, are not science. Anthropogenic global warming, as an example, is utter nonsense. Without NOAA, NASA, and GHCN doing heavy manipulation of the raw data before the thousands of scientists who work on it ever see that data, you don't have climate change.[1] Without concealing historical sea ice data, these agencies don't have anything abnormal to report on that front.[2] Right now, you have a situation in America where a bunch of zealots have claimed science as their own, to push their decidedly non-scientific, partisan ideologies... and the other bunch of zealots on the other side of the aisle have disclaimed science as full of shills and charlatans hoaxing the public for tax dollars. I don't know if you actually care about science. I suspect you don't - otherwise you wouldn't be using 'scientific truth' (no such thing) as a shield for your ideology. But I do, and frankly, when I see one side of the most powerful nation on Earth using science as its meat shield and the other side concomitantly coming to view science with hostility and suspicion, when science used to be an apolitical source of wonderment for people from all ideological backgrounds in that same country half a century ago, I am deeply afraid for the future of real scientific investigation. [1] https://realclimatescience.com/100-of-us-warming-is-due-to-noaa-data-tampering/ https://realclimatescience.com/100-of-us-warming-is-due-to-n... [2] https://realclimatescience.com/government-arctic-sea-ice-fraud/ https://realclimatescience.com/government-arctic-sea-ice-fra...
alistairSH 9y ago
Citations please? Preferably from sources located near the middle of this diagram.[1] 1 - https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2016/12/15/Photos/NS/MW-FC101_news_20161215131112_NS.jpg https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2016/12/15/Photos/NS/M...

Yeah, just about as scary as GE, Disney, Time Warner et al. pushing their left wing agendas via CNN, MSNBC/NBC and ABC. See, everyone can play this game in the Postmodernist world.

mozumder 9y ago

OK but now you have to explain why pushing a "left wing agenda" is supposed to be scary. Was it voting rights? Is voting rights scary? Or perhaps universal health care? Is that scary? Or a public education? Wooow that's REALLY scary! Come on.. scare us! We liberals love a good scary story!

Consultant32452 9y ago
It's easy if you just blindly accept the axioms of one of the groups. You accept the axioms of left wingers, so it doesn't seem scary to you. I'm not a right winger but they could just as easily say: murdering millions of unborn children, robbing us of our right to defend ourselves, denying the right to freedom of association, infringing on our freedom of speech, infringing on our freedom of religion, etc. Those are all pretty scary.
- mozumder 9y ago
  OK now you have to prove that Disney/CNN/etc. is pushing a pro-abortion agenda. Or that they're pushing government to limit your rights to free speech or religion. Where did Disney & CNN say government should limit your rights to free speech & religion?
  - Consultant32452 9y ago
    I am not a conservative so I'm voicing what I understand to be someone else's opinion. The major media companies including CNN heavily toed the government line that religious groups do not have the right to avoid paying for child murder on religious grounds. Government funded public universities regularly hassle, cancel, and provide insufficient security for conservative speakers. This is government funded censorship and the media has carefully avoided putting it in those terms because they support the position of censoring conservatives.
- KirinDave 9y ago
  > robbing us of our right to defend ourselves Well, the problem with that narrative is that most of the center-left is quite happy to find a comprimise. It seems like arms dealers are too, actually. It's mostly the NRA unable to disengage its PR machine from collapsing the entire narrative to "you'll take our guns" vs "total gun freedom". So that itself is a good thing to bring up: it's impossible to disassemble with facts because it's already counterfactual. Similar things can be said of the freedom of association and freedom of religion arguments. They're currently fixed by a narrative of constant assault that most folks freely admit is poorly supported in their daily experience, but that they're convinced (by media groups coordinated by Sinclair) are just over the horizon coming from them. It's certainly fair to claim left wing media has bias. We should always be watchful for bias and unfairness in our media. It's just that right now, unless you believe in hidden child porn rings in pizza shops being shut down by a secret Trump task force (the Storm, a literal extension of pizzagate), potential influence from demons/lizard people in the democratic party (Alex Jones pushes this narrative), or a global Jewish coordinated conspiracy that reaches down to the level of each individual life on the planet, and that ever Muslim is part of a coordinated global conspiracy to "end whitness"... Well you get the picture. Unless you believe in the output of this machine coordinated to spread this disinformation (and I say machine because we've got people freely admitting part of it is theirs, e.g., Cambridge Analytica), facts and uncharitable readings are sufficient from the left wing media. A centrist or even a libertarian should have no problem picking their poison in the marketplace of ideas, unless they're genuinely bought into these increasingly absurd conspiracy theories that put 9/11-truther levels of weird to shame.
  - Consultant32452 9y ago
    * Noting I'm arguing someone else's position. * >Well, the problem with that narrative is that most of the center-left is quite happy to find a comprimise. It seems like arms dealers are too, actually. It's mostly the NRA unable to disengage its PR machine from collapsing the entire narrative to "you'll take our guns" vs "total gun freedom". You too are collapsing the narrative to "NRA is evil." The power that the NRA has is that it can mobilize countless voters who support what the NRA does. Pretending that the NRA is a rogue organization that doesn't represent a huge segment of the population is disingenuous. >A centrist or even a libertarian should have no problem picking their poison in the marketplace of ideas, unless they're genuinely bought into these increasingly absurd conspiracy theories that put 9/11-truther levels of weird to shame. Tell me again how Trump is a fascist and neo-Nazis are taking over the country. And further that Trump who bombed the shit out of a major Russian ally (Syria) is under the thumb of Russia because of pee-pee tape in the same breath that you make fun of Trump for being a germaphobe (part of why he eats so much fast food).
andybak 9y ago
Non-US citizen here. I just love how "left wing" is now defined in America. Disney is now left wing. Yep.
prolikewhoa 9y ago
It's unbelievable how narrow the overton window is, and people think it's larger than it really is. There is very little separating Democrats and Republicans in 2018, at least from party officials (I believe the population is further left than represented). Voting rights, universal healthcare, public education is not a concern of any "left" wing media any longer; that ended a long time ago. "Left" wing media also helped push us into the Iraq War, helping to set the stage for American approval.
- mozumder 9y ago
  It's gotten a lot larger this election cycle, though. Trump really enabled the liberal base, enough so that you hear talk about repealing the 2nd amendment.
  - prolikewhoa 9y ago
    I think it has gotten larger in reality like you said, but our Media doesn't display it even in the slightest because none of it is free from corporate interests.

