4 ms·

The path into the barrier looks a lot like a lane. https://imgur.com/a/iMY1x https://imgur.com/a/iMY1x And the old striping is lightly visible as well.

dixie_land 9y ago
looks like that would trick a human driver under certain lighting conditions. between Seattle and Bellevue a stretch of freeway looks just like that and trips me over every time
- cesarb 9y ago
  Either the same place or a nearby one (same pair of highways) did trick a human driver two years ago: https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/HAR1701.pdf https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/... "[...] when it entered and traveled in an unmarked gore area, rather than the intended high-occupancy-vehicle (HOV) lane, and collided with a crash attenuator. The 990-foot-long gore, with an unmarked inside area, separates the left exit HOV lane for State Route 85 from the US-101 HOV lane."
  - pacificmint 9y ago
    Not the same place nor nearby. From the picture on page 24 it's clear that this is the 85/101 interchange in south San Jose, about 20 miles away from the other 85/101 junction where the Tesla accident happened. The type of accident does seems comparable though.
- taneq 9y ago
  From the article, it sounds like people crash pretty regularly in exactly that spot.
r00fus 9y ago
I'm amazed that the barrier doesn't have yellow reflective striping or any of those sand barrel thingies.
- Symmetry 9y ago
  The barrier does have a crumpling structure but someone else had collided with it shortly before the Tesla crash and it hadn't been replaced yet.
  - r00fus 9y ago
    Investigating further, it looks like that barrier had been down for over 7+ days (they say due to weather) [1]. Looking at the image and estimating the traffic flowing, it's simply amazing that CalTrans is allowed to take a week to fix such things. How long does it take to put up some sand barrels? This situation was made more dangerous because while many such barriers are used in freeway exits, the left lane speeds can be much higher. 7 days + weather is a long time to fix (some states require 3 days). I get the feeling that Tesla/Waymo and other SDC manufacturers will be more proactive in reporting unsafe conditions as a priority to fix. Such a partnership could improve safety for everyone. [1] http://abc7news.com/automotive/exclusive-i-team-investigates-why-caltrans-didnt-fix-safety-barrier-before-tesla-driver-died-there/3280399/ http://abc7news.com/automotive/exclusive-i-team-investigates...
Robotbeat 9y ago
That's crazy bad. This XKCD comes to mind: https://xkcd.com/1958/ https://xkcd.com/1958/ It's like they painted traffic lines to guide vehicles into barriers, and then didn't replace the attenuator after a human driver made the same mistake as the Tesla autopilot did a week later. https://techcrunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/screen-shot-2018-03-27-at-7-51-49-pm.png https://techcrunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/screen-sho...
enimodas 9y ago
Is it an USA thing to not have road hatchings?
Asooka 9y ago
But it's a solid white line, so you can't cross it anyway. Unless there's a place where the line is dashed earlier on, there's no way you can enter that "lane".
FLUX-YOU 9y ago
Relying on painting quality and accuracy is going to hurt autopilot systems. Cities and car companies aren't prepared to work together to solve that and there probably isn't an fast and easy solution to it.
petilon 9y ago
Would a LIDAR have correctly identified the barrier? Maybe Elon should rethink LIDARs. https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/7/16988628/elon-musk-lidar-self-driving-car-tesla https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/7/16988628/elon-musk-lidar-s...
animex 9y ago
So all prankster would have to do is curve a lane line into a wall and game over?

dixie_land 9y ago

looks like that would trick a human driver under certain lighting conditions. between Seattle and Bellevue a stretch of freeway looks just like that and trips me over every time

cesarb 9y ago
Either the same place or a nearby one (same pair of highways) did trick a human driver two years ago: https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/HAR1701.pdf https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/... "[...] when it entered and traveled in an unmarked gore area, rather than the intended high-occupancy-vehicle (HOV) lane, and collided with a crash attenuator. The 990-foot-long gore, with an unmarked inside area, separates the left exit HOV lane for State Route 85 from the US-101 HOV lane."
- pacificmint 9y ago
  Not the same place nor nearby. From the picture on page 24 it's clear that this is the 85/101 interchange in south San Jose, about 20 miles away from the other 85/101 junction where the Tesla accident happened. The type of accident does seems comparable though.
taneq 9y ago
From the article, it sounds like people crash pretty regularly in exactly that spot.

r00fus 9y ago

I'm amazed that the barrier doesn't have yellow reflective striping or any of those sand barrel thingies.

Symmetry 9y ago
The barrier does have a crumpling structure but someone else had collided with it shortly before the Tesla crash and it hadn't been replaced yet.
- r00fus 9y ago
  Investigating further, it looks like that barrier had been down for over 7+ days (they say due to weather) [1]. Looking at the image and estimating the traffic flowing, it's simply amazing that CalTrans is allowed to take a week to fix such things. How long does it take to put up some sand barrels? This situation was made more dangerous because while many such barriers are used in freeway exits, the left lane speeds can be much higher. 7 days + weather is a long time to fix (some states require 3 days). I get the feeling that Tesla/Waymo and other SDC manufacturers will be more proactive in reporting unsafe conditions as a priority to fix. Such a partnership could improve safety for everyone. [1] http://abc7news.com/automotive/exclusive-i-team-investigates-why-caltrans-didnt-fix-safety-barrier-before-tesla-driver-died-there/3280399/ http://abc7news.com/automotive/exclusive-i-team-investigates...

Robotbeat 9y ago

That's crazy bad. This XKCD comes to mind: https://xkcd.com/1958/ https://xkcd.com/1958/ It's like they painted traffic lines to guide vehicles into barriers, and then didn't replace the attenuator after a human driver made the same mistake as the Tesla autopilot did a week later. https://techcrunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/screen-shot-2018-03-27-at-7-51-49-pm.png https://techcrunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/screen-sho...

enimodas 9y ago

Is it an USA thing to not have road hatchings?

Asooka 9y ago

But it's a solid white line, so you can't cross it anyway. Unless there's a place where the line is dashed earlier on, there's no way you can enter that "lane".

FLUX-YOU 9y ago

Relying on painting quality and accuracy is going to hurt autopilot systems. Cities and car companies aren't prepared to work together to solve that and there probably isn't an fast and easy solution to it.

petilon 9y ago

Would a LIDAR have correctly identified the barrier? Maybe Elon should rethink LIDARs. https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/7/16988628/elon-musk-lidar-self-driving-car-tesla https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/7/16988628/elon-musk-lidar-s...

animex 9y ago

So all prankster would have to do is curve a lane line into a wall and game over?