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I do not believe with the current administration and Jeff Sessions as Attorney General - who seems particularly anti-marijuana - that this has any chance of suc

by blunte 9y ago

I do not believe with the current administration and Jeff Sessions as Attorney General - who seems particularly anti-marijuana - that this has any chance of success. Of course hemp is not marijuana, but that has not stopped the DEA from making every effort to make them synonymous. The DEA has gone so far as to create rules that are not based on US laws, and in fact are counter to US federal laws in an effort to restrict hemp. This is gotten them a slap on the wrist at least once by federal court. Hemp is a fantastic plant with many unique and important uses. One has to wonder why the US has, since the 1930s I believe, been so against it. One might suspect the pharmaceutical industry has a vested interest in seeing hemp (and its naughty cousin, marijuana) banned since there are health products with documented human benefits that compare more favorably to some drugs made by companies. One might also suspect the private prison industry whose growth has swelled under drug policies instituted in the 1980 which dramatically increased the populations of people locked up for minor drug offenses. In short, this is nice to hear about, but it is more likely to be a show piece for McConnell to please his Kentucky constituents with.

JumpCrisscross 9y ago
> Jeff Sessions Do we know Scott Pruitt's [1] position on cannabis? [1] http://thehill.com/news/administration/367628-politico-pruitt-wants-to-be-trumps-attorney-general http://thehill.com/news/administration/367628-politico-pruit...
toomanybeersies 9y ago
My stoner brother has some conspiracy that the timber and cotton industries are behind the demonisation of hemp. Apparently because hemp can be made into paper and fabric it would put the timber and cotton industries under threat. I never cared enough to look into it, but it wouldn't surprise me if industry lobbying is part of the reason for the suppression of hemp. I don't put too much credence in it though, because hemp is legal to grow in other countries, and it hasn't decimated the timber and cotton industries.
- dEnigma 9y ago
  Not saying your brother's theory is right, but just because something isn't a real treat doesn't mean it can't be perceived as a threat (and consequently be lobbied against)
- take_5 9y ago
  My old man worked for DuPont for years and his theory was that they lobbied against hemp because of the competition to the then newly devolved nylon.
  - MDib 9y ago
    Here's [1] a good rundown of the conspiracy. To wit, it's a conspiracy of two: DuPont wanting to outlaw hemp which could have provided an alternative to Nylon, and Hearst which was heavily invested in wood-pulping machinery for paper production, again for which hemp was a good alternative. 1. https://www.alternet.org/story/77339/debunking_the_hemp_conspiracy_theory https://www.alternet.org/story/77339/debunking_the_hemp_cons...
    - code_duck 9y ago
      I have trouble with that article due to the tone. There’s no reason to refer to people as ‘potheads’ or mention Jerry Garcia with bitterness and disdain, or at all. It seems the author has an axe to grind with the remnants of 60s culture.
- maxerickson 9y ago
  Pulpwood is usually the worst market for wood. It takes lower quality wood than other end users, so it is an important market. But pulpwood might sell for $15 a ton while a single high grade log weighing less than a ton might sell for hundreds of dollars. Losing the pulpwood market would mean that the cost mix would shift for other timber products but it wouldn't threaten the industry. I'm not sure that a good, cheap process for turning hemp into paper would be that much of a threat to the pulpwood paper makers. Hemp prices can only go so low before farmers won't plant it. An awful lot of pulp wood isn't competing with corn (and any other agricultural commodity) for space to grow. edit: Here's some global production statistics that back up paper being an important market for wood but not critical: http://www.fao.org/forestry/statistics/80938/en/ http://www.fao.org/forestry/statistics/80938/en/
zavi 9y ago
Jeff Sessions is irrelevant when it comes to passing laws.
derekp7 9y ago
I thought it was because MJ could be grown hidden in a hemp field, making identification harder.
- blunte 9y ago
  If you grow hemp anywhere near marijuana, it will greatly reduce the quality of the output of the marijauna. So hiding mj in a hemp field is pointless. https://www.marijuanaventure.com/will-hemp-farms-ruin-cannabis-crops/ https://www.marijuanaventure.com/will-hemp-farms-ruin-cannab...
fwgwgwgch 9y ago
> current administration Source? Trump hasn't said a thing against hemp and sessions has no say, he's "only" the "head of law enforcement."
- blunte 9y ago
  For years the DEA (which is part of the Executive Branch) has intentionally conflated hemp with marijuana, despite the clear scientific evidence of hemp being very low in THC content compared to marijuana. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/4/16849866/marijuana-legalization-trump-sessions-cole-memo https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/4/16849866/ma... https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-other-cannabis-war-20140603 https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-other-cannabi...
