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> we developers are stuck No, only a subset is "stuck" not using the most fancy and shiniest. Janestreet seems to be interested in this particular subset. May

> we developers are stuck No, only a subset is "stuck" not using the most fancy and shiniest. Janestreet seems to be interested in this particular subset. Maybe they found a correlation between robustness and efficiency, and not fooling around with tooling for the sake of optics too much. After all, finding correlations is what they do. If you want to argue "behind times," argue inefficiency, but I think you will come up short on arguments. Not only do they get to have an efficient workflow, they also get to weed out developers whose opinions would make for a poor fit naturally.

pavlov 9y ago
> they also get to weed out developers whose opinions would make for a poor fit Wow, that's aggressive. Such a policy would "weed out" people like Alan Kay or Bret Victor over a trivial difference in opinion about UI efficiency. Are you sure creating a monoculture of thought around this single issue makes sense for a company?
- craigsmansion 9y ago
  For Janestreet? Definitely. If you do Ocaml, you do emacs, if you do emacs, you do GNU (or some other sane unix). Anything else means you're stealing your own or company time. > a trivial difference in opinion about UI efficiency. That's one way to look at it. Another is that the quest for UI efficiency is a timesink and an upgrade threadmill susceptible to fashions. The counter to that is to learn it once, learn it well, and be done with it for the rest of your career. Emacs fits that profile just about perfectly.
  - pavlov 9y ago
    Like I said: an unfortunate local maximum that works but hinders progress.
    - craigsmansion 9y ago
      That's not a refutation or argument but just restating your opinion in a pejorative way. Just drop it.
- 0x445442 9y ago
  Not sure about Victor but Smalltalk is highly influenced by the LISP machine. I'm not sure Kay is as against Emacs as you might think.

pavlov 9y ago

> they also get to weed out developers whose opinions would make for a poor fit Wow, that's aggressive. Such a policy would "weed out" people like Alan Kay or Bret Victor over a trivial difference in opinion about UI efficiency. Are you sure creating a monoculture of thought around this single issue makes sense for a company?

craigsmansion 9y ago
For Janestreet? Definitely. If you do Ocaml, you do emacs, if you do emacs, you do GNU (or some other sane unix). Anything else means you're stealing your own or company time. > a trivial difference in opinion about UI efficiency. That's one way to look at it. Another is that the quest for UI efficiency is a timesink and an upgrade threadmill susceptible to fashions. The counter to that is to learn it once, learn it well, and be done with it for the rest of your career. Emacs fits that profile just about perfectly.
- pavlov 9y ago
  Like I said: an unfortunate local maximum that works but hinders progress.
  - craigsmansion 9y ago
    That's not a refutation or argument but just restating your opinion in a pejorative way. Just drop it.
0x445442 9y ago
Not sure about Victor but Smalltalk is highly influenced by the LISP machine. I'm not sure Kay is as against Emacs as you might think.