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I was wondering the same thing. Some of these cases seem so brazen, like Carl Icahn dumping $30M of his steel-related stocks before Trump announced tariffs on s

by choxi 9y ago

I was wondering the same thing. Some of these cases seem so brazen, like Carl Icahn dumping $30M of his steel-related stocks before Trump announced tariffs on steel. To me it seems so obvious that he had insider information, but he's not an idiot and he wouldn't do it unless he was pretty confident he could get away with it. Am I missing some nuance of insider trading law, or is it just that easy to get away with it? - http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/article/why-insider-trading-is-hard-to-define-prove-and-prevent/ http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/article/why-insider-tradi... - http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20141210/NEWS04/141219974/insider-trading-cases-just-got-harder-to-prove http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20141210/NEWS04/14121... - https://thinkprogress.org/carl-icahn-insider-trading-2bbd9561f9e6/ https://thinkprogress.org/carl-icahn-insider-trading-2bbd956...

nfriedly 9y ago
> Am I missing some nuance of insider trading law, or is it just that easy to get away with it? I get the feeling that illegal insider trading is kind of like speeding: it happens all the time and people get caught and fine for it occasionally.
- smsm42 9y ago
  I'd rather compare it to doing hard drugs. Everybody knows a lot of high-profile people do it and rarely get prosecuted, though theoretically it's a felony.
sseveran 9y ago
Well for one you would have to show that Carl knew that the tariffs were coming. Otherwise he started selling the stock within a couple of days of earnings when the stock had already experienced a pretty large price drop. Unless there was proof that he knew and used that to trade it would be a pretty hard case to bring. Mark Cuban was found not guilty of something similar. https://www.thestreet.com/quote/MTW.html https://www.thestreet.com/quote/MTW.html https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-sec-cuban-verdict/billionaire-mark-cuban-cleared-of-insider-trading-blasts-u-s-government-idUSBRE99F0ZM20131016 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-sec-cuban-verdict/bil...
s73v3r_ 9y ago
"but he's not an idiot and he wouldn't do it unless he was pretty confident he could get away with it." The SEC, and the Justice Dept in general, has been losing their teeth with regards to white collar crime for quite a while, really ever since Arthur Andersen and Enron.

by choxi 9y ago

nfriedly 9y ago

> Am I missing some nuance of insider trading law, or is it just that easy to get away with it? I get the feeling that illegal insider trading is kind of like speeding: it happens all the time and people get caught and fine for it occasionally.

smsm42 9y ago
I'd rather compare it to doing hard drugs. Everybody knows a lot of high-profile people do it and rarely get prosecuted, though theoretically it's a felony.

sseveran 9y ago

Well for one you would have to show that Carl knew that the tariffs were coming. Otherwise he started selling the stock within a couple of days of earnings when the stock had already experienced a pretty large price drop. Unless there was proof that he knew and used that to trade it would be a pretty hard case to bring. Mark Cuban was found not guilty of something similar. https://www.thestreet.com/quote/MTW.html https://www.thestreet.com/quote/MTW.html https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-sec-cuban-verdict/billionaire-mark-cuban-cleared-of-insider-trading-blasts-u-s-government-idUSBRE99F0ZM20131016 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-sec-cuban-verdict/bil...

s73v3r_ 9y ago

"but he's not an idiot and he wouldn't do it unless he was pretty confident he could get away with it." The SEC, and the Justice Dept in general, has been losing their teeth with regards to white collar crime for quite a while, really ever since Arthur Andersen and Enron.