  - fwgwgwgch 9y ago
    Informative but "current administration" != "for years"
Mediterraneo10 9y ago
> Hemp is a fantastic plant with many unique and important uses. One has to wonder why the US has, since the 1930s I believe, been so against it. One might suspect the pharmaceutical industry has a vested interest in seeing hemp (and its naughty cousin, marijuana) banned Many countries around the world do not have the same restrictions on hemp industrial production that the USA does, and yet, hemp isn't all that widely used and other sources for materials are often preferred instead. I suspect a lot of the praise of hemp as some kind of miracle material comes from those who just want legal marijuana and they’ll say anything to get it, not people who particularly care about industrial manufacturing.
- PeterisP 9y ago
  Yeah, an acquaintance runs a farm that also has fields of hemp, and it's no miracle - it's used in quite a few industries in preference to other materials, but it's not that dominant. As far as I recall, their harvest was shipped for making cigarette paper and hemp textiles; both of which are interesting but ultimately just niche use cases.
  - code_duck 9y ago
    For both of those ‘niche’ use cases, paper and cloth, hemp was the dominant material used for many centuries prior to the last century.
- morsch 9y ago
  I think that's a reasonable point to make. At the same time, I wouldn't underestimate the worldwide effects a ban in the US had, given its importance as a consumer of world goods especially in the second half of the 20th century. And while industrial hemp wasn't banned worldwide, it was banned or curtailed in other countries for prolonged periods (e.g. Germany from 82 to 95). Hemp production seems to be around 0.25% of cotton production. No matter the intrinsic properties of the material, that seems like a very difficult lead to catch up to. And I'm sure both are getting squeezed by synthetic fibers (cotton consumption seems to be fairly stable for years). Hemp: 65kt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#Producers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#Producers Cotton: 25mt https://www.icac.org/Press-Release/2018-(1)/PR-5-2018-Global-Cotton-Consumption-Expected-to-Gr https://www.icac.org/Press-Release/2018-(1)/PR-5-2018-Global... Synthetic fibers: 65mt https://www.statista.com/statistics/741368/world-synthetic-fiber-production/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/741368/world-synthetic-f... Wool: around 1mt
ryanmarsh 9y ago
There are many in the Trump tea leave reading community that believe this is actually a first step towards legalization and they’re testing the waters. I don’t have an opinion on this just thought I’d share. I doubt most of HN lurks on said boards.
- dfxm12 9y ago
  The first step in legalizing marijuana federally is removing hemp from the controlled substance list? That makes no sense, given that smoking hemp isn't going to get you high and how many states have already legalized marijuana, either medicinally or medically to great public approval (the waters have already been tested, and they're fine). It also makes no sense given that less than 3 months ago, Sessions rescinded the policy of non-interference with state laws. I mean, I'm sure people believe that, but I'm just saying, it doesn't really follow...
- _emacsomancer_ 9y ago
  > Trump tea leave reading community Typo or clever pun?
rayiner 9y ago
Your second conjecture is wrong (the private prison industry barely existed when those drug policies were instituted; they are an effect rather than a cause of the drug war). That doesn’t give me much faith in your first conjecture.
- creaghpatr 9y ago
  Yet you cite a correlation as proof of causation?
  - rayiner 9y ago
    No, I’m citing chronology as evidence of non-causation. (A happened before the thing OP asserted caused A to happen.)
Shivetya 9y ago
I would expect that if Congress changes the law that the Sessions has no choice in the matter. That is after all the point of Congress, to change the law.
ataturk 9y ago
The politics of cotton are likely to blame for hemp getting such treatment. The drug war may just be a convenient explanation. It's about lobbying dollars and farm aid. Hemp became a hippie cause in the '90s when college kids were searching for anything alternative to rally behind and it was a possible way to help get pot legalized. I've read all the propaganda about hemp. I'm not convinced it is truly a miracle plant that we can't live without. I think it has some interesting possible applications but that the main one, making rope, is long finished since synthetics are superior. Hemp clothing is fairly uncomfortable, I don't think that's making a comeback.
avisser 9y ago
> Of course hemp is not marijuana I think I know what you mean, but cannabis sativa is both hemp and marijuana. The US gov't just defines the distinction via THC content.
bassman9000 9y ago
If approved, the act would allow states to control their own hemp regulations by removing federal restrictions.

