4 ms·

I wonder if we can gain any insights from experiences with airplane autopilots.

greenyoda 9y ago
Airplane autopilots operate in a completely different environment, in which planes' flight paths are set and monitored by Air Traffic Control. A plane on autopilot would never have to dodge a pedestrian, and would be separated from other planes by thousands of feet.
- akira2501 9y ago
  > in which planes' flight paths are set They're 'set' in the sense that if communications is lost between the pilot and ATC, there's a pre-determined and more importantly pre-authorized path for the aircraft to fly through. > A plane on autopilot would never have to dodge a pedestrian It happens quite a bit, which is why we invented TCAS. [1] A common misconception is that _all_ traffic is required to file a flight plan, and that's only true for IFR (instrument) traffic and not for VFR (visual) traffic. So, an IFR flight can, and will, encouter VFR flights that interfere with their flight. > and would be separated from other planes by thousands of feet. In certain situations, in transit regions and during clearance/delivery, this is not true. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_collision_avoidance_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_collision_avoidance_sy...
  - shanghaiaway 9y ago
    An airplane has never had to dodge a pedestrian.
    - jlgaddis 9y ago
      Since you said "never", I'll just mention that there are videos on Youtube from skydivers who would disagree with you.
      - c22 9y ago
        Are skydivers really pedestrians though?
        jlgaddis 9y ago
        If skydivers aren't pedestrians, then what exactly would be considered a pedestrian in the sky?
        c22 9y ago
        Skydiver on a treadmill maybe? Not all words have to make sense next to eachother.
    - MertsA 9y ago
      Au contraire. https://flightsafety.org/runway-incursions-down/ https://flightsafety.org/runway-incursions-down/ But realistically it's not like all flights could be done completely on autopilot. It's not uncommon for a flight plan to change due to delays at an airport.
  - greenyoda 9y ago
    But it's not the autopilot that's taking evasive action, as would be the case in a self driving car. TCAS merely advises the pilot that there's traffic that's too close, and instructs the pilot to take evasive action (climb, descend, etc.).
stordoff 9y ago
As I understand it, even if an autopilot drops out completely and without, you have a reasonable amount of time to take back over -- worst case scenario you just glide, and you have a reasonable separation from anything else in the skies. With a car, if you go even 5 seconds without control, there is a good chance you'll have hit something. It's a very different environment and constraints.
- NickNameNick 9y ago
  Unfortunately, the situation there isn't as good as it should be. It isn't always clear which autopilot mode the aircraft is in, and the Pilots no longer get enough flight hours in the degraded modes. This contributed significantly to the Air France 447 crash in 2009. see: https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magenta-automation-paradox-pt-1/ https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magen... and more broadly https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN41LvuSz10 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN41LvuSz10

Airplane autopilots operate in a completely different environment, in which planes' flight paths are set and monitored by Air Traffic Control. A plane on autopilot would never have to dodge a pedestrian, and would be separated from other planes by thousands of feet.

akira2501 9y ago
> in which planes' flight paths are set They're 'set' in the sense that if communications is lost between the pilot and ATC, there's a pre-determined and more importantly pre-authorized path for the aircraft to fly through. > A plane on autopilot would never have to dodge a pedestrian It happens quite a bit, which is why we invented TCAS. [1] A common misconception is that _all_ traffic is required to file a flight plan, and that's only true for IFR (instrument) traffic and not for VFR (visual) traffic. So, an IFR flight can, and will, encouter VFR flights that interfere with their flight. > and would be separated from other planes by thousands of feet. In certain situations, in transit regions and during clearance/delivery, this is not true. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_collision_avoidance_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_collision_avoidance_sy...
- shanghaiaway 9y ago
  An airplane has never had to dodge a pedestrian.
  - jlgaddis 9y ago
    Since you said "never", I'll just mention that there are videos on Youtube from skydivers who would disagree with you.
    - c22 9y ago
      Are skydivers really pedestrians though?
      - jlgaddis 9y ago
        If skydivers aren't pedestrians, then what exactly would be considered a pedestrian in the sky?
        c22 9y ago
        Skydiver on a treadmill maybe? Not all words have to make sense next to eachother.
  - MertsA 9y ago
    Au contraire. https://flightsafety.org/runway-incursions-down/ https://flightsafety.org/runway-incursions-down/ But realistically it's not like all flights could be done completely on autopilot. It's not uncommon for a flight plan to change due to delays at an airport.
- greenyoda 9y ago
  But it's not the autopilot that's taking evasive action, as would be the case in a self driving car. TCAS merely advises the pilot that there's traffic that's too close, and instructs the pilot to take evasive action (climb, descend, etc.).

stordoff 9y ago

As I understand it, even if an autopilot drops out completely and without, you have a reasonable amount of time to take back over -- worst case scenario you just glide, and you have a reasonable separation from anything else in the skies. With a car, if you go even 5 seconds without control, there is a good chance you'll have hit something. It's a very different environment and constraints.

NickNameNick 9y ago
Unfortunately, the situation there isn't as good as it should be. It isn't always clear which autopilot mode the aircraft is in, and the Pilots no longer get enough flight hours in the degraded modes. This contributed significantly to the Air France 447 crash in 2009. see: https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magenta-automation-paradox-pt-1/ https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magen... and more broadly https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN41LvuSz10 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN41LvuSz10