jandrese 9y ago

GE, Disney, and Time Warner are left wing now? Did they radically change over the weekend and I didn't notice?

0x445442 9y ago
So you honestly don't think MSNBC/NBC, ABC and CNN are left-wing? As for the corporations which own them... Globalism vs. Nationalism, it's really what 2016 was about.

394852034 9y ago

Something you are forgetting, which is what will lead all this to blow up one way or another since the savages have gone LARPing as civilized people, is that these post-modern, Marxist cancerous virus in disguise, types looooove changing the rules of the game as it suits them, mid game, but they start screeching and yelling and throwing tantrums the second someone also changes rules mid game to counter their rigging and cheating and lying and deception, but they do so even when you just call them out as the cheating, lying, self-harming, mentally deranged psychopaths they are. I don't know when it will happen and how long the caldron will boil until it boils over, but we are in an extremely dangerous time now with the civilized world dealing with the absolute worst enemy humans can face, unrealized internal treasonous saboteurs that are undermining and poisoning and polluting the civilized world to undermine it and make it collapse under its own weight. We don't even realize it, like most hegemons throughout history, that the western, civilized, white world is in a world war, a new technology war a war of the information and emotional manipulation age that is an outcropping and expansion of psychological warfare. If America, let alone Europe and the western valued societies in general, do not wake up soon, they will simply collapse once the facade and defensive walls simply cannot even hold themselves up and will collapse under their own wight as their foundations have been thoroughly undermined.

WhompingWindows 9y ago

Ignoring the fact that there are far more than left/right in the real world, I take issue with the equivalency you're making between Right and Left in the USA. While both sides have many pet issues and wedge issues that are divisive and bad for democracy, the right is denying scientific truth and actively contradicting its extreme budget-hawkishness under the previous president. While the left is bought quite a bit, the right is even more bought by the Kochs, big business, and wealthy donors. Look at the only accomplishment of the right coalition: a major tax cut that expires quickly for everyone except the rich, who receive a massive win in perpetuity. If you look globally, we don't have a Right/Left in the USA, we have an EXTREME right in power and a moderate left in minority. The GOP is the only party in the world whose stance is that climate change is a hoax. We withdrew from the Paris accord while Syria and North Korea have joined it. That is despicably anti-scientific. If you compare Obama's middle of the road left-ism to Trump's extreme right stances, its quite shocking. There can be no false equivalence between the R and L in this country, one is evidently far more extreme.

throwaway7312 9y ago
It's extraordinarily worrying to me that the American Left uses 'science' as a shield for its ideological positions and the adherents of its ideology lap it up and repeat it. I don't care so much about the ideological positions. What I care about is the constant, systemic undermining of science. Take your comment, for instance. You throw about the notion of 'scientific truth', as if this is even a thing. Science does not deal in truth. Truth is for the priests and the philosophers. This 'Temple of Science' American Leftists have attempted to create, where all beliefs of the American Left (like climate change, organic food, socialism, tabula rasa, and Boasian anthropology) are enshrined as 'Science', unassailable to criticism (criticizing them means you are 'not educated' or 'don't understand science') regardless the flimsiness of the papers published to support those positions, makes science a partisan field. The American Right has been trained to hate and distrust science. They hate it. They think scientists are all frauds. Why? Because 'scientists', they are told, again and again, support all these Leftist ideological bents that are not science, and that those on the Right know, at some level, are not science. Anthropogenic global warming, as an example, is utter nonsense. Without NOAA, NASA, and GHCN doing heavy manipulation of the raw data before the thousands of scientists who work on it ever see that data, you don't have climate change.[1] Without concealing historical sea ice data, these agencies don't have anything abnormal to report on that front.[2] Right now, you have a situation in America where a bunch of zealots have claimed science as their own, to push their decidedly non-scientific, partisan ideologies... and the other bunch of zealots on the other side of the aisle have disclaimed science as full of shills and charlatans hoaxing the public for tax dollars. I don't know if you actually care about science. I suspect you don't - otherwise you wouldn't be using 'scientific truth' (no such thing) as a shield for your ideology. But I do, and frankly, when I see one side of the most powerful nation on Earth using science as its meat shield and the other side concomitantly coming to view science with hostility and suspicion, when science used to be an apolitical source of wonderment for people from all ideological backgrounds in that same country half a century ago, I am deeply afraid for the future of real scientific investigation. [1] https://realclimatescience.com/100-of-us-warming-is-due-to-noaa-data-tampering/ https://realclimatescience.com/100-of-us-warming-is-due-to-n... [2] https://realclimatescience.com/government-arctic-sea-ice-fraud/ https://realclimatescience.com/government-arctic-sea-ice-fra...

alistairSH 9y ago

Citations please? Preferably from sources located near the middle of this diagram.[1] 1 - https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2016/12/15/Photos/NS/MW-FC101_news_20161215131112_NS.jpg https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2016/12/15/Photos/NS/M...