by blunte 9y ago

JumpCrisscross 9y ago

> Jeff Sessions Do we know Scott Pruitt's [1] position on cannabis? [1] http://thehill.com/news/administration/367628-politico-pruitt-wants-to-be-trumps-attorney-general http://thehill.com/news/administration/367628-politico-pruit...

toomanybeersies 9y ago

My stoner brother has some conspiracy that the timber and cotton industries are behind the demonisation of hemp. Apparently because hemp can be made into paper and fabric it would put the timber and cotton industries under threat. I never cared enough to look into it, but it wouldn't surprise me if industry lobbying is part of the reason for the suppression of hemp. I don't put too much credence in it though, because hemp is legal to grow in other countries, and it hasn't decimated the timber and cotton industries.

dEnigma 9y ago
Not saying your brother's theory is right, but just because something isn't a real treat doesn't mean it can't be perceived as a threat (and consequently be lobbied against)
take_5 9y ago
My old man worked for DuPont for years and his theory was that they lobbied against hemp because of the competition to the then newly devolved nylon.
- MDib 9y ago
  Here's [1] a good rundown of the conspiracy. To wit, it's a conspiracy of two: DuPont wanting to outlaw hemp which could have provided an alternative to Nylon, and Hearst which was heavily invested in wood-pulping machinery for paper production, again for which hemp was a good alternative. 1. https://www.alternet.org/story/77339/debunking_the_hemp_conspiracy_theory https://www.alternet.org/story/77339/debunking_the_hemp_cons...
  - code_duck 9y ago
    I have trouble with that article due to the tone. There’s no reason to refer to people as ‘potheads’ or mention Jerry Garcia with bitterness and disdain, or at all. It seems the author has an axe to grind with the remnants of 60s culture.
maxerickson 9y ago
Pulpwood is usually the worst market for wood. It takes lower quality wood than other end users, so it is an important market. But pulpwood might sell for $15 a ton while a single high grade log weighing less than a ton might sell for hundreds of dollars. Losing the pulpwood market would mean that the cost mix would shift for other timber products but it wouldn't threaten the industry. I'm not sure that a good, cheap process for turning hemp into paper would be that much of a threat to the pulpwood paper makers. Hemp prices can only go so low before farmers won't plant it. An awful lot of pulp wood isn't competing with corn (and any other agricultural commodity) for space to grow. edit: Here's some global production statistics that back up paper being an important market for wood but not critical: http://www.fao.org/forestry/statistics/80938/en/ http://www.fao.org/forestry/statistics/80938/en/

zavi 9y ago

Jeff Sessions is irrelevant when it comes to passing laws.

derekp7 9y ago

I thought it was because MJ could be grown hidden in a hemp field, making identification harder.

blunte 9y ago
If you grow hemp anywhere near marijuana, it will greatly reduce the quality of the output of the marijauna. So hiding mj in a hemp field is pointless. https://www.marijuanaventure.com/will-hemp-farms-ruin-cannabis-crops/ https://www.marijuanaventure.com/will-hemp-farms-ruin-cannab...

fwgwgwgch 9y ago

> current administration Source? Trump hasn't said a thing against hemp and sessions has no say, he's "only" the "head of law enforcement."

blunte 9y ago
For years the DEA (which is part of the Executive Branch) has intentionally conflated hemp with marijuana, despite the clear scientific evidence of hemp being very low in THC content compared to marijuana. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/4/16849866/marijuana-legalization-trump-sessions-cole-memo https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/4/16849866/ma... https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-other-cannabis-war-20140603 https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-other-cannabi...
- fwgwgwgch 9y ago
  Informative but "current administration" != "for years"

Mediterraneo10 9y ago

> Hemp is a fantastic plant with many unique and important uses. One has to wonder why the US has, since the 1930s I believe, been so against it. One might suspect the pharmaceutical industry has a vested interest in seeing hemp (and its naughty cousin, marijuana) banned Many countries around the world do not have the same restrictions on hemp industrial production that the USA does, and yet, hemp isn't all that widely used and other sources for materials are often preferred instead. I suspect a lot of the praise of hemp as some kind of miracle material comes from those who just want legal marijuana and they’ll say anything to get it, not people who particularly care about industrial manufacturing.

PeterisP 9y ago
Yeah, an acquaintance runs a farm that also has fields of hemp, and it's no miracle - it's used in quite a few industries in preference to other materials, but it's not that dominant. As far as I recall, their harvest was shipped for making cigarette paper and hemp textiles; both of which are interesting but ultimately just niche use cases.
- code_duck 9y ago
  For both of those ‘niche’ use cases, paper and cloth, hemp was the dominant material used for many centuries prior to the last century.
morsch 9y ago
I think that's a reasonable point to make. At the same time, I wouldn't underestimate the worldwide effects a ban in the US had, given its importance as a consumer of world goods especially in the second half of the 20th century. And while industrial hemp wasn't banned worldwide, it was banned or curtailed in other countries for prolonged periods (e.g. Germany from 82 to 95). Hemp production seems to be around 0.25% of cotton production. No matter the intrinsic properties of the material, that seems like a very difficult lead to catch up to. And I'm sure both are getting squeezed by synthetic fibers (cotton consumption seems to be fairly stable for years). Hemp: 65kt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#Producers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#Producers Cotton: 25mt https://www.icac.org/Press-Release/2018-(1)/PR-5-2018-Global-Cotton-Consumption-Expected-to-Gr https://www.icac.org/Press-Release/2018-(1)/PR-5-2018-Global... Synthetic fibers: 65mt https://www.statista.com/statistics/741368/world-synthetic-fiber-production/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/741368/world-synthetic-f... Wool: around 1mt

ryanmarsh 9y ago

There are many in the Trump tea leave reading community that believe this is actually a first step towards legalization and they’re testing the waters. I don’t have an opinion on this just thought I’d share. I doubt most of HN lurks on said boards.

dfxm12 9y ago
The first step in legalizing marijuana federally is removing hemp from the controlled substance list? That makes no sense, given that smoking hemp isn't going to get you high and how many states have already legalized marijuana, either medicinally or medically to great public approval (the waters have already been tested, and they're fine). It also makes no sense given that less than 3 months ago, Sessions rescinded the policy of non-interference with state laws. I mean, I'm sure people believe that, but I'm just saying, it doesn't really follow...
_emacsomancer_ 9y ago
> Trump tea leave reading community Typo or clever pun?

rayiner 9y ago

Your second conjecture is wrong (the private prison industry barely existed when those drug policies were instituted; they are an effect rather than a cause of the drug war). That doesn’t give me much faith in your first conjecture.

creaghpatr 9y ago
Yet you cite a correlation as proof of causation?
- rayiner 9y ago
  No, I’m citing chronology as evidence of non-causation. (A happened before the thing OP asserted caused A to happen.)

Shivetya 9y ago

I would expect that if Congress changes the law that the Sessions has no choice in the matter. That is after all the point of Congress, to change the law.

ataturk 9y ago

The politics of cotton are likely to blame for hemp getting such treatment. The drug war may just be a convenient explanation. It's about lobbying dollars and farm aid. Hemp became a hippie cause in the '90s when college kids were searching for anything alternative to rally behind and it was a possible way to help get pot legalized. I've read all the propaganda about hemp. I'm not convinced it is truly a miracle plant that we can't live without. I think it has some interesting possible applications but that the main one, making rope, is long finished since synthetics are superior. Hemp clothing is fairly uncomfortable, I don't think that's making a comeback.

avisser 9y ago

> Of course hemp is not marijuana I think I know what you mean, but cannabis sativa is both hemp and marijuana. The US gov't just defines the distinction via THC content.

bassman9000 9y ago

If approved, the act would allow states to control their own hemp regulations by removing federal restrictions.